Sox looking at building in South Loop

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

When Jerry dies I wouldn't be surprised if baseball contracts the White Sox and grants an expansion team to somebody. Quite frankly which demographics would miss the White Sox? With the team looking like an unmitigated disaster for years to come, I don't think many people would cause a stink if baseball contracted the Sox and let another city have a team. The neighborhood of Comiskey isn't going to be affected. And Chicago has the Cubs which has an entirely different fanbase. The Sox don't have many fans and the ones they do have are miserable anyway over this inept franchise. I wonder if the legislature saves the day with the Sox included in the Bears stadium area plans. They could save the day if they build a baseball palace.

Please.................?????

Take emotion out of this.

MLB is going to contract the Sox, lose untapped potential revenue with new ownership and go to a much smaller market like Nashville,  Portland, Charlotte, Montreal or Salt Lake City...

When they could get millions (maybe a billion) in expansion fee money for moving to Nashville,  Portland, Charlotte, Montreal or Salt Lake City AND get the revenue generated by a well-run Sox franchise.

The Sox have shown, even at times under JR, that when they are competitive, well run and successful they draw very well and make a s%*# load of money through local and national media and advertising deals. 

Edited May 21 by Lip Man 1

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

When Jerry dies I wouldn't be surprised if baseball contracts the White Sox and grants an expansion team to somebody. Quite frankly which demographics would miss the White Sox? With the team looking like an unmitigated disaster for years to come, I don't think many people would cause a stink if baseball contracted the Sox and let another city have a team. The neighborhood of Comiskey isn't going to be affected. And Chicago has the Cubs which has an entirely different fanbase. The Sox don't have many fans and the ones they do have are miserable anyway over this inept franchise. I wonder if the legislature saves the day with the Sox included in the Bears stadium area plans. They could save the day if they build a baseball palace.

I smell a ?️bet.

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

I smell a ?️bet.

At least that last Greg775 sentence is what Jerry wants everyone to believe...that actually building a sustained winning team and investing in that product isn't the answer at all.

Edited May 21 by caulfield12

[greg775]

3 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Please.................?????

Take emotion out of this.

MLB is going to contract the Sox, lose untapped potential revenue with new ownership and go to a much smaller market like Nashville,  Portland, Charlotte, Montreal or Salt Lake City...

When they could get millions (maybe a billion) in expansion fee money for moving to Nashville,  Portland, Charlotte, Montreal or Salt Lake City AND get the revenue generated by a well-run Sox franchise.

The Sox have shown, even at times under JR, that when they are competitive, well run and successful they draw very well and make a s%*# load of money through local and national media and advertising deals. 

I don't know about that Lipman. Hope you are right actually. I just envision the Sox as an MLB afterthought more than a big moneymaker considering our club's ineptitude. A new stadium, if it's a palace, would assure the Sox a place in MLB forever I'd think. Sox need to make this work with the Bears, let the Cubs be off on their own. It's funny to me how the Arlington Heights thing disappeared even with the Sox owning land out there. Seemed inevitable the Sox would move to suburbia someday.

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, greg775 said:

I don't know about that Lipman. Hope you are right actually. I just envision the Sox as an MLB afterthought more than a big moneymaker considering our club's ineptitude. A new stadium, if it's a palace, would assure the Sox a place in MLB forever I'd think. Sox need to make this work with the Bears, let the Cubs be off on their own. It's funny to me how the Arlington Heights thing disappeared even with the Sox owning land out there. Seemed inevitable the Sox would move to suburbia someday.

Given the political climate and the lack of any news about a Sox stadium I highly doubt this will ever get off the ground for them.

Pritzker is dead set against giving state funds (and rightfully so in my opinion) so if JR wants a new stadium he and his other investors are going to have to come up with the money themselves. It was done by the owners of the S.F. Giants and Dolphins, there's no reason the Sox can't do that too. 

Besides there is nothing wrong with GRF that a winning team and a competent front office would solve. 

[77 Hitmen]

On 5/21/2024 at 2:33 PM, southsider2k5 said:

Even if you divide the Chicago market into 2/3 Cubs, and 1/3 for the Sox, that 1/3 of Chicagoland is bigger than pretty much anywhere left as a viable baseball expansion candidate.  If someone is going to pay a couple of billion dollars for an expansion team, they could do a LOT worse than the Chicago market, even as a secondary team.  In this made up scenario where the Sox leave Chicago, MLB could force JR to leave behind the name and history, which also leaves them a ready made audience for that expansion team instead of building from scratch.

First, I do indeed agree that JR is bluffing on his veiled threat of a franchise move for the reason you state.

However, in the unlikely event that the Sox do move, I just don't see MLB having any interest in putting a team back in Chicago.  The A's are leaving one of the biggest TV markets in the nation (The Bay Area) for what will be one of the smallest ones.   In response, Manfred shrugged and said MLB is already covered in the Bay Area by the Giants.  If an expansion team comes out west, it'll likely be in Salt Lake City (a much, much smaller market than the Bay Area) and not as a reincarnation of the Oakland A's.   I expect a similar scenario if the Sox ever moved.  MLB will be interested in expanding into some untapped, growing market from a city/state that is willing to spend lots of public dollars on an MLB ballpark (just like Salt Lake City where the state of Utah is willing to spend $900M in public money on an MLB park).  

I don't think the Sox are moving, but Sox fans need to stop fooling themselves into thinking MLB cares about putting a 2nd team back here into an also-ran ballpark (sorry, I like GRF too, but let's face reality, most people don't) and a neighborhood without much else to draw people in.

Sox fans shouldn't panic and cave in to JR's demands by any means, but the danger is that too many will think it "won't matter" if the Sox move because we'll certainly get White Sox 2.0 asap.  That smacks of whistling past the cemetery to me.  

Edited May 24 by 77 Hitmen

[77 Hitmen]

On 5/6/2024 at 11:00 AM, WBWSF said:

It sure has been quiet about the new White Sox  stadium.

There's nothing much else to say.  The Sox and Bears proposals are non-starters.  The Governor and some state reps have clearly said so.  

That doesn't mean a Sox stadium will never be built at Lot 78.  But it might several years from now and under a new ownership who will be willing to cover most, if not all, of the cost of a stadium itself.   My guess is that would be enough to sell politicians on paying for the infrastructure costs to develop the site.  Until something else is built on that site, it'll still be an option for the Sox once ownership decides to privately finance something like $1B toward such a stadium.   

As far as the Bears go, I actually wouldn't be surprised if they end up back at Arlington Park.  There's simply too huge of a funding gap to bridge in that jaw-dropping price tag for their lakefront dome proposal

[southsider2k5]

22 minutes ago, 77 Hitmen said:

First, I do indeed agree that JR is bluffing on his veiled threat of a franchise move for the reason you state.

However, in the unlikely event that the Sox do move, I just don't see MLB having any interest in putting a team back in Chicago.  The A's are leaving one of the biggest TV markets in the nation (The Bay Area) for what will be one of the smallest ones.   In response, Manfred shrugged and said MLB is already covered in the Bay Area by the Giants.  If an expansion team comes out west, it'll likely be in Salt Lake City (a much, much smaller market than the Bay Area) and not as a reincarnation of the Oakland A's.   I expect a similar scenario if the Sox ever moved.  MLB will be interested in expanding into some untapped, growing market from a city/state that is willing to spend lots of public dollars on an MLB ballpark (just like Salt Lake City where the state of Utah is willing to spend $900M in public money on an MLB park).  

I don't think the Sox are moving, but Sox fans need to stop fooling themselves into thinking MLB cares about putting a 2nd team back here into an also-ran ballpark (sorry, I like GRF too, but let's face reality, most people don't) and a neighborhood without much else to draw people in.

Sox fans shouldn't panic and cave in to JR's demands by any means, but the danger is that too many will think it "won't matter" if the Sox move because we'll certainly get White Sox 2.0 asap.  That smacks of whistling past the cemetery to me.  

MLB cares about money, and there is a LOT more of it in Chicago than anywhere else left to put a baseball team, especially if we are talking about a couple of billion for an expansion team.  With Vegas off of the map, it isn't like there is some huge market waiting for a team.  Chicago is just under a 10 million person metro area.  That is like 3 million if you even carve it down to 1/3 of the market.  Every single market of that size already has a team in the US.  The closest is Charlotte at 2.8 million.  Nashville and Indianapolis are like 2 million people.  Portland is 2.5 million.  Salt Lake City is 1.2 million people.  No where else nearly that small has a team in MLB today.  Remember there will two expansion teams, and the odds are if the team moved, it would be to one of those markets, so essentially that means Chicago has a HUGE size edge on anyone else.  It's not about emotions, it is about dollars, and Chicago has more of them, even divided up, than any other market place left.

[tray]

The title of the OP is a lie. The Sox have never been looking to build in the S Loop and particularly not at that dumpsite known as Area 78. Give it a break already.

[DoUEvenShift]

7 minutes ago, tray said:

The title of the OP is a lie. The Sox have never been looking to build in the S Loop and particularly not at that dumpsite known as Area 78. Give it a break already.

Didn't you say you were done with this thread 40 pages and several posts ago?

[southsider2k5]

33 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Didn't you say you were done with this thread 40 pages and several posts ago?

Forget it, he's rolling. 

[tray]

54 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Didn't you say you were done with this thread 40 pages and several posts ago?

I was done with this  non-issue but at some point I had to ask, once again, that this nonsense stop. Unfortunately some people are either misguided or have an agenda, or both.

[southsider2k5]

8 minutes ago, tray said:

I was done with this  non-issue but at some point I had to ask, once again, that this nonsense stop. Unfortunately some people are either misguided or have an agenda, or both.

You don't say.

[tray]

Just now, southsider2k5 said:

You don't say.

or need to get a job.

[Kyyle23]

9 minutes ago, tray said:

I was done with this  non-issue but at some point I had to ask, once again, that this nonsense stop. Unfortunately some people are either misguided or have an agenda, or both.

Nobody cares that this issue bothers you.  See yourself out of the thread and stop being such a grandstanding baby about it

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, tray said:

or need to get a job.

I am just going to say it.  There are a million news stories to say that you are wrong here. Jerry Reinsdorf himself went to Springfield to lobby for money for this exact project.  Unless you have actual evidence, and not just your own spin, you are 100% wrong here.  If that bothers you, either show some evidence or go away.

[tray]

3 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Nobody cares that this issue bothers you.  See yourself out of the thread and stop being such a grandstanding baby about it

I will obey your command and stop posting but your name calling is misguided bulshit.

[Kyyle23]

7 hours ago, tray said:

I will obey your command and stop posting but your name calling is misguided bulshit.

Your entire schtick is misguided bullshit

[hi8is]

24 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Your entire schtick is misguided bullshit

I feel bad that mods can’t use the Hall of Fame List feature. I totally had forgotten about that guy. ?

[Lip Man 1]

Read a story in the Tribune this morning, the Bears stadium issue will not be discussed by the state legislature this spring session. It is now off the table until the fall.

Story quoted a representative as saying that was good. More time was needed to examine every aspect.

Also apparently now there is a movement that any state funds that may go to either the Bears or White Sox must also include funding for a women's sports stadium which will complicate the situation even more than it already is. 

[The Mighty Mite]

On 5/24/2024 at 4:54 PM, southsider2k5 said:

MLB cares about money, and there is a LOT more of it in Chicago than anywhere else left to put a baseball team, especially if we are talking about a couple of billion for an expansion team.  With Vegas off of the map, it isn't like there is some huge market waiting for a team.  Chicago is just under a 10 million person metro area.  That is like 3 million if you even carve it down to 1/3 of the market.  Every single market of that size already has a team in the US.  The closest is Charlotte at 2.8 million.  Nashville and Indianapolis are like 2 million people.  Portland is 2.5 million.  Salt Lake City is 1.2 million people.  No where else nearly that small has a team in MLB today.  Remember there will two expansion teams, and the odds are if the team moved, it would be to one of those markets, so essentially that means Chicago has a HUGE size edge on anyone else.  It's not about emotions, it is about dollars, and Chicago has more of them, even divided up, than any other market place left.

The big problem is the White Sox year by year are becoming less and less relevant in the Chicago Metropolitan area and their share of the market is becoming less and less. Places like NW Indiana and SW Michigan were once home to many White Sox fans but are now Cubs country. The Sox have never been popular in Illinois south of Chicago as that is Cubs and Cardinal country. We will in our lifetimes never see the Sox as popular as the Cubs, the only hope is new ownership along with a new stadium at the 78 property which will help with out of towners and the local casual fan who won’t travel to 35th and Shields but would make the trip to the South Loop to catch a Sox game. All my acquaintances that I’ve known in my years in Florida and have visited Chicago never took in a game at the new park but of course saw a Cubs game at Wrigley, a few old timers did visit old Comiskey in the 1950s and 60s.
I’m old enough to remember when Chicago had 2 NFL teams, in fact I went to the second to last Cardinal game in 1959. I remember the NBA Packers/Zephyrs who lasted 2 years in Chicago and moved to Baltimore and are now the Washington Wizards, went to a few of their games when they played at the Amphitheater. This notion that MLB will never let the White Sox leave Chicago is a bunch of baloney, money talks, bull s%*# walks. Don’t ever forget that MLB let the Dodgers and Giants leave New York City after the 1957 season, who would have predicted that. The next couple of years on and off the field will tell a lot about the future of the Sox in Chicago, keep your fingers crossed.

Edited May 26 by The Mighty Mite

[WBWSF]

5 hours ago, The Mighty Mite said:

The big problem is the White Sox year by year are becoming less and less relevant in the Chicago Metropolitan area and their share of the market is becoming less and less. Places like NW Indiana and SW Michigan were once home to many White Sox fans but are now Cubs country. The Sox have never been popular in Illinois south of Chicago as that is Cubs and Cardinal country. We will in our lifetimes never see the Sox as popular as the Cubs, the only hope is new ownership along with a new stadium at the 78 property which will help with out of towners and the local casual fan who won’t travel to 35th and Shields but would make the trip to the South Loop to catch a Sox game. All my acquaintances that I’ve known in my years in Florida and have visited Chicago never took in a game at the new park but of course saw a Cubs game at Wrigley, a few old timers did visit old Comiskey in the 1950s and 60s.
I’m old enough to remember when Chicago had 2 NFL teams, in fact I went to the second to last Cardinal game in 1959. I remember the NBA Packers/Zephyrs who lasted 2 years in Chicago and moved to Baltimore and are now the Washington Wizards, went to a few of their games when they played at the Amphitheater. This notion that MLB will never let the White Sox leave Chicago is a bunch of baloney, money talks, bull s%*# walks. Don’t ever forget that MLB let the Dodgers and Giants leave New York City after the 1957 season, who would have predicted that. The next couple of years on and off the field will tell a lot about the future of the Sox in Chicago, keep your fingers crossed.

I saw my heavy duty White Sox contact Friday.He said they are definitely not renewing the lease at the present stadium.A new White Sox stadium will be built in the Chicagoland area. And it might not be in the  South Loop.  It should be worked out by the end of the year. We shall see.

[The Mighty Mite]

11 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

I saw my heavy duty White Sox contact Friday.He said they are definitely not renewing the lease at the present stadium.A new White Sox stadium will be built in the Chicagoland area. And it might not be in the  South Loop.  It should be worked out by the end of the year. We shall see.

Didn’t Reinsdorf buy some land near the United Center, maybe it will be built there. I still think 78 is the better place.

Edited May 26 by The Mighty Mite

[Lip Man 1]

13 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

I saw my heavy duty White Sox contact Friday. He said they are definitely not renewing the lease at the present stadium. A new White Sox stadium will be built in the Chicagoland area. And it might not be in the  South Loop.  It should be worked out by the end of the year. We shall see.

Just wondering...is this the same contact of yours who supposedly told you JR is selling the team?

And I guess your thoughts in the spring about this being a good year for the Sox isn't coming to pass anytime soon.

[Lightly Folded]

39 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

I saw my heavy duty White Sox contact Friday.He said they are definitely not renewing the lease at the present stadium.A new White Sox stadium will be built in the Chicagoland area. And it might not be in the  South Loop.  It should be worked out by the end of the year. We shall see.

The Sox stadium at the 78 is dead, unless Jerry and some compadres tote the entire cost of the endeavor which is not going to happen. The bigger problem is that the state of Illinois does not make money on the current Sox deal but rather lose money to the White Sox every year. Therefore, there is no guarantee that the state of Illinois would, or could negotiate another extension when the current one expires without infuriating, the taxpayers of Illinois. Jerry would have to agree to paying the state as opposed to the state paying Jerry and that’s not going to happen. The White Sox may very well wind up without any ballpark to play in when the current lease expires. At least no place locally.