Blow it the F Up

[Timmy U]

For me, Kjerstad is the choice, but Baltimore would probably rather trade Ortiz. Prieto has also been playing well and playing some ss.

Acuna is intriguing cuz it continues Sox tradition of having less talented brothers of All Star players.

[FloydBannister1983]

3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

This team literally has no chance of winning the division when our pitching depth consists of Tanner fucking Banks and Jesse shitshow Scholtens.  Even a garbage squad like the Oakland A’s is able to beat us up.   A serious front office would see that along with a horrible flawed offense and quickly realize our fate is sealed.  Do the right thing and blow this s%*# the F up!

I’ve been thinking about your first sentence …. If they did win the division would most get joy out of it?  For myself I’ve already moved on from this team and would not get enjoyment.  I’m still coasting on the fumes on my 40 years of being a fan but I don’t get current enjoyment out of them.  Even if there was a good run out of them and they snuck in (which by the way, I can’t ever remember a Sox team coming from behind to snatch success at the end of a season) I really don’t think I would blink an eye.  Maybe I’m wrong and I could get caught up in it but I think I root for the Rays more at this point.

[The Kids Can Play]

22 hours ago, Harry Chappas said:

The longer this season goes on, the more I am not certain what is happening in baseball and what the direction is. 

Look at the Padres, Cardinals and Mets.  Also look at the Orioles, Tampa, and Reds.  The White Sox have as many wins as the Mets and one less then the Padres.

Hell the Pirates who were free falling to nowhere just swept the Padres and are back in the picture .

The cubs were buyers last week and now look as baseball stupid as the White Sox.

I will say the extra picks and player development is the key to winning along with building a culture. 

 

 

To illustrate you point about Orioles, Rays and Reds, consider what those three organizations have in common:

1. Young and modern day thinking GM's - Orioles - Mike Elias 40 yrs old, Reds - Nick Krall - 45 yrs old, Rays - Peter Bendix - 38 yrs old. All three have been mentored by prior and current successful executives.

2. Highly ranked and productive Farm Systems - Orioles - #1, Reds #5, Rays #8 note. The Rays at #8 is one of the lowest rankings for the them in the last 15 years.

3. Have bottom end payrolls - Orioles - 29th - 67.8 million, Reds - 25th - 93.2 million, Rays - 28th - 76.5 million. - This means when you don't have money to sign the top free agents, or for big star player trades, your organization from top to bottom has to be extremely proficient in scouting, drafting and developing young prospects...in order to make them into hungry, motivated and productive major league players. 

You are absolutely right though, the game is changing and just spending ridiculous money like the Mets, Padres and Phillies have, who are #1, #3 and #4 in highest payrolls, is not proving to be such a successful formula for wining. 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

@Y2Jimmy0 - Where do you think the Sox’s farm system ranks right now?  Bottom 5?  Bottom 3?  It was generally considered a bottom 5 system entering the season and I can’t imagine it’s gotten based on the performances this year.

Rick Hahn may end being the architect of a bottom 5 MLB team and bottom 5 farm system.  That’s KC Royals levels of bad, which is actually quite amusing given we hired an inexperienced guy from their org to be our “win now” manager and gave the largest contract in franchise to their slap hitting, average defending LF.

[Y2Jimmy0]

24 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

@Y2Jimmy0 - Where do you think the Sox’s farm system ranks right now?  Bottom 5?  Bottom 3?  It was generally considered a bottom 5 system entering the season and I can’t imagine it’s gotten based on the performances this year.

Rick Hahn may end being the architect of a bottom 5 MLB team and bottom 5 farm system.  That’s KC Royals levels of bad, which is actually quite amusing given we hired an inexperienced guy from their org to be our “win now” manager and gave the largest contract in franchise to their slap hitting, average defending LF.

Definitely bottom 5. I think the Sox overall are a bottom 3 org in baseball with Colorado and Kansas City 

[Chicago White Sox]

23 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

Definitely bottom 5. I think the Sox overall are a bottom 3 org in baseball with Colorado and Kansas City 

Seems like Jerry is destroying both the Bulls & White Sox simultaneously as his goodbye gift for Chicago.

[Harry Chappas]

1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Seems like Jerry is destroying both the Bulls & White Sox simultaneously as his goodbye gift for Chicago.

He did that a long time ago.  Spends just enough to paper over his lack of desire to win. 

[wegner]

57 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

@Y2Jimmy0 - Where do you think the Sox’s farm system ranks right now?  Bottom 5?  Bottom 3?  It was generally considered a bottom 5 system entering the season and I can’t imagine it’s gotten based on the performances this year.

Rick Hahn may end being the architect of a bottom 5 MLB team and bottom 5 farm system.  That’s KC Royals levels of bad, which is actually quite amusing given we hired an inexperienced guy from their org to be our “win now” manager and gave the largest contract in franchise to their slap hitting, average defending LF.

Rocco has looked good since moving to the leadoff role imo. Plus I just absolutely hated Pollock and his attitude. Defense in LF has been disappointing, I agree.

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, wegner said:

Rocco has looked good since moving to the leadoff role imo. Plus I just absolutely hated Pollock and his attitude. Defense in LF has been disappointing, I agree.

The problem is Benintendi in 2025 26 27...he's not going to kill the Sox now. But those teams like TB Balt and Cincy wouldn't think about that kind of a Tier B/C deal going forward with such limited upside.

 

That said, what the Rays do with Lowe and Arozarena will be a real test for their accountants to continue to fit onto the payroll.

 

[Lip Man 1]

This organization needs an enema starting at the top.

[wegner]

12 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

This organization needs an enema starting at the top.

I don't think that's how those work

[tray]

Try to trade or release unproductive players (TA, Moncada, Grandal) and build on the core....and do that every year.  It's really that simple.

For now Grifol should bench TA  and have Remillard, Bennintendi, Robert Jr., and Eloy at the top of the order.

Also bench Grandal or put him on the IL until he is dealt or DFAed. He is toast. 

Don't trade our star players and Pitchers  and definitely try to re-sign Gio. You blow the thing up and the Sox will not be competitive for a decade or more. I am sure that some  posters here would love that outcome.

[TheBooneLoganEra]

3 hours ago, Timmy U said:

For me, Kjerstad is the choice, but Baltimore would probably rather trade Ortiz. Prieto has also been playing well and playing some ss.

Acuna is intriguing cuz it continues Sox tradition of having less talented brothers of All Star players.

I'd be thrilled if we could steal Ortiz. He and Montgomery on our middle infield would be worth watching. 

[WBWSF]

If this losing  keeps happening I would think some  changes  will be made this off season.  There are thousands of unsold tickets for this upcoming homestand. Even the Cubs series later in the month is not soldout. They're on a pace of drawing 1.6 million fans. Last year they drew 2 million. JR will definitely  notice the drop in attendance and try to do something to turn this around.  In the type of division they're in I don't see them blowing this up. I see a retool.

[shago]

4 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

@Y2Jimmy0 - Where do you think the Sox’s farm system ranks right now?  Bottom 5?  Bottom 3?  It was generally considered a bottom 5 system entering the season and I can’t imagine it’s gotten based on the performances this year.

Rick Hahn may end being the architect of a bottom 5 MLB team and bottom 5 farm system.  That’s KC Royals levels of bad

It's worse because he had a much bigger budget. He is and will continue to be the worst GM in professional sports history. 

Like the guy yelling at 'George' in the 'Wedding Singer,' "YOOOOUU SUCKKKKKKKK!"

[Lip Man 1]

4 hours ago, WBWSF said:

If this losing  keeps happening I would think some  changes  will be made this off season.  There are thousands of unsold tickets for this upcoming homestand. Even the Cubs series later in the month is not soldout. They're on a pace of drawing 1.6 million fans. Last year they drew 2 million. JR will definitely  notice the drop in attendance and try to do something to turn this around.  In the type of division they're in I don't see them blowing this up. I see a retool.

Led by the same incompetent clowns who screwed up the first rebuild. ?

And remember with all the money pouring in from different domestic and international sources attendance isn't "make or break" anymore. 

[Balta1701]

Just now, Lip Man 1 said:

Led by the same incompetent clowns who screwed up the first rebuild. ?

And remember with all the money pouring in from different domestic and international sources attendance isn't "make or break" anymore. 

Naw, they’re worse at retooling on the fly, so we will definitely do that.

[Chicago White Sox]

Has a first year manager ever been fired before year one was over?

[caulfield12]

6 hours ago, tray said:

Try to trade or release unproductive players (TA, Moncada, Grandal) and build on the core....and do that every year.  It's really that simple.

For now Grifol should bench TA  and have Remillard, Bennintendi, Robert Jr., and Eloy at the top of the order.

Also bench Grandal or put him on the IL until he is dealt or DFAed. He is toast. 

Don't trade our star players and Pitchers  and definitely try to re-sign Gio. You blow the thing up and the Sox will not be competitive for a decade or more. I am sure that some  posters here would love that outcome.

You mean trade aging productive players that are about to get more expensive and hit their decline phase for cheaper/better.

Unfortunately...not a Hahn strength.

And you can totally remove from the realm of imagination Lucas Giolito getting the Jose Berrios Toronto deal from the Sox.

Edited July 2, 2023 by caulfield12

[Balta1701]

26 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Has a first year manager ever been fired before year one was over?

Apparently Ted Turner went 0-1 as manager.

[Chicago White Sox]

17 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Naw, they’re worse at retooling on the fly, so we will definitely do that.

A “Hahn” retooling on the fly would probably look like this:

• Giolito traded for a major league ready SP prospect
• Lynn option exercised and bounce-back expected
• Free agent #5 SP signed (Alex Wood)
• Couple free agent relievers signed to replace whoever is traded at deadline
• C tier free agent catcher signed (Mike Zunino)
• Aging free agent 2B signed (Whit Merrifield)
• Colas leveraged as primary RF (still some Eloy or Sheets)

May the baseball gods take mercy on our souls.

[peanut33tillman]

10 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Based on Baseball America’s current ranking, here are prospects in the 60 to 100 ranges for the four clubs mentioned above:

Orioles:

• #68: Joey Ortiz (SS)
• #73: DL Hall (LHP)
• #74: Samuel Basello (CA)
• #77: Heston Kjerstad (RF)

Rangers:

• #79: Owen White (RHP)
• #92: Luisangel Acuna (SS)

Reds:

• #66: Cam Collier (OF)
• #70: Andrew Abbott (LHP)
• #90: Christian Encarnacion-Strand (3B)
• #93: Chase Petty (RHP)
• #97: Edwin Arroyo (SS)

The Diamondbacks don’t have any guys in this range (multiple top 30), but Blake Walston (LHP) was a guy both BA & Keith Law considered a top 100 type prior to this season (ugly results in AAA this year).  I wish there was a way to snag Alek Thomas by combining Giolito with other stuff, but probably wishful thinking there.

Do you guys think the Sox could nab Kjerstad or Ortiz from Baltimore? Feel like making a deal with them makes tons of sense. Needs SP, entering contention window with a good young core and an abundance of riches still in their farm system. Seems like a team that could be willing and afford to part with a high end prospect to grab one of the best arms at the deadline, no? 

[Chicago White Sox]

Just now, peanut33tillman said:

Do you guys think the Sox could nab Kjerstad or Ortiz from Baltimore? Feel like making a deal with them makes tons of sense. Needs SP, entering contention window with a good young core and an abundance of riches still in their farm system. Seems like a team that could be willing and afford to part with a high end prospect to grab one of the best arms at the deadline, no? 

Would be nice if they would, but if not then someone else should have interest

[Balta1701]

13 minutes ago, peanut33tillman said:

Do you guys think the Sox could nab Kjerstad or Ortiz from Baltimore? Feel like making a deal with them makes tons of sense. Needs SP, entering contention window with a good young core and an abundance of riches still in their farm system. Seems like a team that could be willing and afford to part with a high end prospect to grab one of the best arms at the deadline, no? 

Both of these guys are top 65 prospects right now on MLB.com. That’s more than Giolito is worth with only 2 months of control. 

They could be key pieces of a deal for Cease. 

[flavum]

Cease should absolutely be traded this year for max value. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by flavum