Burger To Marlins

[Kyyle23]

1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

Let's talk one year from now when they have a Bottom 2-3 MLB offense.

KW at least always believed the offenses should be high scoring if they were going to be a third or fourth place team.

We're going to be bad and boring.

 

Let’s talk now, when they are 22 games under .500.  

[Kyyle23]

1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

Subtract June is just as logical.

I didn’t subtract anything 

[Balta1701]

7 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I think he'll opt out or the SOx will.Never underestimate how alleged wife beating and child endangerment accusations will effect his FA .

This is the most obvious explanation for why he wasn’t moved, that literally no GM wants him at any price.

[Kyyle23]

Just now, Balta1701 said:

This is the most obvious explanation for why he wasn’t moved, that literally no GM wants him at any price.

There are two factors imo, one is that he has horrific accusations hanging out there, and the second is he has been hurt multiple times this season and the last time he literally looked like he tore his bicep, and he hasn’t been exactly a model of health over the last five years or so.

Either way the Sox are stuck with him 

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, Kyyle23 said:

There are two factors imo, one is that he has horrific accusations hanging out there, and the second is he has been hurt multiple times this season and the last time he literally looked like he tore his bicep, and he hasn’t been exactly a model of health over the last five years or so.

Either way the Sox are stuck with him 

Unless they banned the Jesse Crain style deals at some point, we know you can move a guy just off the IL with the return being contingent on what he does the rest of the year. There was no baseball reason why he’s still here, people were ranking him as obvious to move as Middleton. No team was willing to risk having him on their roster, and with his behavior this year that’s the right call.

[wrathofhahn]

4 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Quite the trend there, caulfield. 
 

 

 

5 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Let's talk one year from now when they have a Bottom 2-3 MLB offense.

KW at least always believed the offenses should be high scoring if they were going to be a third or fourth place team.

We're going to be bad and boring.

 

I am going to say this but I don't believe Burger is a good offensive player.

Could the Marlins fix his approach at the plate and he develop into one of course there are scattered stories of guys like Jose Bautista figuring it out in their latter half of their careers.

But Burger will be 28 next year. There is a much better chance the player we have saw this year with the exception of a handful of games is who he is with the exception of his ISO which is going to come back down to earth.

And when it does he figures to fall into that .725 ish to .750 ish OPS range. What is that worth to you as a 1B/DH? If he could play 3B at a high level it would be another story because you could live with his all or nothing approach but when it comes to 1B/DH its not hard to find .750+ OPS guys. It may have been hard over the years for us but the average ops for a first baseman right now is .711 OPS for a DH is .742.

Lets talk a year from now because if Burger is still having a .800+ OPS not getting on base, not hitting for an average and has a .300+ ISO if I'm still around I'll send a picture of me eating my hat.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

Absolutely love Burger, he’s a great person and was very fun to root for during one of the worst seasons I’ve endured as a fan. I’d urge everyone to look at 2021 Franmil Reyes and compare him to 2023 Jake Burger. One tool players can fade extremely fast. Sox ultimately made the right baseball move getting a potential future rotation anchor for him. This team is broken and needs better talent.

[TaylorStSox]

This really comes down to Sox fans having an affinity for fat white kids with power.

[tray]

54 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

 

I am going to say this but I don't believe Burger is a good offensive player.

Could the Marlins fix his approach at the plate and he develop into one of course there are scattered stories of guys like Jose Bautista figuring it out in their latter half of their careers.

But Burger will be 28 next year. There is a much better chance the player we have saw this year with the exception of a handful of games is who he is with the exception of his ISO which is going to come back down to earth.

And when it does he figures to fall into that .725 ish to .750 ish OPS range. What is that worth to you as a 1B/DH? If he could play 3B at a high level it would be another story because you could live with his all or nothing approach but when it comes to 1B/DH its not hard to find .750+ OPS guys. It may have been hard over the years for us but the average ops for a first baseman right now is .711 OPS for a DH is .742.

Lets talk a year from now because if Burger is still having a .800+ OPS not getting on base, not hitting for an average and has a .300+ ISO if I'm still around I'll send a picture of me eating my hat.

Generally, I see advanced stats as a potential problem withe talent evaluation and player/roster decision making.  Burger lights up the crowd and draws fans to the park with 450 ft. bombs. Where is that in the advanced stats?

For me the Burger decision should have been simple. He earned the 3rd base job so put him there and move Moncada to second. Don't remove an asset that you can't easily replace. I would say the same thing with Eloy. No reason to trade a guy that hits for average and has his power potential. Oh, he had 19 injuries..including surgery for appendicitis, elebrating after a game,  and extending his hand over the fence to catch a home run ball.  Eloy will be less susceptible to injury as a DH so you keep him  unless you want a lineup that is really strapped for power and is unexciting for fans. In short, the trade game has to look at things beyond player stats in order to end up with a team that is good and exciting for fans to watch.

 

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, tray said:

Generally, I see advanced stats as a potential problem withe talent evaluation and player/roster decision making.  Burger lights up the crowd and draws fans to the park with 450 ft. bombs. Where is that in the advanced stats?

In the attendance figures where the White Sox are down like 4000 a game since last year.

[Bob Sacamano]

Burger seems like a dude that works his ass off. With more experience, he may become a dude who learns the strike zone a bit and walks a little more. Or he may not, who knows.

[Bob Sacamano]

I will say, they should give Eloy a 1B mit and have him work on that in the off-season. He wants to play in the field? It’s 1B or bust at this point.

Edited August 2, 2023 by Bob Sacamano

[Kyyle23]

6 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

In the attendance figures where the White Sox are down like 4000 a game since last year.

I was gonna say, the reflection is in the interest in the team and the record 

[Kyyle23]

3 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I will say, they should give Eloy a 1B mit and have him work on that in the off-season. He wants to play in the field? It’s 1B or bust at this point.

I think I am good on the Sox deciding that anyone can play anywhere it’s just baseball.  It’s DH or bust imo, so he better start dropping bombs like big papi 

[Bob Sacamano]

Just now, Kyyle23 said:

I think I am good on the Sox deciding that anyone can play anywhere it’s just baseball.  It’s DH or bust imo, so he better start dropping bombs like big papi 

Agreed. He has to accept he’s a DH only and it’s best for the team.

[Tony]

14 minutes ago, tray said:

Generally, I see advanced stats as a potential problem withe talent evaluation and player/roster decision making.  Burger lights up the crowd and draws fans to the park with 450 ft. bombs. Where is that in the advanced stats?

For me the Burger decision should have been simple. He earned the 3rd base job so put him there and move Moncada to second. Don't remove an asset that you can't easily replace. I would say the same thing with Eloy. No reason to trade a guy that hits for average and has his power potential. Oh, he had 19 injuries..including surgery for appendicitis, elebrating after a game,  and extending his hand over the fence to catch a home run ball.  Eloy will be less susceptible to injury as a DH so you keep him  unless you want a lineup that is really strapped for power and is unexciting for fans. In short, the trade game has to look at things beyond player stats in order to end up with a team that is good and exciting for fans to watch.

 

Come on, no one was buying a ticket because they wanted to see Jake Burger. 

[T R U]

Do you want to know the terrifying truth, or do you want to see Jake Burger sock a few dingers??

Dingers! Dingers! Dingers!

[skooch]

24 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

I will say, they should give Eloy a 1B mit and have him work on that in the off-season. He wants to play in the field? It’s 1B or bust at this point.

You want Mr. Glass stretching to dig balls out of the dirt at 1B? Nope. It's catcher or bust. 

[The Kids Can Play]

13 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

But Hahn said they traded him because right handed power hitting is a position of strength of this team.  

Wow, more delusional BS from Hahn. He sure does have a misguided definition of right handed power in MLB in 2023. Of course as we know by now, anything out of Hahn's mouth is usually pretty stupid.

After Robert, the next two leaders on this team with HR's are have Vaughn and Eloy tied with 13 home runs. 

There are 94 players in MLB with 13 home runs or more. However there are only 12 players with 25 home runs or more. 

Keep in mind you take away Burger's 25 home runs and the team now only has 94 home runs which is tied for 29th.

Once again the brilliance of genius Hahn with his slick observations on the Sox strengths.

[The Kids Can Play]

37 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Agreed. He has to accept he’s a DH only and it’s best for the team.

You're right he should and that is what team players do. Yet selfish players like Eloy, keep whining about playing the field and hates the DH role...and that is not a team player. I'd love to know how many other DH players in this league are complaining out loud they hate being a DH. 

[hogan873]

More than likely, Burger will be a perennial 25+ HR guy with a low average, a high K rate, and not much ability in the field.  He's more suited to be a DH, and unlike other players (Eloy), accepts that role and does it pretty well.

Do Sox fans remember how much they hated Dunn (the player)?  Burger is Dunn, except he won't hit as many home runs, but he's a very likeable guy.  I mean, easily one of the most likeable guys in baseball.  Unfortunately for him and for us as fans, he had the highest trade value of the surplus of power-hitting 1B/DH types.  And no team was going to take Moncada off our hands with the money he's owed, and the fact that he sucks as a hitter anymore.

I wish Jake well, and I'll always be a fan.  But the Sox now have a potentially really good pitcher that can help this team for quite a while.

[HOFHurt35]

1 hour ago, TaylorStSox said:

This really comes down to Sox fans having an affinity for fat white kids with power.

I think it has a lot more to do with a guy 3rd in the league in SLG%. 

[T R U]

1 minute ago, hogan873 said:

More than likely, Burger will be a perennial 25+ HR guy with a low average, a high K rate, and not much ability in the field.  He's more suited to be a DH, and unlike other players (Eloy), accepts that role and does it pretty well.

Do Sox fans remember how much they hated Dunn (the player)?  Burger is Dunn, except he won't hit as many home runs, but he's a very likeable guy.  I mean, easily one of the most likeable guys in baseball.  Unfortunately for him and for us as fans, he had the highest trade value of the surplus of power-hitting 1B/DH types.  And no team was going to take Moncada off our hands with the money he's owed, and the fact that he sucks as a hitter anymore.

I wish Jake well, and I'll always be a fan.  But the Sox now have a potentially really good pitcher that can help this team for quite a while.

I like the comp of a poor mans Mark Reynolds.

[The Kids Can Play]

52 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Burger seems like a dude that works his ass off. With more experience, he may become a dude who learns the strike zone a bit and walks a little more. Or he may not, who knows.

He was already starting to get more walks. In his last 4 Sox games, he had 5 walks which was the most on the team in those 4 games. In those same 4 games, the next two were Zavala and Benintendi with 2 walks. Then you had six other players in those 4 games with one walk. 

[tray]

Eloy already accepted being a DH with only occasional stints in RF . Burger was fine at 3rd base. We need HRs from players like that to win.  We need more players that play the game with the joy that they bring on the field and in the clubhouse and of course the excitement of having a potential HR every time they step up to the plate.  All of the emphasis on having multiple Closers, set-up men, and veteran starters ended up being a lost cause.

Edited August 2, 2023 by tray