Keynan Middleton rips White Sox 'no rules' culture

[wrathofhahn]

6 minutes ago, fathom said:

Who cares, Lynn already confirmed it

Why would he lie? And he is trashing his teammates just as much as the organization

[South Side Hit Men]

Just now, wrathofhahn said:

Completely fair criticism because that is what TLR was which was too old and in too poor of health to manage.

However, what TLR was 30 years ago is what this club desperately needs even moreso than an new age manager who understands analytics. Clearly the inmates have run the asylum and there is a complete lack of discipline on and off the field.

We desperately need to bring in a veteran experienced manager who are going to hold these guys accountable over the course of a long season

TLR did the opposite of what was expected beyond his treatment of rookies.

Tony wanted to be grandpa and the veterans to love him. The players took advantage, with several players openly mocking him six weeks into the season. Then again, there was a lot to mock.

Still glad he made it out of here in better shape physically and mentally, based on his final press conference, than how he looked and spoke his entire tenure. Glad he didn’t die trying to salvage Jerry’s dysfunctional organization.

[Chisoxfn]

3 minutes ago, fathom said:

 

Is this for real?  

[wrathofhahn]

2 minutes ago, whitesoxwinner said:

The fight was between grandal and Anderson 

Did Anderson lose that one too.

It's becoming more and more of an open question whether Anderson gets that option picked up

[Buehrle>Wood]

3 minutes ago, fathom said:

 

+1 for TA then.

[Chisoxfn]

Just now, wrathofhahn said:

Did Anderson lose that one too.

It's becoming more and more of an open question whether Anderson gets that option picked up

The bigger question is - why is Grandal here. Pitchers don't like him, he wants to just up and go.  All of that is wrong message.  Maybe TA has lost it because everyone else doesn't care and now he doesn't know what else to do but go crazy. 

 

Note: I'm going to ignore his off the field stuff - cause too much of any teams lockeroom has most of the same issues TA has on that front.  

[pcq]

Any you bitches wanna fight???

[Kyyle23]

8 minutes ago, A-Train to 35th said:

Ifthey held a question and answer session all you would get is the same spin anyway, so NO absolutely NOT.

I'm not going to line JR's pockets with anymore $$$$, and they wouldn't listen anyway.  What has ever changed since Soxfest started with upper management?

Nah this site would line up to be able to address them.  And so would many season ticket holders 

[wrathofhahn]

1 minute ago, South Side Hit Men said:

TLR did the opposite of what was expected beyond his treatment of rookies.

Tony wanted to be grandpa and the veterans to love him. The players took advantage, with several players openly mocking him six weeks into the season. Then again, there was a lot to mock.

Still glad he made it out of here in better shape physically and mentally, based on his final press conference, than how he looked and spoke his entire tenure. Glad he didn’t die trying to salvage Jerry’s dysfunctional organization.

He wasn't physically capable of being that guy anymore.

Still his reputation is exactly what this team needed and still needs. We can't afford to have another manager who is a punching bag for this clubhouse and while getting rid of the worst offenders is important too it's much easier to fix the clubhouse by getting a manager who will hold players accountable

[A-Train to 35th]

3 hours ago, bmags said:

It is always funny to look back. I still think sox should have won that series. The As weren't good. But the guy in the deciding game went throughlike 7 pitchers in an inning and not one could throw a strike.

He had to rely on our rookie pitcher who was starting to run on fumes, and then leaned too much on our same-year-draft pick to throw an extended run. 

But then everyone else in the bullpen failed. 

It wasn't a good strategy for a must win game, yet...at that point we only had Giolito and Keuchel as any start of starting pitcher. Kind of a roster construction issue. Just a ton of young pitching on that team, and of course, a Hahn-special of getting Gio Gonzalez for a final retirement tour.

That said, I think Ricky was really good for keeping a bunch of players thrown to the wolves to keep a good attitude and keep coming at it. 

I also think Steverson actually got MOncada to change his approach in 2019, so he was listening to someone.

But I'm not sure Ricky could have made the shift successfully to getting a bunch of players who know they belong to move together.

Speaking of approaches.....is someone ever going to tell Eloy his isn't working?

[A-Train to 35th]

3 hours ago, soxfaninfl said:

Said during the 10-game losing streak that Grifol needed to be fired, that things are only going to get worse. I was hoping to be proven wrong and take no glee in seeing things are as bad as they are.

A losing culture is simply infectious and to stop the spread requires strong leadership. Leadership just does not exist on the Sox. I knew they wouldn’t fire Grifol because that would be admitting to a mistake and, um, require true leadership skills. This is what happens when you continually devalue and undermine the manager position. No one in management should survive this year but we will see. I have my doubts.

Your missing the main obstacle...JR's not eating the cash on another coaching mistake.  Jeff Torborg was our last competent manager since 1989-91.

Edited August 7, 2023 by A-Train to 35th
sp

[The Kids Can Play]

Thank you Kenyan Middleton for being brave enough and convicted to tell the truth about this Sox team, that evidently has no rules and accountability. We all heard about the team's horrible toxic culture. Your comments confirm more clearly for everyone, which many of us already knew. Your comments are further documentation in a slew of reasons why this Sox team is so horribly bad.

Thank you also Lance Lynn for confirming these Middleton statements are accurate. I know there is always a risk to come out like you did, especially the fact you'll be a free agent after the season. It was very disturbing to hear Kenyan's comments this morning. However now with your follow up comments, it just confirms the cancer that does exist on this Sox team.

A big thank you in advance to any future ex-Sox players who have the courage to come out publicly to tell the truth about this dysfunctional FO and manager/coaching staff. 

I guess for many of us who were blasting this manager early on, who had to take a lot criticism that it wasn't Grifol's fault, due to the fact Rick Hahn gave Pedro a bad roster. We now know our thoughts about Grifol were accurate and vindicated.

We can now close the book on whether Pedro Grifol is a good manager or not and deserving of another shot next year as the White Sox manager in 2024. 

Of course whether Grifol is fired or brought back is not the point. We will never be able to change the fact that JR, KW and RH are inept executive clowns. As a result, if they choose to keep Grifol next year, that would simply be their normal MO crap, which none of us would be shocked by...maybe pissed and irate...but not shocked.

At least we now realize what many of us said all along, Pedro Grifol was a huge mistake being hired. Now there is no more gray area about why Grifol is seriously "over his head" managing the White Sox. He needs to be given his walking papers. 

[South Side Fireworks Man]

1 minute ago, A-Train to 35th said:

Your missing the main obstacle...JR's not eating the cash on another coaching mistake.  Jeff Torborg was our last competent manager since 1989-91.

Ozzie was good for the first three years he managed.  

[DirtySox]

Good for Tim if true.

Also wasn't Yaz the guy who stuck up for Tim during the whole Josh Donaldson "Jackie" incident?

[South Side Hit Men]

10 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

He wasn't physically capable of being that guy anymore.

Still his reputation is exactly what this team needed and still needs. We can't afford to have another manager who is a punching bag for this clubhouse and while getting rid of the worst offenders is important too it's much easier to fix the clubhouse by getting a manager who will hold players accountable

The problem is Hahn is too insecure and incapable of having an experienced and proven quality manager under him.

It was reported Hahn had zero interest in Bochy this offseason, despite being the best fit both strategically and professionally.

[Texsox]

Why is it when we talk about folks quietly quitting and just not caring immediately Ozzie's name is mentioned?

[bmags]

Maybe i'm too familiar with white sox...

but has any other clubhouse come close to these stories now?

2016 spring training / drake laroche as cult leader
2016 season Chris Sale scissors
2023 season kenyon middleton dragging dirty laundry
2023 season TA/Grandal fight exposed

the only other team I can remember on this level was that one terrible 2012 red sox year that fired Tito? was that 2012?

[Balta1701]

2 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Why is it when we talk about folks quietly quitting and just not caring immediately Ozzie's name is mentioned?

There appeared to be consequences for it when he did so. 

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

Maybe i'm too familiar with white sox...

but has any other clubhouse come close to these stories now?

2016 spring training / drake laroche as cult leader
2016 season Chris Sale scissors
2023 season kenyon middleton dragging dirty laundry
2023 season TA/Grandal fight exposed

the only other team I can remember on this level was that one terrible 2012 red sox year that fired Tito? was that 2012?

Pushed Epstein out too.

Chicken and beer with Lackey Beckett Lester, etc.

[hogan873]

Before the season ends, the Sox will be brawling in their own dugout like in Major League 2.

[A-Train to 35th]

2 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

I know I'm more old school than most here, but I always thought everyone on the team should wear the same uniform - that includes shoes, sleeves, etc.  Everyone should be in uniform team colors.

I remember Konerko didn't even want to wear a "C" on his uniform as captain because he was concerned that it was "a difference in the uniform."

Thank you!!!!!!! Even my wife comments on the neon yellow and green of Moncada, remember Eloys open shirt (disgraceful).  Now the Moncada cancer is affecting Colas.   Get him outta here.

[Quin]

13 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

Good for Tim if true.

Also wasn't Yaz the guy who stuck up for Tim during the whole Josh Donaldson "Jackie" incident?

Yes. Which makes me sad.

[South Side Hit Men]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

There appeared to be consequences for it when he did so. 

See, Kenny was right. People are held accountable in the White Sox Organization.

[Dick Allen]

17 minutes ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Thank you Kenyan Middleton for being brave enough and convicted to tell the truth about this Sox team, that evidently has no rules and accountability. We all heard about the team's horrible toxic culture. Your comments confirm more clearly for everyone, which many of us already knew. Your comments are further documentation in a slew of reasons why this Sox team is so horribly bad.

Thank you also Lance Lynn for confirming these Middleton statements are accurate. I know there is always a risk to come out like you did, especially the fact you'll be a free agent after the season. It was very disturbing to hear Kenyan's comments this morning. However now with your follow up comments, it just confirms the cancer that does exist on this Sox team.

A big thank you in advance to any future ex-Sox players who have the courage to come out publicly to tell the truth about this dysfunctional FO and manager/coaching staff. 

I guess for many of us who were blasting this manager early on, who had to take a lot criticism that it wasn't Grifol's fault, due to the fact Rick Hahn gave Pedro a bad roster. We now know our thoughts about Grifol were accurate and vindicated.

We can now close the book on whether Pedro Grifol is a good manager or not and deserving of another shot next year as the White Sox manager in 2024. 

Of course whether Grifol is fired or brought back is not the point. We will never be able to change the fact that JR, KW and RH are inept executive clowns. As a result, if they choose to keep Grifol next year, that would simply be their normal MO crap, which none of us would be shocked by...maybe pissed and irate...but not shocked.

At least we now realize what many of us said all along, Pedro Grifol was a huge mistake being hired. Now there is no more gray area about why Grifol is seriously "over his head" managing the White Sox. He needs to be given his walking papers. 

It probably doesn't seem like it to them, but Middleton did the White Sox a favor. They have to do something now.

[hogan873]

This is probably the most excitement we've had as fans this season.  I imagine more and more stories will start leaking.  Hahn will talk at 3:15 and make it seem like everything is under control and there are no issues.