Capn12 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Don't have the source article, just heard Sportscenter say so. Petitte is not gonna agree to a contract with the Yanks, and will be a FA. I think it's pretty obvious that Andy is goin to the Astros, with the money they just cleared from Wagner. The domino effect could definately be Colon to NYY now. So we better get ready to put the full court press on Sidney Ponson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Ponson just scares me. After reading about the O's stacking him against 4th and 5th starters to inflate his numbers all year, and then watching him choke at the end of the year, I just get the fear that we would be looking at Todd Ritchie part 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 I'm not real sold on Ponson, nor on giving 6-7 mill to a guy to be our #3 starter. What will Buehrle and Loz think about being outpaid by a new guy unproven to this team? Hopefully, that wouldnt matter to them, but something still bothers me about Ponson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I'm not real sold on Ponson, nor on giving 6-7 mill to a guy to be our #3 starter. What will Buehrle and Loz think about being outpaid by a new guy unproven to this team? Hopefully, that wouldnt matter to them, but something still bothers me about Ponson Can you pull up Colon's stats at 27 and compare to Ponson. I think the age thing will really work for Sid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Petitte is not gonna agree to a contract with the Yanks, and will be a FA. While I think there is a good possibility that Pettite will sign with the Astros, I think there is an equally good chance he will re-sign with the Yankees. Just because a player files for Free Agency, DOES NOT mean he will not re-sign with his original club. Let's all learn this concept and not forget.... Often times a player files, tests the market and then stays put. It is not a novel concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 First Sidney Ponson, who turned 27 this year: Year Team G GS W L SV CG SHO IP H R ER HR BB K ERA WHIP BAA 2001 BAL 23 23 5 10 0 3 1 138.1 161 83 76 21 37 84 4.94 1.43 .289 2002 BAL 28 28 7 9 0 3 0 176.0 172 84 80 26 63 120 4.09 1.34 .258 2003 BAL 21 21 14 6 0 4 0 148.0 147 65 62 10 43 100 3.77 1.28 .258 2003 SFO 10 10 3 6 0 0 0 68.0 64 29 28 6 18 34 3.71 1.21 .255 Now Colon, who turned 27 in 2000: Year Team G GS W L SV CG SHO IP H R ER HR BB K ERA WHIP BAA 1997 CLE 19 17 4 7 0 1 0 94 107 66 59 12 45 66 5.65 1.62 .000 1998 CLE 31 31 14 9 0 6 2 204 205 91 84 15 79 158 3.71 1.39 .000 1999 CLE 32 32 18 5 0 1 1 205 185 97 90 24 76 161 3.95 1.27 .000 2000 CLE 30 30 15 8 0 2 1 188 163 86 81 21 98 212 3.88 1.39 .233 And Rex, I know it doesnt mean he isn't gonna re-up with the Yanks, but I just think that its al lsetting up for him to land in Houston, back home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmmmbeeer Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Ponson just scares me. After reading about the O's stacking him against 4th and 5th starters to inflate his numbers all year, and then watching him choke at the end of the year, I just get the fear that we would be looking at Todd Ritchie part 2. I don't want to see Ponson either. There was another post that mentioned Miguel Batista out in AZ will not sign until his role is defined. I'm pretty sure if we offered him a guaranteed starting spot we could get him for much less money than Ponson. Another guy I wouldn't mind seeing next year that would come cheap is Pedro Astacio. He hasn't had an outstanding career but he seems to have pretty good stuff. I guess it all boils down to $. There's no reason to spend a ton of money on Petite, Ponson, or Millwood when their production won't be that much better than a Bautista or Pavano. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 There's no reason to spend a ton of money on Petite, Ponson, or Millwood when their production won't be that much better than a Bautista or Pavano. Hey.. can you give me the winning lottery numbers..? <_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreye Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Ponson just scares me. After reading about the O's stacking him against 4th and 5th starters to inflate his numbers all year, and then watching him choke at the end of the year, I just get the fear that we would be looking at Todd Ritchie part 2. Thank you! I couldn't agree more? This is "The Guy"??? Give me a break. I wouldn't mind having him as a Number 5, but as a backup to MB and Loaiza? No way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Thank you! I couldn't agree more? This is "The Guy"??? Give me a break. I wouldn't mind having him as a Number 5, but as a backup to MB and Loaiza? No way. LOL.. MB started out 2-10... so because Sid didn't do so well at the end of the season, versus at the begining, he sucks. Oye ve... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 LOL.. MB started out 2-10... so because Sid didn't do so well at the end of the season, versus at the begining, he sucks. Oye ve... Thank you Steff! This Ponson bashing is odd. He would be a welcome addition to the staff. Considering he would not be looked upon as the #1 guy. What we need is a solid starting rotation, not an ace. Spend more $$ on streghthening our bullpen and we're good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sox4lifeinPA Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Ponson just scares me. After reading about the O's stacking him against 4th and 5th starters to inflate his numbers all year, and then watching him choke at the end of the year, I just get the fear that we would be looking at Todd Ritchie part 2. what do you mean by choke? i don't think you can say much about his experience in SF. He lost 3 in a row, then won 3 in a row, then lost three in a row. Seems streaky. lost a game giving up 4 hits (3ERs) in 8.1 innings. lost another with 7 hits, 2 ERs, in 7.1 inn. His wins 6-4 win over FLA at home 6.0, 6 hits, 2 ER 6-4 win AT COL. 7.2, 5 H, 1 ER 2-0 win AT ARI. 8.0, 6 H, 0 ER If Garland could ever make up his mind whether he wants to play in the big leagues for real, we could sign Ponson and have moderately good 3-4 and great 1-2 pitchers. who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 And again, I don't mind bringing Ponson in, but I cant see a #3 making twice as much as either the #1 or 2, seems a bit bass ackwards to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 And again, I don't mind bringing Ponson in, but I cant see a #3 making twice as much as either the #1 or 2, seems a bit bass ackwards to me. Loaiza's salary is set. No one thought he'd do what he did. No way around that. If he had only won 10 and they picked him up people would be b****ing he was making too much. Mark has yet to be assigned a salary yet this year. Why assume that he's not going to get $3 or $4 or $5 million? Maybe they'll do ONE thing right this off-season.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Loaiza's salary is set. No one thought he'd do what he did. No way around that. If he had only won 10 and they picked him up people would be b****ing he was making too much. Mark has yet to be assigned a salary yet this year. Why assume that he's not going to get $3 or $4 or $5 million? Maybe they'll do ONE thing right this off-season.. With MB if past negotiations are any indicator, this one might end up in arbitration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I want Colon back here next year. Thats my Christmas present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreye Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 LOL.. MB started out 2-10... so because Sid didn't do so well at the end of the season, versus at the begining, he sucks. Oye ve... I just don't think he can be a difference maker. He wasn't for San Francisco. Career ERA of 4.54. Don't get me wrong, I'll take him, but I just don't want Kenny Williams to tell me that he's our answer to replacing Colon AND filling in the gaping hole at Number 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Here's what I do with Buehrle if I am the Sox. Offer him 4 years, $30 million. (that way we can at least keep him an additional season past his service time) 2004: $5 mil 2005: $7 mil 2006: $8 mil 2007: $10 mil If they offer that, I am pretty positive he'd sign. But knowing our owner, we'd never offer anything that great to Mark B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Loaiza's salary is set. No one thought he'd do what he did. No way around that. If he had only won 10 and they picked him up people would be b****ing he was making too much. Mark has yet to be assigned a salary yet this year. Why assume that he's not going to get $3 or $4 or $5 million? Maybe they'll do ONE thing right this off-season.. With MB if past negotiations are any indicator, this one might end up in arbitration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I want Colon back here next year. Thats my Christmas present. Sorry.. you get coal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Here's what I do with Buehrle if I am the Sox. Offer him 4 years, $30 million. (that way we can at least keep him an additional season past his service time) 2004: $5 mil 2005: $7 mil 2006: $8 mil 2007: $10 mil If they offer that, I am pretty positive he'd sign. But knowing our owner, we'd never offer anything that great to Mark B. They tried to get him to give up a year of free agency last year. He said no. I don't remember the $$... but I don't think that was the deal breaker. I'm pretty sure it was the FA issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Loaiza's salary is set. No one thought he'd do what he did. No way around that. If he had only won 10 and they picked him up people would be b****ing he was making too much. Mark has yet to be assigned a salary yet this year. Why assume that he's not going to get $3 or $4 or $5 million? Maybe they'll do ONE thing right this off-season.. With MB if past negotiations are any indicator, this one might end up in arbitration. I agree with Steff on this. If the Sox wouldn't lowball people on their offers, they'd be more successful. It's funny how they'll dish out all that money for Koch or Konerko yet when it comes to their young STUDS like Buehrle they are greedy as hell. If they aren't going to give Buehrle a fair deal, then why should he sign? Maybe once he leaves and goes somewhere where management appreciates him, the Sox will finally learn a freakin lesson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Loaiza's salary is set. No one thought he'd do what he did. No way around that. If he had only won 10 and they picked him up people would be b****ing he was making too much. Mark has yet to be assigned a salary yet this year. Why assume that he's not going to get $3 or $4 or $5 million? Maybe they'll do ONE thing right this off-season.. With MB if past negotiations are any indicator, this one might end up in arbitration. What? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Here's what I do with Buehrle if I am the Sox. Offer him 4 years, $30 million. (that way we can at least keep him an additional season past his service time) 2004: $5 mil 2005: $7 mil 2006: $8 mil 2007: $10 mil If they offer that, I am pretty positive he'd sign. But knowing our owner, we'd never offer anything that great to Mark B. They tried to get him to give up a year of free agency last year. He said no. I don't remember the $$... but I don't think that was the deal breaker. I'm pretty sure it was the FA issue. The extra year of FA wasn't even the big thing. There was a big chunk of the money that wasn't guarenteed, and was a team only option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I agree with Steff on this. If the Sox wouldn't lowball people on their offers, they'd be more successful. It's funny how they'll dish out all that money for Koch or Konerko yet when it comes to their young STUDS like Buehrle they are greedy as hell. If they aren't going to give Buehrle a fair deal, then why should he sign? Maybe once he leaves and goes somewhere where management appreciates him, the Sox will finally learn a freakin lesson. I'd sure like to see them do right for homegrown guys like Mark unstead of screwing them over, only to offer less deserving FA's the deals they do. Hopefully they can make Mark and offer that makes him happy, and isn't inflated with incentive-based bonuses rather than guaranteed money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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