Merkin teases possibility of a Clevinger reunion in 2024, Kopech in rotation next year as well

[TaylorStSox]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Then maybe don't lecture people on the vital importance of Due Process in this case if you're wishy washy about it on other cases.

Just calling out bigotry where I see it. 

[Balta1701]

Just now, TaylorStSox said:

Just calling out bigotry where I see it. 

As are we.

[WestEddy]

Just now, TaylorStSox said:

The OJ bit was predictable, and another logical fallacy. 

Okay, this just made me laugh out loud. Of course it's "predictable". Because it's the most obvious refutation of your argument. 

You're calling people "fascist" for not liking Mike Clevenger, and not wanting him on their favorite team based on descriptions of his behavior given under oath. 

I'm going to stop here, because it's not my job to make you admit you're wrong. "Believe women" is still a thing. Just because the emotional abuse didn't rise to the level of an MLB ban, or even imprisonment doesn't mean that everybody detailing it under oath was lying. 

[hogan873]

I have my doubts about Clevinger returning.  He pitched well this year, and there will probably be teams out there willing to give him a better deal than the mutual option.  Even with his baggage, I think he'll get a multiple year deal from someone.

[pcq]

Nothing has been proven so it is a matter of opinion. I would let it pass. 

[Highland]

Next year, the Sox will be a losing team with or without Clevinger. I am for losing without him.

[BamaDoc]

I think multiple things can be true.

1) Clevinger has been our best pitcher and he may be a scumbag.

2) I know that custody battles bring out the worst in many people.  Two doctors were divorcing.  The dad had to put his son on the stand to refute his wife's claims that the bruises in a picture were not caused by him but actually when she fell down the stairs.  Putting a kid in that situation is awful and she was a child psychologist.

3) Not an attorney disclaimer. I don't think Clevinger was cleared.  Criminally, they decided the evidence was unlikely to prove him guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.  I don't know if a civil suit has been filed where guilt is, I believe, established by a preponderance of the evidence which is a lower standard.  I don't know MLB's standard.  Innocent would be established if he went to trial and was judged not guilty or his accuser admitted lying.

4)  Baseball, like the world, is filled with a wide variety of people.  Many are unsavory, awful, and scumbags.  Baseball usually cares more about performance than character.

5) Clevinger has been our best pitcher and he may be a scumbag.

[pcq]

40 minutes ago, BamaDoc said:

I think multiple things can be true.

1) Clevinger has been our best pitcher and he may be a scumbag.

2) I know that custody battles bring out the worst in many people.  Two doctors were divorcing.  The dad had to put his son on the stand to refute his wife's claims that the bruises in a picture were not caused by him but actually when she fell down the stairs.  Putting a kid in that situation is awful and she was a child psychologist.

3) Not an attorney disclaimer. I don't think Clevinger was cleared.  Criminally, they decided the evidence was unlikely to prove him guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.  I don't know if a civil suit has been filed where guilt is, I believe, established by a preponderance of the evidence which is a lower standard.  I don't know MLB's standard.  Innocent would be established if he went to trial and was judged not guilty or his accuser admitted lying.

4)  Baseball, like the world, is filled with a wide variety of people.  Many are unsavory, awful, and scumbags.  Baseball usually cares more about performance than character.

5) Clevinger has been our best pitcher and he may be a scumbag.

The state would not normally pursue a case based upon a baseball groupie. Clev can do his part by being a good father. 

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Wasn’t he on the IL at the deadline? Kind of hard to trade a guy who is going to be out at least another month.

Had at least one quality start right before it...

[South Side Hit Men]

Complete MLB transcript records of the Trevor Bauer investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Andrew."
• Andrew Freidman: "Yes."
• Rob: "Do you guys still want to pay Trevor Bauer?"
• Andrew: "No."
• Rob: "Done, thanks."

Complete MLB transcript records of the Mike Clevinger investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Jerry."
• Jerry Reinsdorf: "Yes."
• Rob: "This is Rob."
• Jerry: "f*** you."
• Rob: "Thank you Mr. Chairman. Do you guys still want to pay Mike Clevinger?"
• Jerry: "You might not believe this, but yes the contract is not expensive and I'm told he can pitch."
• Rob: "Got it. Done, Mike is cleared."

Complete MLB transcript records of the Wander Franco investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Stu."
• Stuart Sternberg: "I told you to call me Mr. Sternberg."
• Rob: "Sorry sir, this won't happen again. Do you want to honor Wander Franco's contract."
• Andrew: "No, glad to be done with it."
• Rob: "Done, thanks."

[Milkman delivers]

10 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

$5 million for a month is going to bust every budget in September Some teams will make exceptions and break the budget, but not for a guy with Clevingers recent injury history, and just missing a month and a half. Explain the Rangers trade for Chapman? Explain was Uriah was on the Dodgers roster after his 2019 problem. Explain Marcel Ozuna in the Braves line up? He punched his wife right in front of a cop.Explain Roberto Osuna being acquired by the Astros. Explain Domingo Germans continued employment with the Yankees. And those are guys that actually got suspended.

Don’t think you intentionally did it, but that’s a lot of Hispanic players.

[Milkman delivers]

8 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

MLB was still interviewing the accuser in February of last year, which on its own raises issues since memory of events definitely is harder the longer you wait.

Not necessarily true, especially when trauma is a factor.

[caulfield12]

7 minutes ago, Milkman delivers said:

Don’t think you intentionally did it, but that’s a lot of Hispanic players.

Brett Myers from Phillies/Astros/White Sox

John Rocker lol.

Chuck Finley reverse DV.

Edited September 16, 2023 by caulfield12

[Big Hurtin]

41 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Complete MLB transcript records of the Trevor Bauer investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Andrew."
• Andrew Freidman: "Yes."
• Rob: "Do you guys still want to pay Trevor Bauer?"
• Andrew: "No."
• Rob: "Done, thanks."

Complete MLB transcript records of the Mike Clevinger investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Jerry."
• Jerry Reinsdorf: "Yes."
• Rob: "This is Rob."
• Jerry: "f*** you."
• Rob: "Thank you Mr. Chairman. Do you guys still want to pay Mike Clevinger?"
• Jerry: "You might not believe this, but yes the contract is not expensive and I'm told he can pitch."
• Rob: "Got it. Done, Mike is cleared."

Complete MLB transcript records of the Wander Franco investigation:

• Rob Manfred: "Hello Stu."
• Stuart Sternberg: "I told you to call me Mr. Sternberg."
• Rob: "Sorry sir, this won't happen again. Do you want to honor Wander Franco's contract."
• Andrew: "No, glad to be done with it."
• Rob: "Done, thanks."

You joke, but really, think about it.  Why does MLB do internal investigations?  They aren't the FBI or any type of law enforcement.  It's all about how it's going to (or likely to) splash back on them.

[Milkman delivers]

7 hours ago, WestEddy said:

No, you shouldn't have. Testimony under oath is evidence. 

Eh, it can also mean someone is willing to lie under oath. It’s not that rare.

 

At this point, I almost want the Sox to bring him back to watch this site burn ?

[caulfield12]

28 minutes ago, Milkman delivers said:

Eh, it can also mean someone is willing to lie under oath. It’s not that rare.

 

At this point, I almost want the Sox to bring him back to watch this site burn ?

Go Team Barbie!!

[kitekrazy]

7 hours ago, hogan873 said:

I have my doubts about Clevinger returning.  He pitched well this year, and there will probably be teams out there willing to give him a better deal than the mutual option.  Even with his baggage, I think he'll get a multiple year deal from someone.

Maybe you missed that every team looking for the final wildcard passed when he was on waivers.  Reds and DBacks could've used him for sure,

[Milkman delivers]

All we know for sure is that Clevinger will either be on the Sox next year or he won’t be on the Sox.

[South Side Hit Men]

57 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

You joke, but really, think about it.  Why does MLB do internal investigations?  They aren't the FBI or any type of law enforcement.  It's all about how it's going to (or likely to) splash back on them.

Sadly not joking.  I believe Clevinger receives a suspension with the same "evidence" and circumstances if he was in a long term contract the Sox were looking to shed. MLB delivers on behalf of their owners, it's the only reason NY Headquarters exist. They don't give a rats ass about the integrity of the game or the character of those involved.

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Sadly not joking.  I believe Clevinger receives a suspension with the same "evidence" and circumstances if he was in a long term contract the Sox were looking to shed. MLB delivers on behalf of their owners, it's the only reason NY Headquarters exist. They don't give a rats ass about the integrity of the game or the character of those involved.

The fact that MLB did not deal with this promptly as is required by the text of the CBA is consistent with this. It very much seems like the league was hoping this would go away between last summer and January, and suddenly got serious and dealt with their requirements in a few weeks once the accuser came forward in the press. Which has absolutely made me wonder if there are other ones where the accuser did not go public that we never heard of around the league.

[TaylorStSox]

11 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

The fact that MLB did not deal with this promptly as is required by the text of the CBA is consistent with this. It very much seems like the league was hoping this would go away between last summer and January, and suddenly got serious and dealt with their requirements in a few weeks once the accuser came forward in the press. Which has absolutely made me wonder if there are other ones where the accuser did not go public that we never heard of around the league.

This just nutty conspiracy theory trash. MLB was all over Bauer - a better, much higher profile Cy Young winner. The league's incentive is to be dilligent in handling these matters. They're not going to cover up for Mike fucking Clevinger.

[South Side Hit Men]

1 hour ago, TaylorStSox said:

This just nutty conspiracy theory trash. MLB was all over Bauer - a better, much higher profile Cy Young winner. The league's incentive is to be dilligent in handling these matters. They're not going to cover up for Mike fucking Clevinger.

Now this is a nutty conspiracy theory. 

The league’s incentive is to get out of contracts it no longer wants on the books. Period. 

There were 90 million reasons why the league went after Bauer and let Clevinger pass.
 

MLB pitcher Trevor Bauer agreed to a three-year, $102 million deal with the Los Angeles Dodgers, making him on of the the highest-paid players per-year in sports.

Vs.

The White Sox signed Clevinger in December 2022 to a one-year contract worth $12 million.

[TheBooneLoganEra]

Lot of people here wasting a lot of time and energy arguing over a white trash custody dispute of a slightly above average pitcher. Move on folks. Either live with him pitching for your team or don't. 

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, TheBooneLoganEra said:

Lot of people here wasting a lot of time and energy arguing over a white trash custody dispute of a slightly above average pitcher. Move on folks. Either live with him pitching for your team or don't. 

Wow...if only this type of mentality worked for politics.

Maybe not so good for message board discussions, though.