Cease To Padres per Passan

[Vote4Pedro]

1 minute ago, Dick Allen said:

As we are finding out, that was just an excuse because JR didn’t want to put the work into finding someone who would disagree with him, just opting for yes men willing to do things his way and kissing his ass every chance they get. All these guys do the exact same thing. Just look at their quotes over the years. Hahn, KW, LaRussa…. Praise him up and down talk about how all he wants to do is win, and mention how the losing is killing him. If it were killing him, he’d be long gone by now.

I truly believe JR and TLR think they can win with these type of players though and that is the most concerning part of it. They are so out of touch with reality and neither of them should have their hands on a baseball organization at this point in time in their lives 

[Chicago White Sox]

3 minutes ago, fathom said:

What chips you expect them to have next year after 2024 is sure to have AWFUL attendance?

We basically have no financial commitments beyond this coming season, so even if he goes cheap on the payroll (say $140M) I’d still expect having a ton of money to work with.  Not expecting any A free agents, but they I fully expect them address needs in free agency after this season.  Jerry knows his time is running out and he wants to “win”.  Plus I think our TV deal expires soon and that will force Jerry to pretend he’s serious about winning at minimum.

[Chicago White Sox]

4 minutes ago, Vote4Pedro said:

I truly believe JR and TLR think they can win with these type of players though and that is the most concerning part of it. They are so out of touch with reality and neither of them should have their hands on a baseball organization at this point in time in their lives 

I really don’t think TLR has much involvement at the moment.

[Y2Jimmy0]

7 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:

So we didn't even ask for Jorge like Bruce said?

I thought Jorge and Stafura were the other pieces not just Stafura

FML.

Jimmy give us a morsel or two. 

They wanted Jorge too but he’s an obvious 4th piece to me 

4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Do you buy this pitching stuff James?  Would Getz actually forgo the chance to solve both RF & 2B in one fair swoop with an Orioles trade?

Not sure what to believe. I’m sure Baltimore is their ideal trade candidate but they haven’t heard the names they want to pull the trigger. Same with Atlanta. 

[ptatc]

20 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Maybe you haven't heard but boring baseball does not put butts in the seats. People want HRs and wins.

Since the Sox have no easy path back to the playoffs and still need butts in the seats for JR in increase payroll we have quite the conundrum. What comes 1st pitching ,defense, no winning boring  baseball that leaves the stands empty or hit HRs, run the bases, but exciting non winning , modern, baseball that might put just a few more butts in the seats ?

This is not the dead ball era with  450 ft. to CF to hit a HR.

The Yankees discovered in the 1920's that a LH slugger putting balls over the fence did wonderful things for them and baseball as a sport.The Sox still havent figured that out 100 years later.

I disagree. It's still pitching that will get you to the promise land. 

You can focus on regular season. I'll focus on post season. 

They obviously need to improve both but like the oline in football, start with the foundation. 

Edited December 23, 2023 by ptatc

[Vote4Pedro]

Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

We basically have no financial commitments beyond this coming season, so even if he goes cheap on the payroll (say $140M) I’d still expect having a ton of money to work with.  Not expecting any A free agents, but they I fully expect them address needs in free agency after this season.  Jerry knows his time is running out and he wants to “win”.  Plus I think our TV deal expires soon and that will force Jerry to pretend he’s serious about winning at minimum.

But we’ve been saying Jerry knows his time is running out and we continue to get him not wanting to spend on the same level as the rest of the league. Jerry isn’t the only one in the ownership group unfortunately and it’s been reported before he just can’t or won’t just throw his own money at the problem. The other “owners” have say in this as well unfortunately. 

[Vote4Pedro]

Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

I really don’t think TLR has much involvement at the moment.

You really truly believe that lol? The Sox went out of their way to say TLR was out of the picture only for their new hire to contradict that statement a few weeks later. TLR will always have the ear of the chairman and when push comes to shove TLR still pulls the strings. 

[bmags]

2 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I disagree. It's still pitching that will get you to the promise land. 

You can focus on regular season. I'll focus on post season. 

They obviously need to improve both but like the oline in football, start with the foundation. 

That’s funny. I think position players are a foundations. They are much more consistent and less prone to injuries. Pitching is a year by year phenomenon.

2 years ago it seemed the braves pitching staff was loaded. Now they’ve had to support that while they have the number 1 offense. One is gonna stick around to build on imo.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

12 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

As we are finding out, that was just an excuse because JR didn’t want to put the work into finding someone who would disagree with him, just opting for yes men willing to do things his way and kissing his ass every chance they get. All these guys do the exact same thing. Just look at their quotes over the years. Hahn, KW, LaRussa…. Praise him up and down talk about how all he wants to do is win, and mention how the losing is killing him. If it were killing him, he’d be long gone by now.

We are very well aligned in this stream of consciousness.

[tray]

Counterpoints well taken. I didn't realize that AB had never played RF in the majors. Christ. What a great acquisition for 50 Million, a Left Fielder with almost no power and he is no speed demon out there either.

[Vote4Pedro]

5 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

They wanted Jorge too but he’s an obvious 4th piece to me 

Not sure what to believe. I’m sure Baltimore is their ideal trade candidate but they haven’t heard the names they want to pull the trigger. Same with Atlanta. 

You think a team will end up caving to Getz demands? My worry is teams view Cease projections more off his last year performance and his runner up in the Cy Young season as more of an anomaly than looking at it as what he can bring to the table year in and year out

[bmags]

1 minute ago, tray said:

Counterpoints well taken. I didn't realize that AB had never played RF in the majors. Christ. What a great acquisition for 50 Million, a Left Fielder with almost no power and he is no speed demon out there either.

80 million

[Vote4Pedro]

2 minutes ago, tray said:

Counterpoints well taken. I didn't realize that AB had never played RF in the majors. Christ. What a great acquisition for 50 Million, a Left Fielder with almost no power and he is no speed demon out there either.

Sox viewpoint on him is he wasn’t a DH or 1B playing in the outfield so it was a win in their books. Also played for Grifol so there’s that 

[TheFutureIsNear]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Do you buy this pitching stuff James?  Would Getz actually forgo the chance to solve both RF & 2B in one fair swoop with an Orioles trade?

This franchise has so many more holes to fill than just 2B and RF in the coming years that concentrating on any certain positions as the return is crazy. The next year should be about talent acquisition. Acquire as much young talent as possible (and take some chances on vets to flip) and figure out roster construction later. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, I didn’t really like the pick, but they did just use the 15th overall pick on Gonzalez who likely ends up at 2B (wouldn’t say Sosa or Popeye are dead in the water yet either). Also not crazy to think that Colas figures it out and fills the RF hole. 
 

Bottom line- get the most talent back as possible regardless of position. The only obvious pitfall to avoid would be getting too many 1B/DH types like the Sox have done previously…not sure that’s a worry with Getz prioritizing defense and athleticism tho.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

Cease and Eloy back to the Cubs would be hysterical and freakin awesome.

[ptatc]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

That’s funny. I think position players are a foundations. They are much more consistent and less prone to injuries. Pitching is a year by year phenomenon.

2 years ago it seemed the braves pitching staff was loaded. Now they’ve had to support that while they have the number 1 offense. One is gonna stick around to build on imo.

Fair point. I look at it the other way. With the variation in pitching it needs to be built first. Pitching wins the at bat more ofter than the hitter. 

Start with the pitching/defense, then build offense. 

[ptatc]

2 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Cease and Eloy back to the Cubs would be hysterical and freakin awesome.

It would. 

[Chicago White Sox]

1 minute ago, Vote4Pedro said:

But we’ve been saying Jerry knows his time is running out and we continue to get him not wanting to spend on the same level as the rest of the league. Jerry isn’t the only one in the ownership group unfortunately and it’s been reported before he just can’t or won’t just throw his own money at the problem. The other “owners” have say in this as well unfortunately. 

I’m not sure I follow here.  Our payroll was like 7th in 2022 ($200M+) and still above $180M on opening day last year.  It’s disappointing that he actually cut payroll last year, but a competent front office would have had plenty of dollars to work with.  I hate Jerry with all my heart, but it’s not fair to expect him to spend like the Mets, Dodgers, or Yankees.

The real issue is how we’ve allocated those dollars and that’s where Jerry becomes problematic.  He’s risk adverse and doesn’t like committing huge dollars to individual players.  Unfortunately, this meant no stars for us during our window and a lot of money spend B & C tier free agents.  Additionally, it lead a GM already with a massive hard-on for relievers to go hog wild in free agency on them.  No team has gotten less for its free agent dollars than us.

Also, I’m pretty sure Jerry has complete control on how much we spend and who we spend it on.  Maybe he can’t go deep into the red, but his partners don’t really have voices on any real decision making.

[Chicago White Sox]

13 minutes ago, Vote4Pedro said:

You really truly believe that lol? The Sox went out of their way to say TLR was out of the picture only for their new hire to contradict that statement a few weeks later. TLR will always have the ear of the chairman and when push comes to shove TLR still pulls the strings. 

Which new hire are you referring to?

[Y2Jimmy0]

11 minutes ago, Vote4Pedro said:

You think a team will end up caving to Getz demands? My worry is teams view Cease projections more off his last year performance and his runner up in the Cy Young season as more of an anomaly than looking at it as what he can bring to the table year in and year out

If nobody does, they’ll hold him until the deadline it seems 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

9 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I disagree. It's still pitching that will get you to the promise land. 

You can focus on regular season. I'll focus on post season. 

They obviously need to improve both but like the oline in football, start with the foundation. 

I'm not focused on anything except not giving Reinsdorf more reasons to think he's a baseball genious and see things happen that do not align with his philosophies.

[Jerksticks]

16 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I disagree. It's still pitching that will get you to the promise land. 

You can focus on regular season. I'll focus on post season. 

They obviously need to improve both but like the oline in football, start with the foundation. 

Maybe hitting is the foundation.  It gives you a chance to win every day in a 162 game season.  You have to have points on the board.  

[Vote4Pedro]

1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m not sure I follow here.  Our payroll was like 7th in 2022 ($200M+) and still above $180M on opening day last year.  It’s disappointing that he actually cut payroll last year, but a competent front office would have had plenty of dollars to work with.  I hate Jerry with all my heart, but it’s not fair to expect him to spend like the Mets, Dodgers, or Yankees.

The real issue is how we’ve allocated those dollars and that’s where Jerry becomes problematic.  He’s risk adverse and doesn’t like committing huge dollars to individual players.  Unfortunately, this meant no stars for us during our window and a lot of money spend B & C tier free agents.  Additionally, it lead a GM already with a massive hard-on for relievers to go hog wild in free agency on them.  No team has gotten less for its free agent dollars than us.

Also, I’m pretty sure Jerry has complete control on how much we spend and who we spend it on.  Maybe he can’t go deep into the red, but his partners don’t really have voices on any real decision making.

Until you can spend 100 mil on a player in the 3rd largest market in the country you can’t cry poor in my eyes. If you can’t do that in today’s game you need to get the hell out of it. Yes they spent a bunch of money on mid level players, so while they spent money they did so poorly but only because JR refuses to allocate the money to the proper star player I.e. Machado or Harper. Those contracts now just a few years later look like a bargain comparatively speaking. I don’t have the article or link to it but JR or reporters have said that the Sox spending is not solely a Reinsdorf decision. JR whether using his business partners as a crutch or it’s a real thing has always looked out for their bottom line. Not saying they should spend year after year like those teams but anyone defending the unwillingness to land a big fish is just crazy at this point. 

[Vote4Pedro]

8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Which new hire are you referring to?

Player development dude from college. Can’t remember his name at the moment 

[Vote4Pedro]

10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Which new hire are you referring to?

Paul Janish