Burger To Marlins

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

52 minutes ago, T R U said:

Jake Burger hit .146 in June with a .200! OBP. He’s hitting .197 over the last 28 days and he strikes out at almost 32%. He also cant play defense. He’s gonna hit 30 HRs, big deal. 
 

Sox have a chance to get a mid rotation starter out of this. It’s a no brainer. 

He also had a July OPS of .865 and led the team in walks, HRs, SLG,  RBI, runs scored and games played.

If he was such a bad hitter and such a bad fielder how the heck has he managed to accumulate 1.4 fWAR and and have 115 wRC+ ?

I understand there are a few fans who hate the trade because it was Burger traded. I think it was a good trade. I'm just wondering if Vaughn or Eloy could've gotten him instead. At minimum the Sox have Eloy for 1 more year or maybe it's worse if they have him for 2 or 3 more years @ $42M and he never can stay in the field.

Will have to revisit this more than once in the next few years not only to see how Burger,Eloy and Vaughn have faired but also Eder.

[South Side Hit Men]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

So you’re saying he will be in the big league bullpen next year?

If Tony La Russa returns, it is a certainty.

Lineup

1. SS Tim Anderson
2. LF Andrew Benintendi
3. CF Luis Robert
4. 1B Albert Pujols
5. DH Miguel Cabrera
6. C Yadier Molina
7. 3B Jake Lamb
8. RF Andrew Vaughn
9. 2B David Eckstein

Reserves

• C Yasmani Grandal
• INF/OF/DH Luery Garcia
• 2B Josh Harrison
• RF Gavin Sheets

Rotation

1. Lance Lynn
2. Adam Wainwright
3. Rich Hill
4. Zach Greinke
5. Noah Syndergaard

Bullpen:

• Craig Kimbrel (Closer)
• Aaron Bummer (Loogy)
• Ky Bush (Converted Starter)
• Garrett Crochet (Converted Starter)
• Jake Eder (Converted Starter)
• Michael Kopech (Converted Starter)
• Cristian Mena (Converted Starter)
• Nick Nastrini (Coverted Starter)

Out the season: Liam Hendriks (TJS) & Yoan Moncada (Back Surgery)

 

 

 

 

[pcq]

3 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Give me a break .Eloy has just as many flaws in his game as Burger. The best ability is availability. Eloy has rarely shown that ability. Can Eloy manage to play a position or run the bases without getting hurt ? I'm not upset with the trade . Eloy is younger than Burger and ATM is a more versatile hitter. He's also more expensive . He can play 2 OF positions so badly and at such high risk of injury that he's more of DH than Burger is.

Next year could be Eloy's last year with the Sox.  One more lengthy absence from him in 2024 and how likely is it the Sox pick up his $16. 5M 2025 option ? Jakes 1st year of Arbitration is 2026. This is not as cut and dried as you make it seem and if you didn't consider all these things you might just be baseball stupid.

Eloy is a twathead who is always injured. Nobody smarter than Hahn would ever trade for him. He is our twathead. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

32 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

Coming in late here, but here's my take:

At some point, you gotta trade some of these first basemen instead of continuing to play them out of position. I like Burger, but he's a low-OBP designated hitter on a team that doesn't need that. It's a shame it took this long for these morons to start trading depth for needs, but here we are.

I hope the "player development staff" has identified something specific with Eder, because he's had a really rough year in terms of his stuff and projection. But if they do think they can fix him, it's a really solid return for a one-dimensional player, and I expect the reason they were able to get this much was because of Burger's five year of control.

This is a rebuild plain and simple. I know it's being disguised under the pretext of competing next year but what on God's green earth makes any one think next year won't be as big a disaster as this year ?

Clevinger and Grandal will surely be gone after this year and Moncada will be gone after 2024 and if it is a rebuild why would they just turn around and give most of that money to Eloy for 2025 ? Cease and TA might be gone  by then too.

I know you haven't addressed any of these things but anyone who thinks any of these guys are going to be around in 2025 is sorely mistaken.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

No they won't pick it up.  Why would they ? Cease will probably be gone. Grandal and Clevinger gone after this year. Cease and TA and Eloy will all be traded.

Vaughn may be the only one left with the hopes he can have a big season and then he'll be traded too.

[Balta1701]

11 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

No they won't pick it up.  Why would they ? Cease will probably be gone. Grandal and Clevinger gone after this year. Cease and TA and Eloy will all be traded.

Vaughn may be the only one left with the hopes he can have a big season and then he'll be traded too.

These are the people who picked up Kimbrel’s option for no good reason other than their own stubbornness. Do not ascribe logic to people known to act irrationally.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

These are the people who picked up Kimbrel’s option for no good reason other than their own stubbornness. Do not ascribe logic to people known to act irrationally.

They did act pretty rationally at the trade deadline. The New Rebuild. This time we'll get it right !

[Eminor3rd]

25 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

This is a rebuild plain and simple. I know it's being disguised under the pretext of competing next year but what on God's green earth makes any one think next year won't be as big a disaster as this year ?

Clevinger and Grandal will surely be gone after this year and Moncada will be gone after 2024 and if it is a rebuild why would they just turn around and give most of that money to Eloy for 2025 ? Cease and TA might be gone  by then too.

I know you haven't addressed any of these things but anyone who thinks any of these guys are going to be around in 2025 is sorely mistaken.

I don't think that, I think the FO is thinking about 2024 only, because there's no other option in JR's universe. It's unimaginable to do another full rebuild, in a much worse position than last time, and there's nothing they can really do to overhaul. They know they're living on borrowed time; they're going to keep rolling the dice until they're fired.

[South Side Hit Men]

24 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

No they won't pick it up.  Why would they ? Cease will probably be gone. Grandal and Clevinger gone after this year. Cease and TA and Eloy will all be traded.

Vaughn may be the only one left with the hopes he can have a big season and then he'll be traded too.

I can see the Sox and Clevinger agreeing to a rare acceptance on the mutual option, with the apparent zero interest this week despite the fact he has pitched well when healthy, and the Sox lack of internal option and relatively cheap $8M additional outlay in a tanking year vs. FA options.

Perhaps if he doesn't do more s%*# someone will take him next July.

[wrathofhahn]

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Clevinger is extended that is the only reason to keep him past the deadline is if they are engaged in talks and close to agreement on an extension. If not it is a massive mistake by Hahn he has pitched well he could have netted us a decent return,

Grandal is easy to understand he had no value and if you are going to have to eat his deal you might as well just have him finish out the year since there is noone ready to take his spot.

Ditto for Anderson. Dejong went for a song. Anderson has similar value at this point so it makes sense to hold onto him if he bounces back he can always be moved in the offseason or just kept on his option. I was in favor of moving him but clearly the demand wasn't there.

Cease doesn't make sense to move if the FO plans to retool and spend money next year.

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

3 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

I don't think that, I think the FO is thinking about 2024 only, because there's no other option in JR's universe. It's unimaginable to do another full rebuild, in a much worse position than last time, and there's nothing they can really do to overhaul. They know they're living on borrowed time; they're going to keep rolling the dice until they're fired.

Yesterday I did say Hahn doesn't want to utter the R word just to fool Jerry. But unless JR has lost a lot of his mental capacity I'm sure he knows it's another rebuild. Maybe he just doesn't care anymore . Maybe the Sox made money during the rebuild so he's not against having another one. It'll be his son's problem eventually.

[pcq]

2 hours ago, MikeKreevich said:

Our beloved broadcasters just recently were bemoaning the fact that one of the major problems the Sox have is being out-homered at home.  And what does Hahn do, trade away a thirty to forty homer a year player who has been a bright light in this dark season.  But what do you expect from are GM who traded away Fernando Tatis and Marcus Semien?

I hate this trade.

 

It is actually the only stat you need. It means you built homefield for the visitors end of story. 

[GreenSox]

That Sox FO did what any functional FO of a team 20 below .500 would have done:   They sold off the short termers.   That signifies neither rebuilding nor contending.

and then they traded Burger.  That doesn’t fit either category.  I guess they just didn’t like him as a player.

and then Elvis Andrus starts tonight, and the team endured its 2nd shutout loss in a row and we’re back to the White Sox that we know and love. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 minute ago, South Side Hit Men said:

I can see the Sox and Clevinger agreeing to a rare acceptance on the mutual option, with the apparent zero interest this week despite the fact he has pitched well when healthy, and the Sox lack of internal option and relatively cheap $8M additional outlay in a tanking year vs. FA options.

Perhaps if he doesn't do more s%*# someone will take him next July.

I brought up that possibilty yesterday or the day before since they will need starting pitching desperately and Clevinger may not exactly want to test Free agency . But then again he's probably an egotistical bastard who has an inflated sense of his own self worth.

[wrathofhahn]

14 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I brought up that possibilty yesterday or the day before since they will need starting pitching desperately and Clevinger may not exactly want to test Free agency . But then again he's probably an egotistical bastard who has an inflated sense of his own self worth.

Clevinger has pitched well enough and still has good stuff he is likely to get a multi year offer in free agency. I would be shocked if he exorcised his option it just makes almost no sense.

 

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

15 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

Clevinger has pitched well enough and still has good stuff he is likely to get a multi year offer in free agency. I would be shocked if he exorcised his option it just makes almost no sense.

 

 

I think he'll opt out or the SOx will.Never underestimate how alleged wife beating and child endangerment accusations will effect his FA .

[Dominikk85]

I like the deal. Burger has serious power and has a good season but a 4 to 1 k to bb rate probably means regression is coming.

Burger is a great story that he came back at all after all the injuries but getting a top100 pitching prospect even with Still some command issues is a great return for that.

[Kyyle23]

8 hours ago, GreenSox said:

That Sox FO did what any functional FO of a team 20 below .500 would have done:   They sold off the short termers.   That signifies neither rebuilding nor contending.

and then they traded Burger.  That doesn’t fit either category.  I guess they just didn’t like him as a player.

and then Elvis Andrus starts tonight, and the team endured its 2nd shutout loss in a row and we’re back to the White Sox that we know and love. 

Burger fits a different category, which is way too many DHs on this team.  It is what it is, the guy hits for power but not much else right now.  He might figure it out but that bat was starting to get more and more holes and the Sox decided he could be dealt.  The only thing that bothers me is that this front office was allowed to make the deal 

[caulfield12]

8 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I brought up that possibilty yesterday or the day before since they will need starting pitching desperately and Clevinger may not exactly want to test Free agency . But then again he's probably an egotistical bastard who has an inflated sense of his own self worth.

Remember he was traded not so long ago for 5-6 players....

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Burger fits a different category, which is way too many DHs on this team.  It is what it is, the guy hits for power but not much else right now.  He might figure it out but that bat was starting to get more and more holes and the Sox decided he could be dealt.  The only thing that bothers me is that this front office was allowed to make the deal 

Except his July stats were trending upwards again.  And more walks...better defense.

It was his June that stunk.

[wrathofhahn]

7 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Except his July stats were trending upwards again.  And more walks...better defense.

It was his June that stunk.

From July 1 to 26 he played 19 games his batting average was .191, .267 OBP, .471 SLG and .737 OPS. Four games at the end of month where he walked 5 times and people are using that to try to pretend he is a different hitter than what he has shown all season.

Im sorry but in 162 game season you can take 4-5 games from any players season and take them to tell whatever you want.

If the Marlins are taking basically one series into account into why they are willing to trade a top 100 prospect for a no defense. No avg. No obp. Tower power 1B/DH then they are morons and we'd be fools to not take advantage of their idiocy.

 

Edited August 2, 2023 by wrathofhahn

[Kyyle23]

17 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Except his July stats were trending upwards again.  And more walks...better defense.

It was his June that stunk.

Quite the trend there, caulfield. 
 

 

[caulfield12]

17 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

From July 1 to 26 he played 19 games his batting average was .191, .267 OBP, .471 SLG and .737 OPS. Four games at the end of month where he walked 5 times and people are using that to try to pretend he is a different hitter than what he has shown all season.

Im sorry but in 162 game season you can take 4-5 games from any players season and take them to tell whatever you want.

If the Marlins are taking basically one series into account into why they are willing to trade a top 100 prospect for a no defense. No avg. No obp. Tower power 1B/DH then they are morons and we'd be fools to not take advantage of their idiocy.

 

Let's talk one year from now when they have a Bottom 2-3 MLB offense.

KW at least always believed the offenses should be high scoring if they were going to be a third or fourth place team.

We're going to be bad and boring.

 

[Balta1701]

8 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

They did act pretty rationally at the trade deadline. The New Rebuild. This time we'll get it right !

I’m not sure that I’d describe holding Cease at the deadline and continuing to insist that you expect to compete next year to be “rational”.

[caulfield12]

Just now, Kyyle23 said:

Quite the trend there, caulfield. 
 

 

Subtract June is just as logical.