Fire Chris Getz

[Rocky]

  On 4/7/2025 at 4:50 PM, Tony said:

There are multiple things that can be true at the same time

- It's hard for people to get over that it's Chris Getz running things, and I understand why, I'm one of them. The last regime was here far too long, and had very little success outside of one magical season, and Getz had a key role in this organization for a good chunk of that. He should not have been rewarded for those "efforts" with a promotion, but here we are. It's absolutely fair to have doubts, he has done NOTHING to earn anyones trust or respect. 

 

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The regime hasn't changed.  You can't expect a different circus when the clowns are the same. 

[Fielder Jones]

No, do not fire Chris Getz. He modernized the org and took a lot of bad practices out of the White Sox. he is getting no money to work with, so it is Jerry that would be fired. Think of Getz as someone who saw all the bad things going on (Kenny flying in to watch Keenyn Walker once and taking him 3 rounds earlier than scouting wanted) and decided when he had his chance he would achieve some synergy throughout the org

We have like minded people in a few spots, including in the dugout. Lets let that play out.

[WhiteSox2023]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:04 PM, WestEddy said:

Amazingly, I don't disagree with any of this. 

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Agreed as well.  When will Getz finally get some money to spend is one question.

The biggest problem with the rebuild is that players that needed to be contributors are looking awful — Vargas, C. Montgomery, and Sosa to a lesser extent.  And Robert looks like he has no desire to up his game to get moved to a competitor.  They still don’t have enough positional talent in the pipeline and I don’t see that magically improving anytime soon.  And that’s before mentioning the 6 pitchers that need TJ surgery.

Edited April 7 by WhiteSox2023

[fathom]

Getz seems better suited for a Director of Operations role than a GM.  

[Rocky]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:20 PM, fathom said:

Getz seems better suited for a Director of Operations role than a GM.  

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For the Gary Railcats. 

[Quin]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:12 PM, Fielder Jones said:

No, do not fire Chris Getz. He modernized the org and took a lot of bad practices out of the White Sox. he is getting no money to work with, so it is Jerry that would be fired. Think of Getz as someone who saw all the bad things going on (Kenny flying in to watch Keenyn Walker once and taking him 3 rounds earlier than scouting wanted) and decided when he had his chance he would achieve some synergy throughout the org

We have like minded people in a few spots, including in the dugout. Lets let that play out.

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People keep saying this, but until we see tangible results, I don't think it has any substance.

• Colson looked like a surefire thing two years ago, now suddenly he looks like he's destined to become a Moncada clone (if that). Ramos has fallen off. Nastrini imploded.
• The GM is still trading positive assets for nothing.
• The team is still signing worthless vets and trotting them out, thus burning cash.
  • Last year was a master class in veteran churn for absolutely no reason.
• Giving up on young guys to play up said worthless vets.
• Getting taken advantage of by San Diego.
• Trading left-handed ace to the Red Sox.

If anything, Getz is showing that he's a retread with a fresh coat of paint that can use Gmail.

[caulfield12]

  On 4/7/2025 at 4:50 PM, Tony said:

There are multiple things that can be true at the same time

 

- When Getz was given the job, it became clear this was going to be a full tear down. They did the same thing in 2016 offseason, where they went from 78 wins to 67. Then they fell to 62 wins in 2018. While winning 41 games and setting records in 2024 should have never happened and was embarrassing, I agree with the idea the difference between winning 55 games or 65 games doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things, it's still shitty baseball. 

- It's hard for people to get over that it's Chris Getz running things, and I understand why, I'm one of them. The last regime was here far too long, and had very little success outside of one magical season, and Getz had a key role in this organization for a good chunk of that. He should not have been rewarded for those "efforts" with a promotion, but here we are. It's absolutely fair to have doubts, he has done NOTHING to earn anyones trust or respect. 

- He was tasked with a very difficult job, as the organization needed a full enema and he was working with very few assets. The 2016 rebuild was a very different situation. There were some attractive and valuable pieces on the roster, they couldn't figure out (or didn't have the right resources) to surround their stars with talent. You fast forward to 2020/2021, from the trades of 2016 they acquired Moncada, Eloy, Giolito, Cease and Kopech. Add in the Cuban Pipeline with Abreu and Robert, FINALLY drafting a hitter that has MLB success in Anderson, and you created a core. It obviously didn't work, but the formula still makes sense today. Getz had Crochet/Fedde/Robert to work with. The Crochet deal seems "good" right now, time will tell. The Fedde deal was awful, it was awful then and it's still awful now. And he seemingly missed the timing on trading Robert, who knows what that eventually nets them. So he doesn't have the same runway that Hahn had, and some of that is on Getz. 

- I think it's a fair assumption to make that if Getz had it his way, he would have spent more on areas of the team for 2025, so they aren't flirting with 41 wins again in 2025. We know who the owner is, he knew they were going to be REALLY bad again, why spend another 25-30 million on the team when it takes the Sox from 48 wins to 58 wins? Why spend that? 

All of this is to say something most (if not all) of us already know. Nothing changes until Jerry is gone. They won't outspend teams in free agency. They won't outspend anyone in player development. They won't be cutting edge on new philosophies and strategy.  They won't draft exceptionally well (when have they EVER?) So what does that leave you? An incredibly mediocre franchise, which is exactly what they have been under the ownership of Jerry Reinsdorf. 

It's really not any more complicated or nuanced than that. 

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The only great drafts were under Larry Himes in the mid to late 80s...combined with the Sosa/Alvarez trade.

[southsider2k5]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:20 PM, fathom said:

Getz seems better suited for a Director of Operations role than a GM.  

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I still want to see that all of these amazing hires actually change something.  The early results haven't been any different than what we just saw, and it seems like trades have been markedly worse.

[chitownsportsfan]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:45 PM, southsider2k5 said:

I still want to see that all of these amazing hires actually change something.  The early results haven't been any different than what we just saw, and it seems like trades have been markedly worse.

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Nothing has changed other than the tune sung by those still cashing JRs checks. They'll continue to change the tune whenever it suits them in order to stay employed.

[WestEddy]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:27 PM, Quin said:

People keep saying this, but until we see tangible results, I don't think it has any substance.

• Colson looked like a surefire thing two years ago, now suddenly he looks like he's destined to become a Moncada clone (if that). Ramos has fallen off. Nastrini imploded.
• The GM is still trading positive assets for nothing.
• The team is still signing worthless vets and trotting them out, thus burning cash.
  • Last year was a master class in veteran churn for absolutely no reason.
• Giving up on young guys to play up said worthless vets.
• Getting taken advantage of by San Diego.
• Trading left-handed ace to the Red Sox.

If anything, Getz is showing that he's a retread with a fresh coat of paint that can use Gmail.

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That would be great if they got a Moncada clone out of the 2021 #22 pick. There's not been a lot of 30 bWAR players taken at that low a pick in the last 30 years, and only 6 players have eclipsed Moncada's 14.2 bWAR. I suppose Jackson Merrill will be the Mike Trout to Colson's Jared Mitchell. 

Trading positive assets for "nothing" would be trading Chase Meidroth for cash considerations. Trading an A-ball bullpen arm for a pro bullpen arm isn't "nothing". 

The young guys who were given up on for vets are even more worthless. '

Trading Crochet to the Red Sox was a great move. You'll probably see two starting offensive players from that trade on this year's team. 

[Fielder Jones]

no GM candidate worth his salt wants to come here when it's already been said the team will be sold upon Jerry's death. Jerry is old. so Getz was the only way Kenny and Rick were going to be out. Jerry didnt even really want to move on from Kenny and Rick but he had enough people in his ear leaguewide to finally convince him of it.

[chitownsportsfan]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:49 PM, Fielder Jones said:

no GM candidate worth his salt wants to come here when it's already been said the team will be sold upon Jerry's death. Jerry is old. so Getz was the only way Kenny and Rick were going to be out. Jerry didnt even really want to move on from Kenny and Rick but he had enough people in his ear leaguewide to finally convince him of it.

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Yup. It was a half assed measure. Like usual. We're just going to have to sit here and suffer and this clueless loser either croaks or finally moves on from the franchise he's ruined.

[southsider2k5]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:49 PM, Fielder Jones said:

no GM candidate worth his salt wants to come here when it's already been said the team will be sold upon Jerry's death. Jerry is old. so Getz was the only way Kenny and Rick were going to be out. Jerry didnt even really want to move on from Kenny and Rick but he had enough people in his ear leaguewide to finally convince him of it.

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If Jerry has destroyed this organization to the point where no one is willing to come work here, we have a whole other set of problems.  The idea that it could be because of ownership change is laughable.  There are exactly 30 of these opportunities available, and about half a dozen people out there who really have the ability to turn down one of them to wait for the next one.

[WestEddy]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:12 PM, WhiteSox2023 said:

Agreed as well.  When will Getz finally get some money to spend is one question.

The biggest problem with the rebuild is that players that needed to be contributors are looking awful — Vargas, C. Montgomery, and Sosa to a lesser extent.  And Robert looks like he has no desire to up his game to get moved to a competitor.  They still don’t have enough positional talent in the pipeline and I don’t see that magically improving anytime soon.  And that’s before mentioning the 6 pitchers that need TJ surgery.

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I don't want to keep complaining about bad luck, but they should have brought a dozen Brandon Drury's to ST. I would say they could expect reasonable production from 4 position players right now ( Benny / catching platoon / RF platoon / Baldwin ). I would immediately cut Amaya and Maton and promote Meidroth and Teel. That at least plugs semi-productive bats in at SS and DH, and you wait for the weather to warm up for Robert and Vaughn to start hitting. Vargas...maybe he needs the weather to change, too. It's still only 9 games. 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

  On 4/7/2025 at 4:13 PM, WestEddy said:

They're in a rebuild, and obviously, in a money crunch. If billionaires saw this financial shake-up coming after November, the paucity of spending from owners who cry poor makes more sense. 

I don't wonder why you were pessimistic. I wonder why you expected anything more. I predicted 54 wins. This is what a 108-loss team looks like. 

I could post all this every day, but I don't think that's what you're looking for. 

Oh, and even if they signed Ha-Seong Kim, they'd still be running this infield crew out there every day. You've been silent about that. 

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They should have signed Kim, Alonso, and Santander. Traded Robert, which I’ve been harping on for two years now, and signed a CF like Bader. Put together an actual competitive lineup instead of whatever this is.

Who said I expected more than 54 wins? If I had to pick a number I’d say 45 wins but wouldn’t be at all surprised if they ended up with less wins than 2024. The lineup is atrocious and the bullpen is still highly suspect.

This division sucks right now and if they made an honest effort in constructing an mlb lineup and signing a decent high leverage arm they’d be in the mix. It is what it is. As long as Jerry doesn’t care about winning ballgames, I don’t care much either. I’ve probably watched a total of 6 innings so far this season and don’t plan on attending games in person until they have a serious owner in place.

[Fielder Jones]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:53 PM, southsider2k5 said:

If Jerry has destroyed this organization to the point where no one is willing to come work here, we have a whole other set of problems.  The idea that it could be because of ownership change is laughable.  There are exactly 30 of these opportunities available, and about half a dozen people out there who really have the ability to turn down one of them to wait for the next one.

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Someone would take this job sure but the point here is Getz is as good as the non-Stearns class. Elite GMs would go elsewhere, whereas the Sox would hire 'some guy'. so why not hire the one then that was intimately affected by the particular things Kenny and Rick were doing wrong? I think it is a jump to a conclusion that Chris liked what Hahn/KW were doing and wanted to continue it. The way theyve formed the org and brought in outside voices speaks to that.

[southsider2k5]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:58 PM, Fielder Jones said:

Someone would take this job sure but the point here is Getz is as good as the non-Stearns class. Elite GMs would go elsewhere, whereas the Sox would hire 'some guy'. so why not hire the one then that was intimately affected by the particular things Kenny and Rick were doing wrong? I think it is a jump to a conclusion that Chris liked what Hahn/KW were doing and wanted to continue it. The way theyve formed the org and brought in outside voices speaks to that.

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So how did we get the guys below Getz to come here, if talent isn't willing to do so?  Are they not talented?

[chitownsportsfan]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:53 PM, southsider2k5 said:

If Jerry has destroyed this organization to the point where no one is willing to come work here, we have a whole other set of problems.  The idea that it could be because of ownership change is laughable.  There are exactly 30 of these opportunities available, and about half a dozen people out there who really have the ability to turn down one of them to wait for the next one.

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Disagree, it's ownership. Change owners and you'll get better employees.

[Quin]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:49 PM, WestEddy said:

That would be great if they got a Moncada clone out of the 2021 #22 pick. There's not been a lot of 30 bWAR players taken at that low a pick in the last 30 years, and only 6 players have eclipsed Moncada's 14.2 bWAR. I suppose Jackson Merrill will be the Mike Trout to Colson's Jared Mitchell. 

Trading positive assets for "nothing" would be trading Chase Meidroth for cash considerations. Trading an A-ball bullpen arm for a pro bullpen arm isn't "nothing". 

The young guys who were given up on for vets are even more worthless. '

Trading Crochet to the Red Sox was a great move. You'll probably see two starting offensive players from that trade on this year's team. 

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• I mean, I'd be fine with getting a Moncada at #22 in the draft and I guess a lot of others would be, as long as he smiles. But not a lot of guys smile through back pain. I never really disliked Moncada, because the only players I've ever personally disliked are the ones who assholes or Dominic Fletcher (and I will own that that is not fair to him).
• Plenty of other trades, but right now Booser is more likely to turn back into a pumpkin than ever give the Sox value.
• Young guys > vets on rebuilding teams. It's the principle of the matter, because it was a lost season, so why the f*** were they running a bunch of shambling corpses out there?
• I liked the Crochet trade. I'm just saying, for all the talk of change, we had a copy+paste.

[southsider2k5]

  On 4/7/2025 at 6:00 PM, chitownsportsfan said:

Disagree, it's ownership. Change owners and you'll get better employees.

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It is Jerry's unwillingness to hire someone who will challenge him and the status quo that stopped us from hiring an outside candidate, and not a potential change in ownership at some unknown point in time that prevented it causing them to settle for Getz.  That is glaringly obvious to me.

[chitownsportsfan]

  On 4/7/2025 at 6:04 PM, southsider2k5 said:

It is Jerry's unwillingness to hire someone who will challenge him and the status quo that stopped us from hiring an outside candidate, and not a potential change in ownership at some unknown point in time that prevented it causing them to settle for Getz.  That is glaringly obvious to me.

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Well then we are in agreement.

[Quin]

Here's the ultimate question:

Would any non-Reinsdorf owner have hired Chris Getz? Would they hire him today?

[WestEddy]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:58 PM, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

They should have signed Kim, Alonso, and Santander. Traded Robert, which I’ve been harping on for two years now, and signed a CF like Bader. Put together an actual competitive lineup instead of whatever this is.

Who said I expected more than 54 wins? If I had to pick a number I’d say 45 wins but wouldn’t be at all surprised if they ended up with less wins than 2024. The lineup is atrocious and the bullpen is still highly suspect.

This division sucks right now and if they made an honest effort in constructing an mlb lineup and signing a decent high leverage arm they’d be in the mix. It is what it is. As long as Jerry doesn’t care about winning ballgames, I don’t care much either. I’ve probably watched a total of 6 innings so far this season and don’t plan on attending games in person until they have a serious owner in place.

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They're in a rebuild, and I believe their TV deal (or lack thereof) has them in a money crunch. Whatever you've been harping on is meaningless if there was no chance of it happening. And being in a rebuild, it would be colossally dumb to punt two draft picks. I think your counter-argument has been "well, we've not done well in the draft, so who cares about that?" To which I would reply, "And all of the free agents we sign collapse and become albatross signings for their duration. So, if we signed Alonso, Kim and Santander, they would all hit like Jacob Amaya. Book it." And I would be right. 

Edited April 7 by WestEddy

[caulfield12]

  On 4/7/2025 at 5:49 PM, WestEddy said:

That would be great if they got a Moncada clone out of the 2021 #22 pick. There's not been a lot of 30 bWAR players taken at that low a pick in the last 30 years, and only 6 players have eclipsed Moncada's 14.2 bWAR. I suppose Jackson Merrill will be the Mike Trout to Colson's Jared Mitchell. 

Trading positive assets for "nothing" would be trading Chase Meidroth for cash considerations. Trading an A-ball bullpen arm for a pro bullpen arm isn't "nothing". 

The young guys who were given up on for vets are even more worthless. '

Trading Crochet to the Red Sox was a great move. You'll probably see two starting offensive players from that trade on this year's team. 

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Just like the Red Sox trading Betts instead of signing/extending him was a great move?

The majority of time when you move young Cy Young or MVP caliber position players for prospects, it usually backfires.  There are always exceptions...but certainly wouldn't bet on it working out consistently.

(Just ask Pirates' fans.)

Even when management pushes those future cost-savings moves, as with Bloom...it still gets the GM fired eventually.  And the amount of overall talent on the big league roster certainly continues to decrease.

Leading to a perpetual cycle or series of rebuilds...

[southsider2k5]

  On 4/7/2025 at 6:09 PM, WestEddy said:

They're in a rebuild, and I believe their TV deal (or lack thereof) has them in a money crunch. Whatever you've been harping on is meaningless if there was no chance of it happening. And being in a rebuild, it would be colossally dumb to punt two draft picks. I think you're counter-argument has been "well, we've not done well in the draft, so who cares about that?" To which I would reply, "And all of the free agents we sign collapse and become albatross signings for their duration. So, if we signed Alonso, Kim and Santander, they would all hit like Jacob Amaya. Book it." And I would be right. 

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We just did that for 30's something middle relievers.