Sox conducting internal interviews to see if dramatic changes are needed

[caulfield12]

12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I will write the rest with detailed examples and market surveys if actually paid to do so. Wouldn’t take that long tbh.

If you went to Michigan or Northwestern, you've got a good shot at getting the consulting contract.

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

If you went to Michigan or Northwestern, you've got a good shot at getting the consulting contract.

This is covered specifically under the management bulletpoints.

[South Side Hit Men]

8 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

If you went to Michigan or Northwestern, you've got a good shot at getting the consulting contract.

They need to be expunged, both on campus and 35th & Shields.

 

"Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall."

- Proverbs 16:18 KJV

 

North Shore gonna North Shore. Go Cats!

 

Go Blow!

[SoCalChiSox]

12 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The most important thing is to get Hahn/Haber out of the building. Literally everything will change when those idiots are gone.

Nah. 

So long as JR refuses to make massive investment as in R&D, analytics and farm development, it doesn't matter who is in charge. We've got other teams with literally 4-5 times the employees dedicated to these areas. You can't win with a skeleton crew in critical infrastructure.

And JR micromanaging things compounds the problem.

A new GM is just rearranging the chairs on the deck of the Titanic.

[Stinky Stanky]

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

If you went to Michigan or Northwestern, you've got a good shot at getting the consulting contract.

Eureka!  We have found the consultant we need, someone with a record of success.  Fitz!

[JoeC]

Live shot of the meeting

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by JoeC

[FT35]

Surprised they are doing this survey in-season.  The focus should most certainly not be on development now because it could compromise their chance to win tonight’s MLB game.  

[JoeC]

Dammit, I can’t get the image thing working on iphone….

I fixed it

Edited August 21, 2023 by JoeC

[bmags]

17 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Hey everyone, are we doing bad?

 

everyone shakes their head no

We just need more time!

[bmags]

The last year I’ve found it helpful to see JR as just a landlord. Other owners may get into this to try to build the next great dynasty. Some may want to build or keep the next great sports brand.

But the bulls and Sox are just like investment properties to JR.

And he could have found some contractors that told him that investing more could lead to a higher price point to rent, but that’s risky! Jerry’s puttin in the old cash, only suckers get left holding the bag.

and so in two franchises he found partners who stayed for two decades telling him that he could do the bare minimum, get back a decent competitive team, and just sit back and collect.

And when it collapsed for the bulls we saw what that approach left - a skeleton org compared to the rest of the league. A scouting staff of like 4 people, no player dev, a training staff more likely to kill a player than save them.

And now the Sox will pull back the curtains and we’ll see the same. The equivalent of a child playing with adults. The hard work of building some world class operations instead farmed out to outside consultants. Penny wise and pound foolish every step of the way.

A horrible owner, but a pretty normal landlord.

[SCCWS]

I think the parking lot attendants could be in trouble.  Too many for so few cars. 

[Chicago White Sox]

I view this as a positive thing.  This season has been one of the most disastrous in franchise history.  Not just underperformance from many key players, but we also have outed clubhouse turmoil, players not pulling for each other, a lack of urgency to win, a clearly incompetent manager, and a GM who continues to be terrible in free agency, failed to fill critical holes, and secured zero pitching depth in the upper minors.  It should be as clear as day to everyone involved that something is rotten in this org and Jerry has finally acknowledged that.  For better or worse, that’s the first step to change.  I am optimistic for the first time in forever that Hahn might not make it to next season.  That won’t solve the root of the problem, but would theoretically be a start to fixing this s%*# show.

[Dick Allen]

50 minutes ago, bmags said:

The last year I’ve found it helpful to see JR as just a landlord. Other owners may get into this to try to build the next great dynasty. Some may want to build or keep the next great sports brand.

But the bulls and Sox are just like investment properties to JR.

And he could have found some contractors that told him that investing more could lead to a higher price point to rent, but that’s risky! Jerry’s puttin in the old cash, only suckers get left holding the bag.

and so in two franchises he found partners who stayed for two decades telling him that he could do the bare minimum, get back a decent competitive team, and just sit back and collect.

And when it collapsed for the bulls we saw what that approach left - a skeleton org compared to the rest of the league. A scouting staff of like 4 people, no player dev, a training staff more likely to kill a player than save them.

And now the Sox will pull back the curtains and we’ll see the same. The equivalent of a child playing with adults. The hard work of building some world class operations instead farmed out to outside consultants. Penny wise and pound foolish every step of the way.

A horrible owner, but a pretty normal landlord.

It's so true. He's basically admitted he no longer is trying to win championships with the Bulls. Just trying to be good enough to collect some playoff money, without ever having to pay for a team that can win it all. 

[Tnetennba]

6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I view this as a positive thing.  This season has been one of the most disastrous in franchise history.  Not just underperformance from many key players, but we also have outed clubhouse turmoil, players not pulling for each other, a lack of urgency to win, a clearly incompetent manager, and a GM who continues to be terrible in free agency, failed to fill critical holes, and secured zero pitching depth in the upper minors.  It should be as clear as day to everyone involved that something is rotten in this org and Jerry has finally acknowledged that.  For better or worse, that’s the first step to change.  I am optimistic for the first time in forever that Hahn might not make it to next season.  That won’t solve the root of the problem, but would theoretically be a start to fixing this s%*# show.

And we will celebrate Hahn’s departure for all of 5 minutes before Getz or Haber or KW Jr is formally announced…

[Dick Allen]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I view this as a positive thing.  This season has been one of the most disastrous in franchise history.  Not just underperformance from many key players, but we also have outed clubhouse turmoil, players not pulling for each other, a lack of urgency to win, a clearly incompetent manager, and a GM who continues to be terrible in free agency, failed to fill critical holes, and secured zero pitching depth in the upper minors.  It should be as clear as day to everyone involved that something is rotten in this org and Jerry has finally acknowledged that.  For better or worse, that’s the first step to change.  I am optimistic for the first time in forever that Hahn might not make it to next season.  That won’t solve the root of the problem, but would theoretically be a start to fixing this s%*# show.

While it's better than nothing, it still raises questions. Can't he see the results? Really, almost everyone has to go. Getz has been as bad as his job as Hahn. Grifol may be the worst manager in baseball. I don't know what KW brings to the table. The team obviously tuned out any coaching, or the coaching is horrible. Either way, they need to go.  The only chance I see here is if KW pulls a Pax, and tells JR, the group in place can't do it. It's been proven. But his ego is huge, so that is probably off the table. Other than that, I expect a token firing or reassigment at best. 

[Chicago White Sox]

13 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

While it's better than nothing, it still raises questions. Can't he see the results? Really, almost everyone has to go. Getz has been as bad as his job as Hahn. Grifol may be the worst manager in baseball. I don't know what KW brings to the table. The team obviously tuned out any coaching, or the coaching is horrible. Either way, they need to go.  The only chance I see here is if KW pulls a Pax, and tells JR, the group in place can't do it. It's been proven. But his ego is huge, so that is probably off the table. Other than that, I expect a token firing or reassigment at best. 

Yes, we need wholesale change, but we all know that Hahn is a problem.  There is zero downside risk to firing him and going with someone else.  Realistically, we need to bring in someone from the outside to be our President of Baseball Ops and let them scorch Earth this org.  I think outside of Shirley & Paddy, all other members of the front office should be on the chopping block.  But I’ll take a Hahn firing as an appetizer to hopefully bigger things to come.

[Bob Sacamano]

3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Yes, we need wholesale change, but we all know that Hahn is a problem.  There is zero downside risk to firing him and going with someone else.  Realistically, we need to bring in someone from the outside to be our President of Baseball Ops and let them scorch Earth this org.  I think outside of Shirley & Paddy, all other members of the front office should be on the chopping block.  But I’ll take a Hahn firing as an appetizer to hopefully bigger things to come.

Knowing the way this organization works, it's far more likely KW retires, Hahn gets promoted (puke) to replace him as President of Baseball Ops, and then Haber gets promoted to GM.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Bob Sacamano

[bmags]

25 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

While it's better than nothing, it still raises questions. Can't he see the results? Really, almost everyone has to go. Getz has been as bad as his job as Hahn. Grifol may be the worst manager in baseball. I don't know what KW brings to the table. The team obviously tuned out any coaching, or the coaching is horrible. Either way, they need to go.  The only chance I see here is if KW pulls a Pax, and tells JR, the group in place can't do it. It's been proven. But his ego is huge, so that is probably off the table. Other than that, I expect a token firing or reassigment at best. 

This is horrifying to say but I think if a normal org was doing it, it would make sense. The bears (why I'm saying it's horrifying, the bears are our upside org for the sox to follow) had a consultant come in mid-season last year to evaluate. It got some ridicule, but I believe it was performed so that they knew which parts of the org needed overhaul so they could pin down what candidates had experience in that area. So even though we could see the results for the bears, it was a useful exercise.

With the sox, I believe it's being done to judge how little they have to do...i.e. a scapegoat as you say.

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, bmags said:

This is horrifying to say but I think if a normal org was doing it, it would make sense. The bears (why I'm saying it's horrifying, the bears are our upside org for the sox to follow) had a consultant come in mid-season last year to evaluate. It got some ridicule, but I believe it was performed so that they knew which parts of the org needed overhaul so they could pin down what candidates had experience in that area. So even though we could see the results for the bears, it was a useful exercise.

With the sox, I believe it's being done to judge how little they have to do...i.e. a scapegoat as you say.

One factor that should be very concerning is the idea of Reinsdorf doing this work himself. Much of their long-term staff has spent their time working in an insular environment where praising the performance of the bosses is the highest good. They’re now being given the opportunity to praise their supervisors to the highest authority in the organization - they’ve spent years training for this opportunity, the chance to heap praise on the people who employ them to an even higher authority who isn’t likely to question their praise.

[nitetrain8601]

13 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Yes, we need wholesale change, but we all know that Hahn is a problem.  There is zero downside risk to firing him and going with someone else.  Realistically, we need to bring in someone from the outside to be our President of Baseball Ops and let them scorch Earth this org.  I think outside of Shirley & Paddy, all other members of the front office should be on the chopping block.  But I’ll take a Hahn firing as an appetizer to hopefully bigger things to come.

Shirley and Paddy need to go too. It's rotten to the core. But as someone else stated, until they spend money on something, they're not going anywhere.

If you suck at Scouting, Development, International Signings, then you need to pony up the money for FAs to cover that gap. If you suck at FA because you're too cheap, or your team misevaluates players, or you have a GM who loves to spend the dough on a bullpen, then you better have a strong Scouting, Development and International presence. 

The Sox do neither. And that's why the entire thing is rotten. It's caught up to them. 

Add to the fact that they hired Pedro Grifol who clearly knows nothing about what he's doing (he's worse than Trestman was for the Bears) from a losing organization who they tried to upsell to the fanbase when that losing organization would rather not hire him, and you have a team in shambles. Is help on the way? Nope. Getz and KW Jr have done nothing in the minors. Our analytics department is a step away from non-existent. And we have a FO who they allowed to lead the draft and trade deadline when they're more concerned with keeping their job everyday.

 

They need a Theo, but they would never commit the money that Theo commands, not just for the ballclub, but to have an actual infrastructure put in place. Sox thought they were hiring Theo-lite when they promoted Hahn. Another failure.

 

 

[FloydBannister1983]

19 hours ago, wegner said:

30 games under .500 is quite bad....they aren't there yet....better do those internal interviews now before they get there.

Need to go 17-21 to get there.  Seems very attainable.

[caulfield12]

52 minutes ago, nitetrain8601 said:

Shirley and Paddy need to go too. It's rotten to the core. But as someone else stated, until they spend money on something, they're not going anywhere.

If you suck at Scouting, Development, International Signings, then you need to pony up the money for FAs to cover that gap. If you suck at FA because you're too cheap, or your team misevaluates players, or you have a GM who loves to spend the dough on a bullpen, then you better have a strong Scouting, Development and International presence. 

The Sox do neither. And that's why the entire thing is rotten. It's caught up to them. 

Add to the fact that they hired Pedro Grifol who clearly knows nothing about what he's doing (he's worse than Trestman was for the Bears) from a losing organization who they tried to upsell to the fanbase when that losing organization would rather not hire him, and you have a team in shambles. Is help on the way? Nope. Getz and KW Jr have done nothing in the minors. Our analytics department is a step away from non-existent. And we have a FO who they allowed to lead the draft and trade deadline when they're more concerned with keeping their job everyday.

 

They need a Theo, but they would never commit the money that Theo commands, not just for the ballclub, but to have an actual infrastructure put in place. Sox thought they were hiring Theo-lite when they promoted Hahn. Another failure.

 

 

He did win the 2022 Intl Scout of the Year Award or whatever.

https://www.soxon35th.com/marco-paddy-named-2022-international-scout-of-the-year/

And some of those moves looked much better years ago.

If you include Tatis Jr. and almost getting Juan Soto (or was it Vladdy Jr.?) it's pretty remarkable for just one decade.

No Yogurt Sanchez lol?  And Micker Adolfo was prominently featured haha.

Finally, can anyone realistically blame Paddy more than Hahn/JR for our having to send away international bonus pool money so many times....?

And half the time he's being directed to sign "Sox relatives" like Elijah Tatis, Juan Uribe Jr., Franklyn Reyes and a cousin of Vladimir Guerrero to go along with Yoelkis Cespedes' brother, etc.  

 

• Oct. 2023 – 1B Jose Abreu (six years, $68 million).
• May 2017 – OF Luis Robert ($26 million bonus).
• Jan. 2021 – OF Yoelqui Cespedes ($2.05 million bonus).
• Feb. 2021 – RHP Norge Vera ($1.5 million bonus)
• Jan. 2022 – OFs Oscar Colas ($2.7 million bonus) and Erick Hernandez ($1 million bonus).

Edited August 21, 2023 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

57 minutes ago, nitetrain8601 said:

Shirley and Paddy need to go too. It's rotten to the core. But as someone else stated, until they spend money on something, they're not going anywhere.

If you suck at Scouting, Development, International Signings, then you need to pony up the money for FAs to cover that gap. If you suck at FA because you're too cheap, or your team misevaluates players, or you have a GM who loves to spend the dough on a bullpen, then you better have a strong Scouting, Development and International presence. 

The Sox do neither. And that's why the entire thing is rotten. It's caught up to them. 

Add to the fact that they hired Pedro Grifol who clearly knows nothing about what he's doing (he's worse than Trestman was for the Bears) from a losing organization who they tried to upsell to the fanbase when that losing organization would rather not hire him, and you have a team in shambles. Is help on the way? Nope. Getz and KW Jr have done nothing in the minors. Our analytics department is a step away from non-existent. And we have a FO who they allowed to lead the draft and trade deadline when they're more concerned with keeping their job everyday.

 

They need a Theo, but they would never commit the money that Theo commands, not just for the ballclub, but to have an actual infrastructure put in place. Sox thought they were hiring Theo-lite when they promoted Hahn. Another failure.

 

 

Only one thing in common.

Expensive post secondary educations.

Epstein has two WS runs (multiple retools) and can take credit for a number of the positive/popular innovations from the Commissioner's Office impacting baseball this year.

[pcq]

When you have a good thing just keep it going

 

[Milkman delivers]

Results: They are needed.

I saved you time. Pay me.