Capn12 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 No idea how anyone can still look at this roster, and find anything redeeming at all....or anything that would make them think "Hey, we can still win games". No....no they can't. You can't magically become a winning team, with this lineup. Not with 1 guy over 800 OPS, no real game plan formulated for every pitcher you're facing, etc. This thing has gone rotten, from the top down, and 'having faith things will change' ain't the way to right this ship. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkness99 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 who knew that hitting groundballs and not taking walks was a recipe for bad offense? gee what a shocker. Hate this shitty ass organization... until the owner is gone nothing going to matter. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 Just now, Capn12 said: No idea how anyone can still look at this roster, and find anything redeeming at all....or anything that would make them think "Hey, we can still win games". No....no they can't. You can't magically become a winning team, with this lineup. Not with 1 guy over 800 OPS, no real game plan formulated for every pitcher you're facing, etc. This thing has gone rotten, from the top down, and 'having faith things will change' ain't the way to right this ship. I really wonder most days if they even have advanced scouts. They seem to have no clue about their opponents. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brijames1957 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 There are a lot of teams in contention for playoff spots this year. There will be a huge demand for any kind of quality pitching. Giolito, Graveman, Lynn, Kelly could all bring a nice return. The big problem however is that RH would be negotiating the trades. You have to fire him within the next couple weeks and bring in Theo Epstein as the GM. 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vote4Pedro Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 45 minutes ago, wegner said: I told my brother if we trade him now we are selling awfully low and his answer to that was "who cares" My thoughts exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 4 minutes ago, wegner said: I really wonder most days if they even have advanced scouts. They seem to have no clue about their opponents. I posted after the first, watching their approaches, I thought 2 runs was the max tonight, but was really thinking 0 or 1. Eloy had a good game, and Benitendi did as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 3 minutes ago, brijames1957 said: There are a lot of teams in contention for playoff spots this year. There will be a huge demand for any kind of quality pitching. Giolito, Graveman, Lynn, Kelly could all bring a nice return. The big problem however is that RH would be negotiating the trades. You have to fire him within the next couple weeks and bring in Theo Epstein as the GM. No way on Theo. JR would never pay him, and Theo knows JR won’t commit enough cash to be big time. But I do agree with the rest. Letting KW and RH trade players after watching what they have done with this rebuild, is beyond insane. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brijames1957 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 Just now, Dick Allen said: No way on Theo. JR would never pay him, and Theo knows JR won’t commit enough cash to be big time. But I do agree with the rest. Letting KW and RH trade players after watching what they have done with this rebuild, is beyond insane. I agree on Theo. But hey, a man can dream right? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 2 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: I posted after the first, watching their approaches, I thought 2 runs was the max tonight, but was really thinking 0 or 1. Eloy had a good game, and Benitendi did as well. Eloy has much better approaches than most of the team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Honestly, I’m completely ok with this. If you wanted to do this the right way, saving every cent possible now is important. If you can clear out Anderson and Eloys contracts now, do so. Holding onto them runs the risk that you will be stuck paying for next year when they’re hurt or struggling worse, and I don’t really care if they’re better next year because this team isn’t good enough for one or two people improving to do anything other than offset the things they lost to FA. Do you trust the money saved "will be spent"? I'm thinking Jerry just pockets it like the $100M + from MLB. The one advantage is a new owner and their competent FO would have a clean slate in terms of committed payroll. If you are dumping the longer term contracts, shedding Benintendi and Moncada would be my two priorities, Eloy secondary as someone will take him with the DH in both leagues, really should try to trade him if he is still healthy 3-4 weeks from now. Teams will give something up for Tim for his option and potential away from this organization. I believe both Moncada and Tim will have solid seasons next year if healthy playing for their likely final payday. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brijames1957 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 This team is nothing more than an investment to JR. An MLB team goes up in value no matter what it does on the field and he knows that as well as anyone. He won his WS. He has no desire to sink any more money in to this thing. As fans of this team we are screwed until a new owner takes over who hopefully wants to win more than anything. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 4 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: No way on Theo. JR would never pay him, and Theo knows JR won’t commit enough cash to be big time. But I do agree with the rest. Letting KW and RH trade players after watching what they have done with this rebuild, is beyond insane. I believe the best realistic hope with Jerry alive to get a quality person willing to consider the position is Kim Ng taking a promotion from Miami to be President / EVP of Baseball Operations. She's doing a good job now that Jeter and Mattingly are out of the picture. She came up through the Sox organization and is far more qualified than anyone else in the organization. Not sure Miami will let her go, or that she would come to a worse team and not stay to play out the Marlins rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 5 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said: Do you trust the money saved "will be spent"? I'm thinking Jerry just pockets it like the $100M + from MLB. The one advantage is a new owner and their competent FO would have a clean slate in terms of committed payroll. If you are dumping the longer term contracts, shedding Benintendi and Moncada would be my two priorities, Eloy secondary as someone will take him with the DH in both leagues, really should try to trade him if he is still healthy 3-4 weeks from now. Teams will give something up for Tim for his option and potential away from this organization. I believe both Moncada and Tim will have solid seasons next year if healthy playing for their likely final payday. I don't see how you get much for Anderson at this point, but he is not the leader he once was and it seems like it would be an addition by subtraction to get him off this team asap. Maybe package him and Giolito and approach the Dodgers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 Go enjoy your summer guys. Life is too short (if you're over 30) to worry about a team this s%*# and with bad ownership. I'm just keeping it real. I'm ashamed I even bothered to post this after checking the box. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 Scoring one run in your home park built for offense. Zowie. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 58 minutes ago, Capn12 said: You can't magically become a winning team, with this lineup. Not with 1 guy over 800 OPS, no real game plan formulated for every pitcher you're facing, etc. Agreed. This team is as bad as it looks on paper. Poorly constructed ballclub with lousy medical staff/trainers. Or at least it appears that way with guys getting hurt a lot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 42 minutes ago, brijames1957 said: He won his WS. He has no desire to sink any more money in to this thing. Sox are 12th in payroll. My guess is Sox will be about double that in the future 24? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brijames1957 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 16 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Go enjoy your summer guys. Life is too short (if you're over 30) to worry about a team this s%*# and with bad ownership. I'm just keeping it real. I'm ashamed I even bothered to post this after checking the box. I'm a pretty hardcore Sox fan and I have stopped watching the games. I might check in on a game once and awhile but other than that I am just fed up with the entire organization. I am totally resigned to the fact that until there is new ownership and a new GM this will just continue to be a total clown show not worthy of my attention. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinky Stanky Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said: The two problems with the deadline is Jerry will likely favor salary relief over talent acquisition, and even if he did value talent acquisition we currently have Hahn making the decisions. Guys the Sox are likely to sell (FAs in 2024 plus possibly Tim & Graveman): $19.5M Lynn $18.3M Grandal $16.0M Graveman (2 yrs) $12.5M Anderson $12.0M Clevinger (includes mutual option) $10.4M Giolito $9.0M Kelly Potential Salary savings $28.6M this year, $26 million next year ($4M Clevinger, $8M Graveman, $14M Anderson). Whole lotta money for mediocrity or less. I'd dump what I could too. Assuming that JR wants to do it and I wouldn't blame him a bit. Gonna be a half full ballpark either way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 1 hour ago, Dick Allen said: No way on Theo. JR would never pay him, and Theo knows JR won’t commit enough cash to be big time. But I do agree with the rest. Letting KW and RH trade players after watching what they have done with this rebuild, is beyond insane. Agree, but what is the alternative? They aren't getting fired and they need to shitcan a bunch of these stiffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 5 minutes ago, greg775 said: Sox are 12th in payroll. My guess is Sox will be about double that in the future 24? I think it will go down to the $100M-$120M range over the next few years, unless they admit to partaking in Tanking 2.0. They were $71M-$98M during Tanking 1.0, and while "trying" under Hahn, setting aside the Tony La Russa payroll bump, they have settled in the $110M-$120M range last decade. https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/american-league/chicago-white-sox/ Current future commitments in 2025 and beyond: Buyout or Contract club option Minimum 4 Seasons at $77.5M Maximum 9 Seasons $176M (Includes Hendriks buyout if cut before 2024) Benintendi 2025 & 2026 $16.5M, 2027 $14.5M Hendriks 2025-2033 $13.5M - If Jerry lets Liam walk to avoid paying $15M upfront in 2024. JImenez 2025-2026 $3M X 2 (Club Options $16.5M 2025 & $18.5M 2026) Moncada 2025 $5M / $25M Robert Junior 2025 $15M 2026-2027 $2M X 2 (Club Options $20M 2026 & $20M 2027) 2025 Final Arbitration Year: Cease; Frazier; Kopech 2026 Final Arbitration Year: Crochet; Foster; Toussaint; Vaughn 2027 Final Arbitration Year: Lambert; Sheets; Zavala 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankchifan Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 3 hours ago, Dick Allen said: No way on Theo. JR would never pay him, and Theo knows JR won’t commit enough cash to be big time. But I do agree with the rest. Letting KW and RH trade players after watching what they have done with this rebuild, is beyond insane. RH will probably trade our starting pitchers for more relievers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankchifan Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 2 hours ago, greg775 said: Sox are 12th in payroll. My guess is Sox will be about double that in the future 24? Rick Hahn has not been an efficient GM. Has not gotten a good return on his payroll investments. He should be canned. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankchifan Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 4 hours ago, wegner said: 7 games out now so if they keep dropping further they should sell even earlier than the trade deadline. Only the Royals and Oakland have worse records than the Sox, and you know how bad those teams are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 No matter who subs for Hahn, If the owner is just gonna handcuff you. I'll bet you anything that any top up and coming executive will not wanna work for Jerry. No matter what they are paid. Who would wanna deal with this bullshit? Who in there right mind would wanna work with people screwed in there seats(kenny) and pretty much sabotaging you. Who would want to when sheer incompetence is the soup du jour in this Org. This team has more drama and backstabbing than a Fucking soap opera. Who would risk there carrer? NOT ANY OF THE GOOD ONES. So if Hahn is replaced it will be with Getz( Another Jerry's pets) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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