Soxfest Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 I think this could be one of the most interesting battles in Spring Training next season, with Rowand winning the job...Reasoning on this is that he is a KW guy and he's never really been given a fair chance at the position everyday. Gotta believe that Reed will land in Triple-A along with Borchard. I'd be pretty happy with Rowand in CF opposed to spending big time money to get a outfielder. I think Rowand will bring a lot that Ozzie looks for in a player and could enjoy a season somewhere along these lines: .270, 12-15 HR, 60 RBI and a solid defensive game in centerfielder. Interested to hear other's opinions on the CF job in the spring. If Rowand is starting in CF again next year, that means Sox did nothing to improve team. I gotta disagree here... If you think overpaying for a centerfielder is considered an attempt to improve the team when we can use the money to get pitching, you're mistaken. Rowand's never been given a fair shot to have the job over an extended period of time and now is his time. Since he's one of KW's boys, he's gonna get the shot, like it or not. And I tend to believe he's gonna flourish given the chance. I never said anything about overpaying for anyone , I just said Rowand is NOT the answer and he has been given more than a fair chance in CF, time to cut bait. When was this so-called fair chance? Last year hitting .200 for months on end is not going to get it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted November 4, 2003 Author Share Posted November 4, 2003 I think this could be one of the most interesting battles in Spring Training next season, with Rowand winning the job...Reasoning on this is that he is a KW guy and he's never really been given a fair chance at the position everyday. Gotta believe that Reed will land in Triple-A along with Borchard. I'd be pretty happy with Rowand in CF opposed to spending big time money to get a outfielder. I think Rowand will bring a lot that Ozzie looks for in a player and could enjoy a season somewhere along these lines: .270, 12-15 HR, 60 RBI and a solid defensive game in centerfielder. Interested to hear other's opinions on the CF job in the spring. If Rowand is starting in CF again next year, that means Sox did nothing to improve team. I gotta disagree here... If you think overpaying for a centerfielder is considered an attempt to improve the team when we can use the money to get pitching, you're mistaken. Rowand's never been given a fair shot to have the job over an extended period of time and now is his time. Since he's one of KW's boys, he's gonna get the shot, like it or not. And I tend to believe he's gonna flourish given the chance. I never said anything about overpaying for anyone , I just said Rowand is NOT the answer and he has been given more than a fair chance in CF, time to cut bait. When was this so-called fair chance? Last year hitting .200 for months on end is not going to get it done. I'd say a fair chance is playing everyday for a month, which has never happened with Rowand, for various reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 he was hurt. he pressed. Hardly anybody else hit, so he was considered one of the guys who could be shuffled out of the lineup. he went to the minors, never complained and got straightened out. came up and did well prior to the Everett trade. give him a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted November 4, 2003 Author Share Posted November 4, 2003 He probably shouldn't have even started the year in the majors after his accident. And if I remember correctly, once he did get things straightened out, he played pretty well. Even made ole 6 fingers Alfonseca regret hanging a curve to him in the 8th in that game against the Cubs when he put one in the seats. He's a gamer and he can play for my team anytime. See ya next year in Center, A-Row. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 He is referring to the first month of this past season. Normally I would consider that a long enough audition, but taking into account his off-season injury and the fact that he played very well for three weeks from June 10 (his recall) and July 1(trade for Everett) are enough reason to give him another shot. He also played quite a bit, albeit not everyday in July and hit .433. He hit .381 overall after his June 10 callup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 he was hurt. he pressed. Hardly anybody else hit, so he was considered one of the guys who could be shuffled out of the lineup. he went to the minors, never complained and got straightened out. came up and did well prior to the Everett trade. give him a chance. I agree he did well, but If the Sox need a leadoff hitter then I don't see Rowand as the solution and Harris may end up being the better fit. Now I don't think the Sox will be very sucessful if they are depending on Willie as the leadoff hitter, mainly cause i think it means they went the cheap route and never added any pitching, etc. To me its too hard to say right now..once a few more moves are made, then it will be easier. I mean will the Sox move Maggs, will they be able to move Konerko and Koch...how much are they going to spend. Are they going to sign a few pitchers and jump out pretty quick the first 3 weeks or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 I've been a long time supporter of AaRow. The kid has never gotten his chance to be the everyday CFer when he was healthy. After returning from AAA this year, he did a great job when given an opportunity to play. IMO, and what I hope, is that the real competition will be who KW signs to take Maggs place in RF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 I agree he did well, but If the Sox need a leadoff hitter then I don't see Rowand as the solution Who said anything about him being a leadoff hitter? There is no rule that says the CF has to lead off Jason. You studying too much lately? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Who said anything about him being a leadoff hitter? There is no rule that says the CF has to lead off Jason. You studying too much lately? I was meaning that it doesn't look like they are going to get one at short (unless they get Itchaga or whatever his name is). And lets just say I'm not a big fan of Roberto leading off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Who said anything about him being a leadoff hitter? There is no rule that says the CF has to lead off Jason. You studying too much lately? I was meaning that it doesn't look like they are going to get one at short (unless they get Itchaga or whatever his name is). And lets just say I'm not a big fan of Roberto leading off. Could be Miles........ could be Soriano....... could be El Caballo ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Who said anything about him being a leadoff hitter? There is no rule that says the CF has to lead off Jason. You studying too much lately? I was meaning that it doesn't look like they are going to get one at short (unless they get Itchaga or whatever his name is). And lets just say I'm not a big fan of Roberto leading off. Could be Miles........ could be Soriano....... could be El Caballo ;-) I love Soriano, but would love it more if the Sox could stick him in the two hole. And don't joke around about Miles and Caballo leading off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Hey, Ozzie said he wanted guys who would play hard and play the game the right way, whether they were young or old. Miles and Rowand both fit that bill. If the Sox had the right mix of players around them, having those two guys in your lineup wouldn't be bad at all. They certainly could inject life into a team. Both are what I believe KW would call "grinders". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Hey, Ozzie said he wanted guys who would play hard and play the game the right way, whether they were young or old. Miles and Rowand both fit that bill. If the Sox had the right mix of players around them, having those two guys in your lineup wouldn't be bad at all. They certainly could inject life into a team. Both are what I believe KW would call "grinders". I like Rowand, but I'm not a fan of starting Miles. He doesn't get on base and frankly I don't think of him as a starter. He could turn into a good bench player and I'm definately routing for him, but I got serious doubts and if the Sox are counting on him as a leadoff hitter, most likely I'll be incredibly worried about this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Soriano in the #2 hole would be great IMO. Of course, that still leaves the leadoff spot open...I can't solve that particular enigma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Well their is always the option of Castillo and Soriano at the top of the lineup, although it isn't highly likely, its definately do-able. Then the Sox would go cheaper by keeping someone like Jose at shortstop or by just waiting it out and seeing whose out there around January and going with that. I wouldn't be against this idea. Castillo Soriano Johnson Thomas Lee Everett Crede Jose Olivo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Soriano in the #2 hole would be great IMO. Of course, that still leaves the leadoff spot open...I can't solve that particular enigma That's why we need a SS who can leadoff. Ramon Vasquez could be an option or Guzman or even Eckstein. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 That's why we need a SS who can leadoff. Ramon Vasquez could be an option or Guzman or even Eckstein. Well if the Pads do make a push and land a shortstop then thats definately a possibilty. I don't think the Sox should give up anything special for him or Carlos Guillen who I know 61832 likes. I'm just not big on giving someone like Guillen 3 mill because I Think there are other guys out there capable of similar numbers for a bit less, without making a trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Well their is always the option of Castillo and Soriano at the top of the lineup, although it isn't highly likely, its definately do-able. Then the Sox would go cheaper by keeping someone like Jose at shortstop or by just waiting it out and seeing whose out there around January and going with that. I wouldn't be against this idea. Castillo Soriano Johnson Thomas Lee Everett Crede Jose Olivo Jason, will you give up on Everett already. He's much farther gone than Colon and Wally Backman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Castillo has Hip Surgery last Off season and affect his running and agresiveness. If he stop running than he's got no value. I wouldn't mind the Sox Picking up Fernando Vina for a year or 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Well their is always the option of Castillo and Soriano at the top of the lineup, although it isn't highly likely, its definately do-able. Then the Sox would go cheaper by keeping someone like Jose at shortstop or by just waiting it out and seeing whose out there around January and going with that. I wouldn't be against this idea. Castillo Soriano Johnson Thomas Lee Everett Crede Jose Olivo I am just curious, but how do you expect to get BOTH Soriano and Johnson from the Yankees? Please don't say Konerko and Maggs. Take my word on this, the Yankees have NO interest in Konerko. I also highly doubt that they would tade for Maggs with Guerrero and Sheffield on the FA market. I am a big Guillen fan at SS, but you don't think he is worth 3M/yr, yet you would be willing to give Valentin that much? I am a big Guillen fan because he is solid defensively and I love his plate disipline(his .359 OBP would look great in the #2 hole behind someone like Castillo). That offense would also probably cost you about 30M, which would most likely be over half the payroll. In a perfect world these are the moves that I would like to see. Trade Maggs to NYY for Johnson Trade Konerko and cash to Seattle for Guillen Trade Koch and cash to NYM for mid-tier prospect Sign Castillo Sign Batista Sign Ponson Sign Ligtenberg Sign Timlin Resign Graffy Here is a realistic 2004 team 2B Castillo(7M) SS Guillen(3M) 1B Johnson(500K) DH Thomas(6M) LF Lee(6M) 3B Crede(500K) CF Reed/Borchard(300K) RF Rowand(500K) C Olivo(400K) total: 24.2M LH Buehrle(3.5M) RH Ponson(7M) RH Loaiza(4M) RH Batista(5M) RH Garland(1.5M) total: 21M RH Ligtenberg(2M) RH Timlin(3M) LH Marte(500K) LH Wunsch(500K) RH Wright(500K) RH Ginter/Rauch/Diaz(300K) total: 6.8M IF Graffy(1.5M) 1B/OF Gload(300K) C Rivera/Burke(300K) IF Harris(400K) UT Miles/Borchard(300K) total: 2.8M Total Payroll 54.8M + approximately 4M in Koch and Konerko trade = 58.8M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Well their is always the option of Castillo and Soriano at the top of the lineup, although it isn't highly likely, its definately do-able. Then the Sox would go cheaper by keeping someone like Jose at shortstop or by just waiting it out and seeing whose out there around January and going with that. I wouldn't be against this idea. Castillo Soriano Johnson Thomas Lee Everett Crede Jose Olivo Jason, will you give up on Everett already. He's much farther gone than Colon and Wally Backman. So you don't see any possibility of him coming back if Magglio gets traded? I know KW was a huge fan of him and he did a solid job after the trade. Plus it seemed like he liked it in Chicago and I know a lot of reports have him going to a place like Tampa Bay. Wouldn't he be interested in going for a ring at a fair price? If not Everett, there are still other options though...but I still say KW would like him back, but as of now, their is nowhere for him to play. And as far as Soriano and Castillo being together, I find it very unlikely cause you'd expect the Yanks to deal Soriano and then sign Castillo or at least I would. Maybe their is a possibilty of some type of 3 way with the Expos involved and the Sox get Soriano/Johnson, Yanks take on some payroll but use a few of the Sox prospects and some of their own to add someone like Vazuqez or Vidro, who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Well I'd like to package Konerko to the Yanks. I am not convinced that the Yanks would be interested. I still say some team could get interested in Konerko considering this was one down year and the previous three were all improvments. I also think the yanks would be very interested in Borhard and a pitching prospect along with magglio and I think if the Yanks really want to dump Soriano, then its definately doable. I couldn't say why they would trade cmopared to signing someone like Maggs. I don't think it would be very smart for them to sign Sheffield, Maggs is better, imo, or at least a better long term investment. In regards to Jose, I wouldn't give him near 3 mill, 1.5 or so max. This market is incredibly soft and its being shown already. I think the union will make an incredibly hard push for collusion but in the end it won't pay off. If people thought last year was soft, well then they will be shocked at this year, cause I have heard Vladdy is probably gonna command a max of 12 mill a year. My bet is Vlad stays with the Expos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 61382, I dunno. An outfield of CLee, Rowand, and Reed scares the bejesus outta me. Theres relatively no power(cept CLee), no real outstanding defensive outfielder either. And that bench would make me sick if we had to pinch hit, cuz we would have ZERO power for late innings. Gload IMO will not be here next year, the move to the 40 man was just to protect the organization against the Rule 5. Idon't wanna see Guillen signed at that price, I'll take....GULP...JosE6 at that price before Guillen. The Rotation looks pretty solid....dunno much about Batista. I know that I have seen him pitch lights out before. Unless we use Wright as the clsoer in that bullpen, Marte's arm will fall off enxt year as the only lefty with versatility(READ-can pitch to more than 2 hitters, unlike Wunsch). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Rowand is a damn good ballplayer. He most likely will be our starting CF'er next year and that's fine with me. If Harris beats him out, that's cool too. I don't expect it though, as Rowand seems to be the better hitter. I can not think of a single logical reason the Yankees would want Konerko. Though, I do agree with Chisonfn that PK still has value and should be tradeable. If I had to settle for either Johnson or Soriano in a Maggs deal, I'd insist on Johnson. Though, Johnson for Maggs straight up is out of the question. I think Magglio would make more sense for the Yankees than either Sheffield or Guerrero. Maggs is locked in at $14Mil for 2004 and it would give them a season to evaluate his performance in NY before commiting to a long term big bucks deal, which they'd have to do with Vlad and which Sheff is not worth. but will probably require. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 4, 2003 Share Posted November 4, 2003 Rowand is a damn good ballplayer. He most likely will be our starting CF'er next year and that's fine with me. If Harris beats him out, that's cool too. I don't expect it though, as Rowand seems to be the better hitter. I can not think of a single logical reason the Yankees would want Konerko. Though, I do agree with Chisonfn that PK still has value and should be tradeable. If I had to settle for either Johnson or Soriano in a Maggs deal, I'd insist on Johnson. Though, Johnson for Maggs straight up is out of the question. I think Magglio would make more sense for the Yankees than either Sheffield or Guerrero. Maggs is locked in at $14Mil for 2004 and it would give them a season to evaluate his performance in NY before commiting to a long term big bucks deal, which they'd have to do with Vlad and which Sheff is not worth. but will probably require. Good points, YASNY. I wouldnt mind getting Johnson, but that REQUIRES us to be able to move Konerko. Maybe Maggs+Konerko+Mid-level prosp for Johnson+Soriano++ I dunno, its gonna take moving PK to have Nick Johnson, will we find a taker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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