No Official plans to announce for SoxFest

[Balta1701]

25 minutes ago, Milkman delivers said:

Sounds pretty spot on. I’d say one component for sure is that he has a real disdain for the fans. That’s something that seemed like a goofy conspiracy theory a while ago, but now actually seems like it has to be true.

I don't know if others remember this, but there was a time about 10 years ago where it seemed like the White Sox's marketing and PR staff were the hardest working, highest quality folks in the business. Every year we'd get another story about them going over the top to earn fans - some kid would send out 30 letters to teams trying to figure out who to cheer for, and they'd get 29 no responses and one full box of White Sox merchandise or stuff like that. They'd wind up with the fan there, and also a really nice PR article out of it.

It feels like they have the exact opposite perspective right now. They no longer act like they have to work hard to earn fans, they expect everyone to be a fan of theirs because they deserve it, not because they work for it any more. 

[ThirdGen]

2 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

So JR is trying to destroy the value of his franchise to justify a move?

OK then...

Please stop. 

And remember while JR holds absolute power it does state in his contract that he can be removed if he does something illegal, seems to be losing his faculties or is doing something that can be considered malfeasance.   

Deliberately doing something to harm the sale value of the team would certainly justify removal by the minority owners. You don't see them doing that do you?

And there are NO GUARANTEES MLB would approve a move or approve the Sox moving to that city.

From a business standpoint that's a tremendous risk to take...no?

 

It's pretty much impossible to destroy the value of a franchise. The A's were purchased in 2005 for $180 million, and are worth around $1.2 Billion despite the fact that they have done everything possible to drive away fans as they relocate. that value will skyrocket once they are in their shiny new ballpark, something that will never happen here but could easily happen in Nashville.

Explain why the Sox do nothing from a marketing standpoint, continuously drive away season ticket holders by ignoring them and jacking up prices, hire the least competent people for key positions, and don't bother hiring even the minimal number of staff to work the ballpark. Nobody is this incompetent, and you can argue with JR's decisions over the years, but there was never a point in his ownership before the last couple of years where everything went to s%*# at the same time as has happened. 

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, ThirdGen said:

It's pretty much impossible to destroy the value of a franchise. The A's were purchased in 2005 for $180 million, and are worth around $1.2 Billion despite the fact that they have done everything possible to drive away fans as they relocate. that value will skyrocket once they are in their shiny new ballpark, something that will never happen here but could easily happen in Nashville.

Explain why the Sox do nothing from a marketing standpoint, continuously drive away season ticket holders by ignoring them and jacking up prices, hire the least competent people for key positions, and don't bother hiring even the minimal number of staff to work the ballpark. Nobody is this incompetent, and you can argue with JR's decisions over the years, but there was never a point in his ownership before the last couple of years where everything went to s%*# at the same time as has happened. 

Let's test your theory.

Forbes says the Sox are worth 1.75 billion, let's assume a sale would go for a round figure of two billion.

Deliberately trying to devalue the franchise means JR might "only" get 1.6 billion.

You don't think JR wants every dime he can get in your scenario? There is a big difference between two billion and 1.6 billion.

If money doesn't matter why hasn't he sold the team already? Because as I wrote in a story in August 2022, the tax hit from capital gains would be roughly 200 million dollars and that's not even counting the Illinois state tax hit.

To answer your question it is because JR is soon to be 88, his franchise continues to make loads of money despite poor results on the field and mediocre attendance due to the almost unlimited revenue streams both domestically and internationally and simply because he honestly feels HE knows best. Full stop. 

He tells people what to do and if they want to keep working in the organization and drawing a handsome salary they go along with things.

It is simply unbelievable to think he is deliberately wrecking the franchise, He's not that insane. He genuinely thinks he is doing things the right way and that the fans, the media, certain agents simply do not matter in the least. And he isn't going to change now as he gets older. He's had this attitude of arrogance for decades, it is simply getting worse as he ages. 

So again, with respect...please stop. 

Edited October 25, 2023 by Lip Man 1

[ThirdGen]

29 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Let's test your theory.

Forbes says the Sox are worth 1.75 billion, let's assume a sale would go for a round figure of two billion.

Deliberately trying to devalue the franchise means JR might "only" get 1.6 billion.

You don't think JR wants every dime he can get in your scenario? There is a big difference between two billion and 1.6 billion.

If money doesn't matter why hasn't he sold the team already? Because as I wrote in a story in August 2022, the tax hit from capital gains would be roughly 200 million dollars and that's not even counting the Illinois state tax hit.

To answer your question it is because JR is soon to be 88, his franchise continues to make loads of money despite poor results on the field and mediocre attendance due to the almost unlimited revenue streams both domestically and internationally and simply because he honestly feels HE knows best. Full stop. 

He tells people what to do and if they want to keep working in the organization and drawing a handsome salary they go along with things.

It is simply unbelievable to think he is deliberately wrecking the franchise, He's not that insane. He genuinely thinks he is doing things the right way and that the fans, the media, certain agents simply do not matter in the least. And he isn't going to change now as he gets older. He's had this attitude of arrogance for decades, it is simply getting worse as he ages. 

So again, with respect...please stop. 

You are contradicting yourself. In one instance you are saying he will never sell the team while alive, which is likely accurate. On the other hand you say he wouldn't lower the value because he won't get as much when he sells.

He may be 88, but if I didn't know that I would swear he is in his seventies.  Unless he has something going on we don't know about its possible he could pull a Virginia McCaskey.

And there is definitely a ballpark battle coming up. He is not getting more money from Illinois. If Nashville, or anyone else offers a new park with a ballpark village and all the cash flows that come with it the Sox are gone.And probably worth a billion more instantly. And MLB didn't protect us during possible moves to St Pete, Denver, Seattle or Milwaukee. Why would they now, especially if attendance and tv ratings are low?

[Dick Allen]

JRs sons are trying to buy up shares of the team. JR wrote a letter to his investors telling them if they are interested in selling, maybe, possibly, sell to them.

[South Side Hit Men]

1 hour ago, ThirdGen said:

You are contradicting yourself. In one instance you are saying he will never sell the team while alive, which is likely accurate. On the other hand you say he wouldn't lower the value because he won't get as much when he sells.

He may be 88, but if I didn't know that I would swear he is in his seventies.  Unless he has something going on we don't know about its possible he could pull a Virginia McCaskey.

And there is definitely a ballpark battle coming up. He is not getting more money from Illinois. If Nashville, or anyone else offers a new park with a ballpark village and all the cash flows that come with it the Sox are gone.And probably worth a billion more instantly. And MLB didn't protect us during possible moves to St Pete, Denver, Seattle or Milwaukee. Why would they now, especially if attendance and tv ratings are low?

 

37 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

JRs sons are trying to buy up shares of the team. JR wrote a letter to his investors telling them if they are interested in selling, maybe, possibly, sell to them.

Yes. Also these shares are sold privately with no public market, at a share price determined by Jerry, not based on publicly known or estimated information as determined by Forbes.

Cutting costs increases current net income and cash flow. Jerry can’t be sued for short term fluctuations in the Fair Value of privately held shares. Cutting short term expense, at the risk of losing revenue with less fans can be argued to be a good short and long term management strategy.

And from what I read, shareholders wanting to cash out are stuck with Jerry’s price, which is a fraction of what they would receive if all shares were sold to a new ownership group.

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:

JRs sons are trying to buy up shares of the team. JR wrote a letter to his investors telling them if they are interested in selling, maybe, possibly, sell to them.

Haven't heard about this, could you link to a story or something?

That makes some sense, JR would want no possible complications when he's gone and the family sells. 

[South Side Hit Men]

1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Haven't heard about this, could you link to a story or something?

That makes some sense, JR would want no possible complications when he's gone and the family sells. 

This has been reported and these purchases have been going on for years.

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/consumer-products/more-reinsdorfs-want-stake-sox

Not sure how you missed this, or why you think it’s ironclad the Reinsdorf’s will liquidate after Jerry’s death. Jerry will be dead, the heirs will sell only if it makes sense financially, not because of some public statement from years / decades ago.

[ThirdGen]

7 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

This has been reported and these purchases have been going on for years.

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/consumer-products/more-reinsdorfs-want-stake-sox

Not sure how you missed this, or why you think it’s ironclad the Reinsdorf’s will liquidate after Jerry’s death. Jerry will be dead, the heirs will sell only if it makes sense financially, not because of some public statement from years / decades ago.

If you look at Michael Reinsdorf career history, which includes minor league ownership and stadium construction projects, along with running the Bulls, it is impossible to not consider the possibility he would want to run the Sox.Its almost as if his entire career is an internship to prepare for this.

[JoeC]

3 hours ago, ThirdGen said:

If you look at Michael Reinsdorf career history, which includes minor league ownership and stadium construction projects, along with running the Bulls, it is impossible to not consider the possibility he would want to run the Sox.Its almost as if his entire career is an internship to prepare for this.

Oof.

We even get the wrong "owner's kid named "Michael."

Edited October 26, 2023 by JoeC
I learned how to spell "wrong"

[The Grinder]

4 hours ago, ThirdGen said:

If you look at Michael Reinsdorf career history, which includes minor league ownership and stadium construction projects, along with running the Bulls, it is impossible to not consider the possibility he would want to run the Sox.Its almost as if his entire career is an internship to prepare for this.

Whats the saying, the apple doesnt fall to far from the tree?

[Lip Man 1]

11 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

This has been reported and these purchases have been going on for years.

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/consumer-products/more-reinsdorfs-want-stake-sox

Not sure how you missed this, or why you think it’s ironclad the Reinsdorf’s will liquidate after Jerry’s death. Jerry will be dead, the heirs will sell only if it makes sense financially, not because of some public statement from years / decades ago.

It's all about making money and JR claims you can't do that in baseball (LOL) which is why he wants his family to keep the Bulls and sell the Sox. 

[ThirdGen]

1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said:

It's all about making money and JR claims you can't do that in baseball (LOL) which is why he wants his family to keep the Bulls and sell the Sox. 

I suspect that statement was made just to keep the BS narrative that baseball owners don't make money. The investment in the team grew from $20 million (which included the team, ballpark and lots of land) to $1.5 billion maybe (team only) in the time he has been around. Doubt he is actually telling his family to dump this investment, particularly since his son seems to enjoy this type of investment.

[Dick Allen]

6 hours ago, ThirdGen said:

If you look at Michael Reinsdorf career history, which includes minor league ownership and stadium construction projects, along with running the Bulls, it is impossible to not consider the possibility he would want to run the Sox.Its almost as if his entire career is an internship to prepare for this.

Many years ago, I worked with a guy that had some business with Michael Reinsdorf. At least back then, he was talking about running the Sox a bit differently than his father.  It's been years since I've been privy to any info, but I still think he wants a shot, but wouldn't be surprised if he uses his father's blueprint, 

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, ThirdGen said:

I suspect that statement was made just to keep the BS narrative that baseball owners don't make money. The investment in the team grew from $20 million (which included the team, ballpark and lots of land) to $1.5 billion maybe (team only) in the time he has been around. Doubt he is actually telling his family to dump this investment, particularly since his son seems to enjoy this type of investment.

Don't forget that significant share in NBC Sports Chicago that was leveraged by co-ownership of the Bulls as well as controlling GRC parking rights.

[pcq]