Cease To Padres per Passan

[caulfield12]

18 minutes ago, bmags said:

I would just find it confusing. Loved him as an option when he seemed blocked and we needed outfield depth and he seemed like he was overlooked.

But trading for a guy who will be 27 in May, when we are so far from competing? Seems a bit confusing for to me.

Do people here realize he was an older rookie?

 

Pretty much exactly where Burger would be (#3 RoY) had his rookie season not been miss timed in 2022 to lose rookie status eligibility…

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by caulfield12

[GreenSox]

15 hours ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

Why wouldn’t they want him? He’s already in the majors, hits lefty, is good defender, has a lot of team control. Checks a lot of boxes.

Outman was a 4+ WAR player last year. That’s just not realistic to expect him for Cease.

[wrathofhahn]

16 hours ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

Frasso, Pages, Busch, and Feduccia would be my asking price from the Dodgers. Feduccia just because we are likely to be in desperate need for a playable catcher at some point next year

Busch and Frasso are 25 and 26 if we are trading Cease it signals a likely rebuild how do you rebuild with prospects in their middle 20's?

Edited November 20, 2023 by wrathofhahn

[bmags]

30 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said:

Busch and Frasso are 25 and 26 if we are trading Cease it will be a likely rebuild how do you rebuild with prospects in their middle 20's?

Yeah busch is giving me extreme willie calhoun vibes.

I don't know what the dodgers will do. Are they less likely to let go of Pepiot/Sheehan now that they contributed last year? 

Sheehan + Rushing seems like a good package. I don't really want to go after Stone after his second half.

But after that it is a concerning group of pitchers. Stone fell off a lot in the second half. Frasso could have us add to our collection of pitchers who have not pitched more than 100 innings. Hurt is interesting, but feels like he'd be bullpen here.

I don't know, Rushing + De Paula (who is guaranteed to be a DH here) + Bruns + Wroblewski probably would not inspire many here but it adds some high end offensive power and Bruns has the kind of arm that Katz seems to have done well with (?).

I'd be really happy to get Rushing. Gives Quero more time to develop as a catcher, and could go from there.

[MiddleCoastBias]

Didn't it use to be a thing that we'd make a big signing or trade the Wednesday before Thanksgiving for a few years running? Vaguely recall something like Thome being announced on Wednesday, might be making that up.

Obviously a bunch of new faces making decisions but maybe we get a little Thanksgiving appetizer again this year.

[bmags]

14 minutes ago, MiddleCoastBias said:

Didn't it use to be a thing that we'd make a big signing or trade the Wednesday before Thanksgiving for a few years running? Vaguely recall something like Thome being announced on Wednesday, might be making that up.

Obviously a bunch of new faces making decisions but maybe we get a little Thanksgiving appetizer again this year.

Scott Linebrink too

[SoCalChiSox]

36 minutes ago, bmags said:

Yeah busch is giving me extreme willie calhoun vibes.

I don't know what the dodgers will do. Are they less likely to let go of Pepiot/Sheehan now that they contributed last year? 

Sheehan + Rushing seems like a good package. I don't really want to go after Stone after his second half.

But after that it is a concerning group of pitchers. Stone fell off a lot in the second half. Frasso could have us add to our collection of pitchers who have not pitched more than 100 innings. Hurt is interesting, but feels like he'd be bullpen here.

I don't know, Rushing + De Paula (who is guaranteed to be a DH here) + Bruns + Wroblewski probably would not inspire many here but it adds some high end offensive power and Bruns has the kind of arm that Katz seems to have done well with (?).

I'd be really happy to get Rushing. Gives Quero more time to develop as a catcher, and could go from there.

We need to have someone to replace Eloy in the 4 hole. If the trade is with BAL, it's Hjerstad, if it's LAD it's Busch. There has to be someone in the lineup with legit power besides Robert cause Beni doesn't have it, Moncada's disappeared and Vaughn is just meh.

The problem is they need to fill 3 spots with good cheap talent (OF, IF, SP) and in a trade they'll likely be able to only hit two. 

They should throw in Santos if it will get it done but I doubt it will. 

Pages (if healthy and shoulder checks out medically) + Busch + one of LAD SP prospects is probably superior to Kjerstad + Ortiz + Povich.

 

[wrathofhahn]

4 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:

We need to have someone to replace Eloy in the 4 hole. If the trade is with BAL, it's Hjerstad, if it's LAD it's Busch. There has to be someone in the lineup with legit power besides Robert cause Beni doesn't have it, Moncada's disappeared and Vaughn is just meh.

The problem is they need to fill 3 spots with good cheap talent (OF, IF, SP) and in a trade they'll likely be able to only hit two. 

They should throw in Santos if it will get it done but I doubt it will. 

Pages (if healthy and shoulder checks out medically) + Busch + one of LAD SP prospects is probably superior to Kjerstad + Ortiz + Povich.

 

Look this team lost 100 games and is going to get worse after a cease trade. We need to stop looking at it from the perspective of filling out holes on the roster and get the best highest upside talent from their system.

We can do a separate deal or sign a stop gap OF, IF, SP if needed to fill out the roster. 

[wrathofhahn]

1 hour ago, bmags said:

Yeah busch is giving me extreme willie calhoun vibes.

I don't know what the dodgers will do. Are they less likely to let go of Pepiot/Sheehan now that they contributed last year? 

Sheehan + Rushing seems like a good package. I don't really want to go after Stone after his second half.

But after that it is a concerning group of pitchers. Stone fell off a lot in the second half. Frasso could have us add to our collection of pitchers who have not pitched more than 100 innings. Hurt is interesting, but feels like he'd be bullpen here.

I don't know, Rushing + De Paula (who is guaranteed to be a DH here) + Bruns + Wroblewski probably would not inspire many here but it adds some high end offensive power and Bruns has the kind of arm that Katz seems to have done well with (?).

I'd be really happy to get Rushing. Gives Quero more time to develop as a catcher, and could go from there.

Of the guys ranked at the top of their system Rushing is the guy I like best. If we can get Rushing, Josue De Paula and 1 of Jesus Tillero, Samuel Munoz, or Joendry Vargas I'd be happy.

This organization needs to change it's approach when it comes to drafting and the players it targets on trades. We need to stop trying to hit singles and instead go for a homerun.

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by wrathofhahn

[TheFutureIsNear]

1 hour ago, wrathofhahn said:

Busch and Frasso are 25 and 26 if we are trading Cease it signals a likely rebuild how do you rebuild with prospects in their middle 20's?

Are you suggesting they are going to be old and broken down by the time the Sox are good? Might be the case because the franchise sucks and may never get good, but the idea that we have to look 5/6 years down the road is crazy to me. A competent franchise should be able to get back into contention by ‘26. And no I wouldn’t be worried about having guys in the prime at 28/29 with multiple years of team control left. 

[bmags]

17 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:

We need to have someone to replace Eloy in the 4 hole. If the trade is with BAL, it's Hjerstad, if it's LAD it's Busch. There has to be someone in the lineup with legit power besides Robert cause Beni doesn't have it, Moncada's disappeared and Vaughn is just meh.

The problem is they need to fill 3 spots with good cheap talent (OF, IF, SP) and in a trade they'll likely be able to only hit two. 

They should throw in Santos if it will get it done but I doubt it will. 

Pages (if healthy and shoulder checks out medically) + Busch + one of LAD SP prospects is probably superior to Kjerstad + Ortiz + Povich.

 

We could just not trade eloy if that was such a concern. But I can't imagine there being a concern that we will lack a 4 hole hitter on the 2024 white sox that we should demand a different prospect package.

[Bob Sacamano]

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

We could just not trade eloy if that was such a concern. But I can't imagine there being a concern that we will lack a 4 hole hitter on the 2024 white sox that we should demand a different prospect package.

Yeah they shouldn't be using this trade to fill holes on the MLB roster. If the best package they receive involves an MLB ready player then so be it.

[DirtySox]

Dodgers top 10 updated at Baseball America. For the non subs.

Quote

1.) Michael Busch

2.) Dalton Rushing

3.) Gavin Stone

4.) Andy Pages

5.) Nick Frasso

6.) Josue De Paula

7.) Kyle Hurt

8.) River Ryan

9.) Diego Cartaya

10.) Maddux Bruns

https://www.baseballamerica.com/teams/2012-los-angeles-dodgers/prospects/?season=2024&ranking=preseason

Edited November 20, 2023 by DirtySox

[SoCalChiSox]

19 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

Dodgers top 10 updated at Baseball America. For the non subs.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/teams/2012-los-angeles-dodgers/prospects/?season=20, 24&ranking=preseason

Interesting. 

Someone suggested De Paula...his bat seems to have extremely high potential but is years away. There was the suggestion by several posters to focus on best talent and not 2024 team needs, but remember JR doesn't want another slog of a rebuild, he wants prospects that are pretty much ready to play in the MLB. Rightly or wrongly, they want to refill the seats in 24 and on the cheap too. I don't think they are going to take major pieces that are years away regardless of the logic.

Edited November 20, 2023 by SoCalChiSox

[Quin]

Quote

I think the White Sox would do really well in a Cease trade because he has two years of team control remaining, unlike some of the notable starters who could be dealt. Teams such as the Orioles, Phillies, Braves, Dodgers, Giants, Twins, Rangers and Cardinals will be in on Cease, who finished second in the American League Cy Young Award voting in 2022 but logged a 4.58 ERA last season. At the very least, the White Sox would get two top-10 prospects and one top-15 to top-25 prospect too. It would take a strong package from a good farm system.

I know Bowden means organizational top-10, but it reads like he means MLB-wide, which is hysterical.

Here's his whole column, where he swats down a Yankees' fans Robert proposal.

[WestEddy]

Nice write-up at SoxOn35th, exploring 10 possible returns in a Dylan Cease trade. 

https://www.soxon35th.com/10-potential-trade-packages-for-dylan-cease-this-offseason/

[DirtySox]

1 minute ago, SoCalChiSox said:

Interesting. 

Someone suggested De Paula...his bat seems to have extremely high potential but is years away. There was the suggestion by several posters to focus on best talent and not 2024 team needs, but remember JR doesn't want another slog of a rebuild, he wants prospects that are pretty much ready to play in the MLB. Rightly or wrongly, they want to refill the seats in 24 and on the cheap too. I don't think they are going to take major pieces that are years away regardless of the logic.

The De Paula write up is pretty brutal on his Defense. Not sure that's what the new regime is looking for.

Quote

De Paula is a tall, 6-foot-3, projectable teenager with tantalizing offensive potential. He has a calm, patient approach and a picturesque lefthanded swing that leaves few holes for pitchers to attack. He has a unique ability to look over a baseball for his age and drives hittable pitches on a line with a balanced, efficient swing. He projects to be a plus hitter, if not more, and should grow into above-average power as he packs muscle onto his developing frame. De Paula is advanced in the batter’s box, but he has a long way to go defensively. He’s a fringe-average runner and timid right fielder and who takes poor routes and struggles to track fly balls. He is prone to overrunning grounders and whiffing on catchable balls in the air, especially on the move. He committed six errors in 87 chances in 2023 for a poor .931 fielding percentage. De Paula projects to be a well below-average defender even with improvement and will have to move to DH unless he can catch the ball more consistently.

 

[GreenSox]

They won't get full ace-value for Cease, but should be able to get #2 value.  Trade him.

[fathom]

Lots of good research done in this thread, but I feel like every Dodgers proposal is underwhelming to me.  I’m surprised more people aren’t suggesting Lux as the main piece back.

[Bob Sacamano]

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Lots of good research done in this thread, but I feel like every Dodgers proposal is underwhelming to me.  I’m surprised more people aren’t suggesting Lux as the main piece back.

3 years of control at this point is probably the turn off for some people.

[WestEddy]

I'm just hungry for names, at this point. I know some here have warned me to not take this guy too seriously. 
 

 

[DirtySox]

20 minutes ago, fathom said:

Lots of good research done in this thread, but I feel like every Dodgers proposal is underwhelming to me.  I’m surprised more people aren’t suggesting Lux as the main piece back.

They have some interesting pieces but I think I largely prefer what the Orioles have to offer. If they are interested that is.

[hogan873]

17 minutes ago, fathom said:

Lots of good research done in this thread, but I feel like every Dodgers proposal is underwhelming to me.  I’m surprised more people aren’t suggesting Lux as the main piece back.

I remember right at the deadline there was a rumor of the Sox and Dodgers deep into talks with Lux being the centerpiece.  If I'm not mistaken, many of us didn't care for that.  Maybe that was because we were hoping for some of the rumored packages from Baltimore.

How much concern is there regarding coming back from a significant injury?

[SoCalChiSox]

4 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

I'm just hungry for names, at this point. I know some here have warned me to not take this guy too seriously. 
 

 

Lol...I think Bartolo is @Chicago White Sox second least favorite fake insider out there behind only Lion in Texas.

On the merits, it's not a bad proposal you get two pitchers plus a RF....only thing missing is left handed savagery. Take out Knack and Barnes and replace with Busch.

[GreenSox]

9 minutes ago, hogan873 said:

I remember right at the deadline there was a rumor of the Sox and Dodgers deep into talks with Lux being the centerpiece.  If I'm not mistaken, many of us didn't care for that.  Maybe that was because we were hoping for some of the rumored packages from Baltimore.

How much concern is there regarding coming back from a significant injury?

His 3 fWAR didn't make sense to me given a modest OPS, lack of power and high BAPIP; and it wasn't inflated via  defense either (like, say, 'Eaton's 6 WAR was).   He does take his walks.
And then add injury on top.  Not a centerpiece by any means.