Keynan Middleton rips White Sox 'no rules' culture

[Leonard Washington]

Montoyo was fired from the Jays for similar reasons…the players did whatever they wanted. 
 

in addition to firing him, they made a conscious effort to trade players they identified as problematic to the lack of professionalism in the clubhouse, namely Teoscar and Gurriel. That’s not speculation on my behalf. 
 

Montoyo is fine with an authoritarian voice to accompany him. Nobody respects Grifol. 

[fathom]

Just now, Joshua Strong said:

This, this right here is exactly right.

You would think a manager would covet the opportunity to be able to come in and clean up a culture and instill a new one but Grifol has proven to be incapable of that.

The Sox need to cut bait, he’s awful in game. He doesn’t optimize the roster and he’s allowed for the culture to somehow get worse under his watch. Don’t even get home started on him salivating over Sal Perez. The dude is a clown. 

Also goes to show you that it’s time to move on from some of these core guys who clearly aren’t leaders.  I would have taken Montgomery and Burger 100 times out of 100 over Timmy/Yoan

[Leonard Washington]

Just now, fathom said:

Also goes to show you that it’s time to move on from some of these core guys who clearly aren’t leaders.  I would have taken Montgomery and Burger 100 times out of 100 over Timmy/Yoan

It’s fine to have guys that aren’t leaders, so long as they aren’t expected to be. 

[Lip Man 1]

Here you go, it's up at the Sun-Times:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/8/6/23822523/ex-white-sox-reliever-keynan-middleton-says-team-has-no-rules-accountability-yankees

Monday is going to be VERY interesting. 

[Vote4Pedro]

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Also goes to show you that it’s time to move on from some of these core guys who clearly aren’t leaders.  I would have taken Montgomery and Burger 100 times out of 100 over Timmy/Yoan

I’ve been trying to sell this idea for about 2 years now. TA, Eloy and Moncada have to go. Unfortunately you are stuck with Moncada but these guys are not the dudes. Red flags have been raised many times with every single one of these players. 

[Balta1701]

7 minutes ago, Vote4Pedro said:

I’ve been trying to sell this idea for about 2 years now. TA, Eloy and Moncada have to go. Unfortunately you are stuck with Moncada but these guys are not the dudes. Red flags have been raised many times with every single one of these players. 

We are all saying the same thing though. These players are symptoms of the problem, as is Grifol. The “don’t work too hard, but make sure everyone tells the boss we’re doing great” attitude goes all the way to the top. They hire managers who push that attitude, they hire coaches who tell the players to take it easy and tell the boss everything’s great. They keep players who go along with this plan. This is what the top two guys want, because then they don’t have to work too hard either.

[Vote4Pedro]

This team from the top down acted like they arrived before ever doing so. 
 

Hahn- Talk to me after the parade.

TA- We are the best team in the league. 

Moncada- Too busy making music videos and worried about his brand to care about his play on the field.

Eloy- Mr. Happy just to be there and takes nothing seriously. 

[TheBooneLoganEra]

19 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

He can’t have operated like this with the Royals, can he? They’re not well run overall but but there can’t be that many organizations that tolerate this lack of professionalism, right? He was under Matheny and Yost there, that can’t be stuff they’d be ok with right? Both have won a lot of stuff and coached in multiple spots, including St Louis and Milwaukee.

I thought this exact same thing. How is it possible he has almost zero redeeming qualities as an MLB manager? There isn't one thing he's done well here and it really isn't hard to see that. 

I dont see how any free agent with legitimate talent signs here after this. Any small prayer they had at competing next year will be gone unless wholesale changes occur. 

[fathom]

Things I wouldn’t be shocked to also hear:

1) training staff messing up

2) lack of preparation to face opposing pitchers

3) minor league development inconsistencies

4) huge clubhouse divide 

[Vote4Pedro]

Just now, fathom said:

Things I wouldn’t be shocked to also hear:

1) training staff messing up

2) lack of preparation to face opposing pitchers

3) minor league development inconsistencies

4) huge clubhouse divide 

Somehow Hahn will flip this article into making Katz the lone scape goat here and save his own ass along with Pedro. 

[fathom]

1 minute ago, Vote4Pedro said:

This team from the top down acted like they arrived before ever doing so. 
 

Hahn- Talk to me after the parade.

TA- We are the best team in the league. 

Moncada- Too busy making music videos and worried about his brand to care about his play on the field.

Eloy- Mr. Happy just to be there and takes nothing seriously. 

It’s why so many loved Burger this year.  It was a guy who got the most out of his ability by running hard and hitting the ball in the air.  He was the opposite of quite a few of the main guys.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

26 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

He can’t have operated like this with the Royals, can he? They’re not well run overall but but there can’t be that many organizations that tolerate this lack of professionalism, right? He was under Matheny and Yost there, that can’t be stuff they’d be ok with right? Both have won a lot of stuff and coached in multiple spots, including St Louis and Milwaukee.

It's shocking that the Royals passed on him for their Manager opening.

[TheBooneLoganEra]

I think we can officially kiss Soxfest goodbye after this one.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

2 minutes ago, fathom said:

It’s why so many loved Burger this year.  It was a guy who got the most out of his ability by running hard and hitting the ball in the air.  He was the opposite of quite a few of the main guys.

But I heard he was a microcosm of all that is wrong with this team. ?

[Quin]

3 minutes ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

But I heard he was a microcosm of all that is wrong with this team. ?

[Quin]

8 minutes ago, fathom said:

It’s why so many loved Burger this year.  It was a guy who got the most out of his ability by running hard and hitting the ball in the air.  He was the opposite of quite a few of the main guys.

When we saw the Sox play the Mets my best friend said that Jake Burger makes him think he can play major league baseball and I just started laughing.

Makes no sense that he can haul ass like he can, but he gets the most out of his body.

[Boopa1219]

Man, I really miss Rick Renteria. 

[almagest]

40 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Yep. Ricky is the only manager in the Hahn era who instilled any sort of discipline or accountability on the team. Before him, neither Robin Ventura or Rick Hahn could handle a 13 year old child, had to call Daddy Kenny in to resolve the situation which led to a team schism.

Jerry should have fired Kenny, Rick and Cooper after Kenny nuked Ozzie's authority of his DRs by extending Kenny's clubhouse snitch Cooper behind Ozzie's back, despite having an agreement to jointly evaluate the coaching staff after the 2011 season.

Kenny, Rick and Robin should all have been fired in 2015, certainly in 2016. Then again Paxson should have been fired for choking Vinnie Del Negro, Ditto Kenny's "heated exchange" with Greg Walker. This culture is Jerry Reinsdorf's MO. He cherishes it, keep the rubbish beneath him fighting each other so they don't raise a spear at him.

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/3/9/2038527/john-paxson-bulls-vinny-del-negro

https://www.nbcsports.com/mlb/news/white-sox-gm-kenny-williams-has-heated-exchange-with-hitting-coach-greg-walker

Kenny was right about Beckham’s swing

[South Side Hit Men]

Just now, Joshua Strong said:

Man, I really miss Rick Renteria. 

I joined here at the end of August 2020, and didn't understand where all the bashing of Ricky came from. Then I saw many links and quotes here of Jerry's asshole studio crew and Stone's twitter account. 

People are easily persuaded by corporate media, including MLB owner's paid broadcasters. It sounded like a ruse orchestrated by Jerry to open up a job he promised to Tony.

Ricky should have been given the final year of his contract,. Rick Hahn should never have been allowed to stay and sign another manager.

[BigHurt3515]

As soon as we got these young guys they were touted as the next core to bring us to multiple playoffs and a championship by the front office, given contracts they never proved to deserve, fired the only manager who had any rules, and then hired an old fart and a guy from a bottom five organization. Nobody showed them how to win, nobody held them accountable from the beginning (by giving them money for just being a good prospect), nobody in the front office gave a s%*# so why should they? A majority of this "core" expected the success to be handed to them just like our great GM & owner handed them free money and basically told them they are going to win but never gave them the tools or environment to do so. 

This whole organization is a sham, top to bottom. They have no idea what they are doing and they don't give a s%*#

Edited August 7, 2023 by BigHurt3515

[BigHurt3515]

4 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

I joined here at the end of August 2020, and didn't understand where all the bashing of Ricky came from. Then I saw many links and quotes here of Jerry's asshole studio crew and Stone's twitter account. 

People are easily persuaded by corporate media, including MLB owner's paid broadcasters. It sounded like a ruse orchestrated by Jerry to open up a job he promised to Tony.

Ricky should have been given the final year of his contract,. Rick Hahn should never have been allowed to stay and sign another manager.

I mean Ricky was not good with in game management, he was a great players manager though and it seemed like they all respected him. Dumbass front office (or Jerry) decided the next logical move was to bring in an alcoholic dinosaur to be manager

[HOFHurt35]

42 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

He can’t have operated like this with the Royals, can he? They’re not well run overall but but there can’t be that many organizations that tolerate this lack of professionalism, right? He was under Matheny and Yost there, that can’t be stuff they’d be ok with right? Both have won a lot of stuff and coached in multiple spots, including St Louis and Milwaukee.

They must have gone full 180 in "allowing players to be themselves", which basically means no rules in the clubhouse. 

Part of the criticism for LaRussa was him "not allowing to let players be themselves", or that being  the narrative the Media wanted to paint (Dan Bernstein and the rest of the Score Radio).   But half the time, LaRussa was asleep.  So was he running a tight ship which then the players complained and therefore they brought in a Tree Stump with no rules to manage instead?  Grifol is literally a Tree Stump (I'm convinced) 

Maybe Grifol was the dude the lady was referring to as  "That Motherfucker back there is not real."

 

[South Side Hit Men]

3 minutes ago, almagest said:

Kenny was right about Beckham’s swing

I agree, but that was not the right way to broach the issue. The lack of discipline goes to the C-Suite.

Nobody should be fighting or choking subordinates, especially your top management. Jerry not only tolerates it, but excuses/condones and possibly encourages it with zero consequences.

Middleton is right, it starts at the top.

Quote

"Leadership in general. They say s%*# rolls downhill...."When I got to spring training, I heard a lot of the same stuff was happening last year," 

[caulfield12]

Abreu Keuchel Kelly Lynn...one of those guys will be next to clear the air.

[reiks12]

Pedro is clearly not the man for the job, but this mess predates him. It starts at the top.

Sox fans need to organize and do a Sell the Team night like in Oakland. Hell, we play the A's soon. It would be amazing to get a sellout playoff type atmosphere chanting SELL THE TEAM. This would embarass the FO more and also show some love to our A's brothers and sisters.

Anyone know some big Sox personalities to get this rolling?