Reinsdorf considers moving White Sox out of Guaranteed Rate Field or selling team

[South Side Hit Men]

30 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

Las Vegas is its own entity and should not be compared to anything because there's truly nothing like it. It can make up for lack of TV money with the insane amount of tourist dollars spent there, although I do think the move still holds some risk.  Even then it's a lot closer to Oakland than Nashville is to Chicago. And Chicago is one of the biggest tourist destinations in the world while Nashville is Nashville. But that's not what would drive this anyway, it's still the 10 million to 1 million population difference.

MLB won't succeed in Vegas the same was as the Golden Knights and Raiders. I have family there and spend 2-3 + weeks there each year. it cannot make up for lack of TV money with tourist money. Revenue sharing will continue to be their primary source of income.

The Golden Knights are their first professional team, had an epic first season. Many Canadian snowbirds attend games as do domestic tourists come in for their one/two games a year. They only have to sell 717,500 tickets a season for 100% capacity.

The NFL is widely popular, out of town fans can plan a Vegas weekend to visit their team. They only have to sell 520,000 (8 X 65,000) tickets a year, piece of cake.

MLB has 81 home dates a year. Even with a limited capacity of 30,000 or less, you are talking 2,400,000 tickets, or over 3 times what the Golden Knights sell. Also, Summer weather Memorial Day through mid September is 100 F - 110 F every day, so a closed roof nearly every game which sucks for fans.

Also, TV revenue will be among the lowest in MLB, between the small base and the fact their existing TV broadcast ATT sucks. Vegas is a three shift town, so you're not going to get the same interest watching 162 games as you do 16 NFL or even 82 for the Stanley Cup champs. The A's owner is even more of a piece of s%*# than Jerry Reinsdorf, has ZERO intent on building a championship team. He's only interested in the grift, maximizing revenue sharing and taxpayer handouts and minimizing payroll.

 

[SoxAce]

I might be alone but I would still root for the Sox if they're in Nashville or Vegas. I grew up a Dolphins fan before switching to the Bears after Marino retired so the whole "I have to root for a Chicago team cuz I live here" isn't exactly a thing. Hell, there's people here who root for the White Sox and they grew up outside Chicago. The White Sox runs deep with me I'm not switching up and I'll never, ever root for the Cubs.

[greg775]

13 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Also, Summer weather Memorial Day through mid September is 100 F - 110 F every day, so a closed roof nearly every game which sucks for fans.

 

You make some good points. I don't think fans will mind the dome. They realize it HAS to be indoor baseball. nobody wants to sit in 100 degree temps. So they'll accept the dome. I will say I've been to minor league games at the old Cashman Field before they built a new one. About 9;30 p.m. near the end of the game it'd be very pleasant. Vegas being Vegas maybe they could have 9 p.m. starts and make it a thing. That way no dome.

[TheBooneLoganEra]

16 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Lori gets the blame for the Bears. Nothing to do with Johnson. At least that's my take.

She does, and should, but my point was Johnson should be even more motivated to keep it from happening again. 

[caulfield12]

16 minutes ago, greg775 said:

You make some good points. I don't think fans will mind the dome. They realize it HAS to be indoor baseball. nobody wants to sit in 100 degree temps. So they'll accept the dome. I will say I've been to minor league games at the old Cashman Field before they built a new one. About 9;30 p.m. near the end of the game it'd be very pleasant. Vegas being Vegas maybe they could have 9 p.m. starts and make it a thing. That way no dome.

Except for Friday and Saturday night games....9 pm starting times would be unworkable for the majority of families out there.

[tray]

This discussion makes me sick. How low can our feelings about  being Sox fans go? And we know Cub fans and trolls are so digging this.

[Stinky Stanky]

5 hours ago, fathom said:

I think it’s the opposite and the past two seasons has killed his love for the game and it’s expediting a possible sale.

87 years old and knows he'll never get to the promised land before he croaks... There's merit in your post.  Time for him and the rest of us to face reality.  And he did buy land on the west side recently.  And Nashville is a great town.  Music, barbecue, weather.   Great place to live and work.  Wouldn't blame him if he did, but then he has to unload the Bulls too.

 

 

Edited August 22, 2023 by Stinky Stanky

[Lip Man 1]

3 hours ago, Sarava said:

Or maybe the time is right to sell, and it will more than make up for the capital gains taxes? What if a bidding war starts and the Sox sell for $3 billion or more? His family will make more than anticipated, even compared to what they previously would have expected from selling the team after his death.

Given the fact that JR does not own the stadium or the land that it is on, I'd be stunned if they got 3 billion when the perception (even according to Forbes) is that the club is "only" worth 2 billion. 

A bidding war is always possible although they'd have a better chance of that happening if they weren't so dismal since the start of the 2007 season.

[Lip Man 1]

3 hours ago, JTB said:

When you say “things must be worse than we are being led to believe,” what are you referring to?  Not arguing.  Genuinely curious.  What’s worse than we’re led to believe…losing money, hates the losing, tired of being drug through the mud?

As I wrote in my State of the Sox story from November things along the lines of infighting and back stabbing from front office employees vying for the title of "president," his wife passing away last year, his close friend (almost like a son) Kenny Williams going to retire soon and possibly health issues.

Like I wrote if he's willing to take a 200 million dollar (estimated) tax hit just from capital gains to say nothing of the Illinois state tax, something must really be wrong...because he's not losing money. 

[South Side Hit Men]

2 hours ago, greg775 said:

You make some good points. I don't think fans will mind the dome. They realize it HAS to be indoor baseball. nobody wants to sit in 100 degree temps. So they'll accept the dome. I will say I've been to minor league games at the old Cashman Field before they built a new one. About 9;30 p.m. near the end of the game it'd be very pleasant. Vegas being Vegas maybe they could have 9 p.m. starts and make it a thing. That way no dome.

They have no dome for Summerlin AAA games which are all night games. They have mesh seats, draw about 7,000 per game (8,200 is capacity), or under four thousand less than their parent A's team in Oakland.

They may draw well to start. Casinos will purchase suites and blocks of seats. I still think the A's will remain in the bottom third of attendance after perhaps an initial honeymoon, with less revenue and attendance than if they took Oakland's offer for the Howard Terminal Site that they delayed and ultimately did not respond within the agreement deadline date.

 

1 hour ago, tray said:

This discussion makes me sick. How low can our feelings about being Sox fans go? 

Affluent Sportsmen do not concern themselves with the feelings of fans, only the amount of lucre they can extricate from the world at large.

Next stop, Dante's Inferno.

1. First Circle of Hell - Limbo
2. Second Circle of Hell - Lust
3. Third Circle of Hell - Gluttony
4. Fourth Circle of Hell - Greed
5. Fifth Circle of Hell - Wrath
6. Sixth Circle of Hell - Heresy
7. Seventh Circle of Hell - Violence
8. Eight Circle of Hell - Fraud
9. Ninth Circle of Hell - Treachery
10. Center of Hell - Jerry's Owner Box

[South Side Hit Men]

The Sox need to go 6-31 .162 (55-107 overall) for the Sox to be under .500 regular season for Jerry's entire ownership reign entering 2024 (3,368 - 3,369). It would also mark the most losses in a season in White Sox history.

The Sox are overall losers in the playoffs (17-19) under Jerry, so they can end with an 8-29 .216 record (57-105 overall) this season to clinch a losing record across all regular season + playoff games (3,887 - 3,388).

Jerry Reinsdorf is the only owner who appears on the list below three times.

The Eleven White Sox Seasons below .400 Winning Percentage:

(ties excluded)

1. .325 49-102 1932 - J. Louis Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lew Fonseca
2. .336 51-101 1948 - Grace Comiskey, Frank Lane, Ted Lyons
3. .346 56-106 1970 - John Allyn, Ed Short and Don Gutteridge (both worked through 9/1 game. Ed fired 9/1, Don 9/2).
4. .349 53-99 1934 - J. Louis Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lou Fonseca (4-11) & Jimmy Dykes (49-88)
5. .366 56-97 1931 - Charles Comiskey (died October 26), Harry Grabiner, Donie Bush
6. .383 59-93 1929 - Charles Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lena Blackburne
7. .383 62-100 2018 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Ricky Renteria
8. .389 63-99 2013 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Robin Ventura
9. .390 60-94 1950 - Grace Comiskey, Frank Lane, Jack Onslow (8-22) and Red Corriden (52-72)
10. .392 49-76 YTD 2023 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Pedro Grifol
11. .398 64-97 1976 - Bill Veeck, Roland Hemond, Paul Richards

[dohnut]

6 hours ago, SoxAce said:

I might be alone but I would still root for the Sox if they're in Nashville or Vegas. I grew up a Dolphins fan before switching to the Bears after Marino retired so the whole "I have to root for a Chicago team cuz I live here" isn't exactly a thing. Hell, there's people here who root for the White Sox and they grew up outside Chicago. The White Sox runs deep with me I'm not switching up and I'll never, ever root for the Cubs.

I grew up in Chicago and I rooted for the Raiders as a kid (Bo Jackson on Tecmo Bowl was unstoppable!).

But, the White Sox - in Chicago - is home.

If they leave the state - and their 100+ year history - it’s just not the same team for me. I’d probably be done with MLB.

Edited August 22, 2023 by dohnut

[Texsox]

A week ago I was accused of trolling each time I said move the damn team. Nice to see the idea is gaining momentum. 

Chicagoland may go a couple seasons without a second team but someone will move in. Possible expansion to 32 teams. The Cubs will see a bump in attendance as the casual fans enjoy the northside. Life goes on. 

Nashville is a great city and road trips to see the Sox will be fun for the folks that keep them as their team. I think a big stadium in Mexico is better for baseball. 

During JRs ownership the Bulls managed to build a solid team that complimented Jordan.  He also got new stadiums built for the city that we've all enjoyed. I'm not going to take that away from him. 

It's tough to win championships in sports. He got himself a bunch. He made a lot of money for his investors. At the moment things are bad and the criticism is flying his way. But in the end I'm certain he's happy with the life he choose. 

[Texsox]

27 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

The Sox need to go 6-31 .162 (55-107 overall) for the Sox to be under .500 regular season for Jerry's entire ownership reign entering 2024 (3,368 - 3,369). It would also mark the most losses in a season in White Sox history.

The Sox are overall losers in the playoffs (17-19) under Jerry, so they can end with an 8-29 .216 record (57-105 overall) this season to clinch a losing record across all regular season + playoff games (3,887 - 3,388).

Jerry Reinsdorf is the only owner who appears on the list below three times.

The Eleven White Sox Seasons below .400 Winning Percentage:

(ties excluded)

1. .325 49-102 1932 - J. Louis Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lew Fonseca
2. .336 51-101 1948 - Grace Comiskey, Frank Lane, Ted Lyons
3. .346 56-106 1970 - John Allyn, Ed Short and Don Gutteridge (both worked through 9/1 game. Ed fired 9/1, Don 9/2).
4. .349 53-99 1934 - J. Louis Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lou Fonseca (4-11) & Jimmy Dykes (49-88)
5. .366 56-97 1931 - Charles Comiskey (died October 26), Harry Grabiner, Donie Bush
6. .383 59-93 1929 - Charles Comiskey, Harry Grabiner, Lena Blackburne
7. .383 62-100 2018 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Ricky Renteria
8. .389 63-99 2013 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Robin Ventura
9. .390 60-94 1950 - Grace Comiskey, Frank Lane, Jack Onslow (8-22) and Red Corriden (52-72)
10. .392 49-76 YTD 2023 - Jerry Reinsdorf, Rick Hahn, Pedro Grifol
11. .398 64-97 1976 - Bill Veeck, Roland Hemond, Paul Richards

I don't believe anyone had helped me to hate this franchise as much as you. Thank you. I blindly just enjoyed Sox baseball. Kind of thought we were a middle of the road franchise. I never knew just how fucked up this franchise has been. 

[dohnut]

19 minutes ago, Texsox said:

A week ago I was accused of trolling each time I said move the damn team. Nice to see the idea is gaining momentum. 

Chicagoland may go a couple seasons without a second team but someone will move in. Possible expansion to 32 teams. The Cubs will see a bump in attendance as the casual fans enjoy the northside. Life goes on.

“Move the team” is definitely not gaining momentum.

“Sell the team” chants are getting louder and harder to ignore.

 

[Kyyle23]

31 minutes ago, Texsox said:

A week ago I was accused of trolling each time I said move the damn team. Nice to see the idea is gaining momentum. 

Chicagoland may go a couple seasons without a second team but someone will move in. Possible expansion to 32 teams. The Cubs will see a bump in attendance as the casual fans enjoy the northside. Life goes on. 

Nashville is a great city and road trips to see the Sox will be fun for the folks that keep them as their team. I think a big stadium in Mexico is better for baseball. 

During JRs ownership the Bulls managed to build a solid team that complimented Jordan.  He also got new stadiums built for the city that we've all enjoyed. I'm not going to take that away from him. 

It's tough to win championships in sports. He got himself a bunch. He made a lot of money for his investors. At the moment things are bad and the criticism is flying his way. But in the end I'm certain he's happy with the life he choose. 

Man this post sucks.  You have lost the thread 

[South Side Hit Men]

34 minutes ago, Texsox said:

I don't believe anyone had helped me to hate this franchise as much as you. Thank you. I blindly just enjoyed Sox baseball. Kind of thought we were a middle of the road franchise. I never knew just how fucked up this franchise has been. 

The Sox have an all time winning record (.502 11th among the 30 teams). Mediocre, not great, not poor. Postseason is poor, though the Sox are the only team to have their entire legitimate multi-championship core decimated by Judge KKK Landis. Things would have turned out a lot differently if that had not happened, could have been the American League's best team throughout history.

Just laid out Jerry's tenure is approaching under .500 status. Gives the vast majority of us wanting a new owner, not a new city, something to follow for the rest of this season.

[Texsox]

10 hours ago, flavum said:

Go ahead. Fucking leave.

 

10 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

 

Screw him and the horse he road in on.  He should just sell, take his profit and go away.  Or if they contract this franchise, so be it.  

 

10 hours ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

Unless it's with different, competent owners.

 

9 hours ago, Capn12 said:

 

I gotta tell ya...if its new ownership, and it becomes the Nashville White Sox...I'm strangely ok with it. I have no connection to the city of Chicago though, of course. I've never lived there, or had any affiliation, my fandom came from an Auburn TE drafted many moons ago. Any solution, regardless, has to involve someone new at the helm.

 

8 hours ago, NCsoxfan said:

Would become one of the top franchises in MLB if they had the right owner and moved to Nashville. Skate to where the puck is going and GTH out of Illinois.

can’t believe I’m saying it but it’s true 

 

7 hours ago, SoxAce said:

I might be alone but I would still root for the Sox if they're in Nashville or Vegas. I grew up a Dolphins fan before switching to the Bears after Marino retired so the whole "I have to root for a Chicago team cuz I live here" isn't exactly a thing. Hell, there's people here who root for the White Sox and they grew up outside Chicago. The White Sox runs deep with me I'm not switching up and I'll never, ever root for the Cubs.

But much like the folks that embrace the tank but don't enjoy the losing the "just move asshole" crowd doesn't want to see the team actually move. 

Chanting sell the team for a couple decades has done nothing. That shows engagement and caring. Indifference is what would really hurt. He knows he can win back passionate White Sox fans. He can f*** us over all day and we keep coming back as soon as the product in the field is good. 

Winning back fans who don't care is much, much, harder. That will get his attention. 

[TheFutureIsNear]

Im no expert, but moving a bad team to a new city in Tennessee seems like a sure fire disaster. Maybe you’ll get more fans in the beginning out of novelty, but no way that’s a sustainable market.

 

Jerry should try this really crazy money making idea…put effort into having a winning team. Really out there idea, I know. And since he has shown that he has zero interest in doing that for a decade plus, the obvious answer is sell the team. Take your billions and move on Jerry.

[pcq]

This team is diseased. They should move to Hodgkins. 

[NO!!MARY!!!]

9 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Folks: Relax...this is all a moot point (or a moo point, the point of view of a cow as Joey said on "Friends...")\

JR won't be around in six years.

Not so sure about that. Look at Virginia McCaskey. 

[Bananarchy]

As far as I’m concerned if the White Sox go to Nashville, they’re dead and buried. 
 

MLB would probably be dead to me

[pcq]

44 minutes ago, Vacheron said:

As far as I’m concerned if the White Sox go to Nashville, they’re dead and buried. 
 

MLB would probably be dead to me

Charlotte is way bigger. Maybe Nashville has more growth potential coming. 

[Kyyle23]

The score talked about this in the 7:00 hour and there was a lot of really good call ins and opinions, in case anyone wants to check it out when they post it 

[Chicago White Sox]

2 hours ago, Texsox said:

A week ago I was accused of trolling each time I said move the damn team. Nice to see the idea is gaining momentum. 

Chicagoland may go a couple seasons without a second team but someone will move in. Possible expansion to 32 teams. The Cubs will see a bump in attendance as the casual fans enjoy the northside. Life goes on. 

Nashville is a great city and road trips to see the Sox will be fun for the folks that keep them as their team. I think a big stadium in Mexico is better for baseball. 

During JRs ownership the Bulls managed to build a solid team that complimented Jordan.  He also got new stadiums built for the city that we've all enjoyed. I'm not going to take that away from him. 

It's tough to win championships in sports. He got himself a bunch. He made a lot of money for his investors. At the moment things are bad and the criticism is flying his way. But in the end I'm certain he's happy with the life he choose. 

Your recent bout of trolling really sucks and this post is pure garbage…I truly hope everything in your life is going ok because it’s a very odd for someone to take joy in posting nonsense like this.