WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Look I have no problem with the idea that you can deal Thompson if you using all of that internal knowledge, feel like you can't get out of him what you need to turn him into something. What I have a problem with is turning him into literally nothing. Nothing. Because you do need to be hording future pieces, and not 35 year old OFs. It's a good thing they're not hoarding 35 year old OFs. AAA is for stowing guys with experience who could be a 4th OF on the big club for a week in a pinch. Matt Thompson isn't in the tier of arms that is Thorpe, Iriarte, Bush, Eder, Adams, Nastrini, Cannon and Shuster. I think the issue is they paid to take a flyer on Horn, found he wasn't going to be fixed any time soon, and didn't want to pull him back from waivers and cut somebody else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 26 minutes ago, T R U said: Of course, 95% of us knew this. I still believe that Getz thought the roster he put together would be WAY closer than what has happened so far. This is what I believe. Getz (and JR) knew that they wouldn’t be competitive, even in this division. But they still didn’t think it would be a historically bad team. Even Vegas had them right around 64.5 wins so at least slightly better than last season. Right now they are one pace for 32-130 so Getz is panicking by signing older and largely washed up guys to try and get to 50+ wins and avoid absolute embarrassment while jettisoning 20 something MiLB guys. A guy like Bailey Horn is never going to be a star, but he’s at least young organizational filler as you start what appears to likely be a 3-4 year rebuild. Jose Rodriguez is the same story. He’s a 23 year old guy at AA that hit .361 in A ball and .264 at AA last season. Is there really any point to have guys like Lopez or DeJong on the team while dumping him for cash except…you don’t want to have the worst MLB record of all time? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 2 minutes ago, WestEddy said: It's a good thing they're not hoarding 35 year old OFs. AAA is for stowing guys with experience who could be a 4th OF on the big club for a week in a pinch. Matt Thompson isn't in the tier of arms that is Thorpe, Iriarte, Bush, Eder, Adams, Nastrini, Cannon and Shuster. I think the issue is they paid to take a flyer on Horn, found he wasn't going to be fixed any time soon, and didn't want to pull him back from waivers and cut somebody else. His arm is as good as any in the system, but he is further away from that ceiling. If the Sox were trading any of their dog water type players, a guy like Thompson would be a smart return in an attempt to capture more ceiling. The bigger problem is the short term thinking that leads to a guy like Thompson essentially being lost for nothing. That's just stupid as a team who is YEARS away. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 11 minutes ago, greg775 said: Man, 55 wins is optimistic. Sox would have to win more than six games per month to accomplish that feat. I didn't say it was successful. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 I have zero problem trading Matthew Thompson but what I would like to know is who in the organization advocated for reacquiring Bailey Horn because they got a look at him and obviously did not like what they saw. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 6 minutes ago, Rusty said: This is what I believe. Getz (and JR) knew that they wouldn’t be competitive, even in this division. But they still didn’t think it would be a historically bad team. Even Vegas had them right around 64.5 wins so at least slightly better than last season. Right now they are one pace for 32-130 so Getz is panicking by signing older and largely washed up guys to try and get to 50+ wins and avoid absolute embarrassment while jettisoning 20 something MiLB guys. A guy like Bailey Horn is never going to be a star, but he’s at least young organizational filler as you start what appears to likely be a 3-4 year rebuild. Jose Rodriguez is the same story. He’s a 23 year old guy at AA that hit .361 in A ball and .264 at AA last season. Is there really any point to have guys like Lopez or DeJong on the team while dumping him for cash except…you don’t want to have the worst MLB record of all time? If you think DeJong is bad, wait until you see what Jose Rodriguez and his AA .177/.288/.294 stat line would look like in the majors. When you introduce guys like Fletcher, Sosa or Colas to a 3-20 team, where nobody is hitting, they will fail. The spotlight is right on those guys, they press, and get worse. If you at least have a team of players who can carry their own weight, then you have the opportunity to plug Lenyn Sosa in at 2B or 3B, and let him flail for weeks until he gets his feet under him. You can't run an entire lineup of those guys out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 3 minutes ago, WestEddy said: If you think DeJong is bad, wait until you see what Jose Rodriguez and his AA .177/.288/.294 stat line would look like in the majors. When you introduce guys like Fletcher, Sosa or Colas to a 3-20 team, where nobody is hitting, they will fail. The spotlight is right on those guys, they press, and get worse. If you at least have a team of players who can carry their own weight, then you have the opportunity to plug Lenyn Sosa in at 2B or 3B, and let him flail for weeks until he gets his feet under him. You can't run an entire lineup of those guys out there. Ugh. There isn't a problem with roster filler at the major league level. There is a problem with losing future guys to sign those guys. Stopping dropping prospects every couple of days to sign another shitty journeyman who you are going to cut in a week anyway for a season that literally doesn't matter. And yes, allowing some of those AAA guys more than an AB at the major league level is an OK thing, even if they aren't good for a while. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 14 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: And yes, allowing some of those AAA guys more than an AB at the major league level is an OK thing, even if they aren't good for a while. It is if they aren't seen as a major source of offense. And when Sosa came up, he was kind of portrayed as the guy who is raking at AAA. But he didn't hit for a week, pressed, started making boneheaded mistakes, then he's seen as part of the problem. Right now, I could see bringing Sosa back up and giving him an extended look. Benny, Pham, Sheets, Mendick and Lee are all pretty much producing. DeJong and Lopez are what they're going to be. That's a situation where Sosa won't be making headlines for messing up a rundown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 So many small moves add up to big mistakes with this org. I think the Tatis Jr trade was the baseball gods smiting us for a decade of them. This season is probably the 2nd smiting. We'll have another in 2034. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 15 minutes ago, WestEddy said: It is if they aren't seen as a major source of offense. And when Sosa came up, he was kind of portrayed as the guy who is raking at AAA. But he didn't hit for a week, pressed, started making boneheaded mistakes, then he's seen as part of the problem. Right now, I could see bringing Sosa back up and giving him an extended look. Benny, Pham, Sheets, Mendick and Lee are all pretty much producing. DeJong and Lopez are what they're going to be. That's a situation where Sosa won't be making headlines for messing up a rundown. If guys like Sosa don't get the chance to play through failure, they will never will succeed at the major league level. If guys like Sosa and Colas aren't mentally ready for the majors in a basic sense, maybe we should look at who oversaw the system when they were supposed to be learning how to be ready for the majors in terms of baseball IQ. If major league management can't teach these guys how to be major leaguers, maybe we should look at who is running the major league program. If a steady stream of minor leaguers isn't good enough to even serve as a potential pieces for the future, maybe we should look at the drafting and development people. You see how your excuses all have one common theme, right? 2 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 1 hour ago, WestEddy said: If you think DeJong is bad, wait until you see what Jose Rodriguez and his AA .177/.288/.294 stat line would look like in the majors. When you introduce guys like Fletcher, Sosa or Colas to a 3-20 team, where nobody is hitting, they will fail. The spotlight is right on those guys, they press, and get worse. If you at least have a team of players who can carry their own weight, then you have the opportunity to plug Lenyn Sosa in at 2B or 3B, and let him flail for weeks until he gets his feet under him. You can't run an entire lineup of those guys out there. Certainly doesn't feel anywhere near a Top Ten farm system where the depth issues exposed last year are simply repeating again. I guess Pham even at 36 can actually look like a decent offensive player...but having him in CF is just going to lead to a cascading amount of disasters in the outfield. And better overall infield play being sabotaged any time you have Maldonado out there behind the dish. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: If guys like Sosa don't get the chance to play through failure, they will never will succeed at the major league level. If guys like Sosa and Colas aren't mentally ready for the majors in a basic sense, maybe we should look at who oversaw the system when they were supposed to be learning how to be ready for the majors in terms of baseball IQ. If major league management can't teach these guys how to be major leaguers, maybe we should look at who is running the major league program. If a steady stream of minor leaguers isn't good enough to even serve as a potential pieces for the future, maybe we should look at the drafting and development people. You see how your excuses all have one common theme, right? I'm not aware of any excuses. All roads seem to lead back to Chris Getz having done something really bad to you at one point in your life. The Orioles didn't seem to prepare Jackson Holliday to be a major leaguer. Lenyn Sosa had a few extended opportunities in the majors. He sure seems like a AAAA player to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 Just now, WestEddy said: I'm not aware of any excuses. All roads seem to lead back to Chris Getz having done something really bad to you at one point in your life. The Orioles didn't seem to prepare Jackson Holliday to be a major leaguer. Lenyn Sosa had a few extended opportunities in the majors. He sure seems like a AAAA player to me. I like how at one point you talk about these so-called "facts" you like to post, and then this is how you respond. And yes, Chris Getz is ruining my favorite baseball franchise, and I consider that really bad. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 (edited) 2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: If guys like Sosa don't get the chance to play through failure, they will never will succeed at the major league level. If guys like Sosa and Colas aren't mentally ready for the majors in a basic sense, maybe we should look at who oversaw the system when they were supposed to be learning how to be ready for the majors in terms of baseball IQ. If major league management can't teach these guys how to be major leaguers, maybe we should look at who is running the major league program. If a steady stream of minor leaguers isn't good enough to even serve as a potential pieces for the future, maybe we should look at the drafting and development people. You see how your excuses all have one common theme, right? To piggyback off this, if Paul DeJong isn't catching the ball (this is based on a VERY recent play), than he's useless to this team. Give the PT to Sosa. What do you have to lose? Their numbers will be close at the end of the season. Edited May 1 by Bob Sacamano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 10 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: I like how at one point you talk about these so-called "facts" you like to post, and then this is how you respond. And yes, Chris Getz is ruining my favorite baseball franchise, and I consider that really bad. Sounds like you should be talking to a therapist, and not whining to anyone who will listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 Just now, WestEddy said: Sounds like you should be talking to a therapist, and not whining to anyone who will listen. Cool. Then run along. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 24 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Cool. Then run along. You too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 30 minutes ago, WestEddy said: You too. OK Boomer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 5 hours ago, WestEddy said: If you at least have a team of players who can carry their own weight, then you have the opportunity to plug Lenyn Sosa in at 2B or 3B, and let him flail for weeks until he gets his feet under him. You can't run an entire lineup of those guys out there. The Royals let Witt do his thing last year despite a horrific team/lineup. I say play anybody close to ready rather than Maldy and DeJong and other various stiffs on the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 (edited) Getz, not Hahn or Kenny, but Getz and only Getz had a horrible offseason and his frantic and ill-advised 40-man roster decisions in an attempt to fix things when those efforts are quite obviously futile have only made things worse. Anyone who doesn’t see this and can’t admit it must be blindly supporting Getz. Our GM is making decisions like a meth addict who ran out of his stash. Edited May 1 by WhiteSox2023 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Getz, not Hahn or Kenny, but Getz and only Getz had a horrible offseason and his frantic and ill-advised 40-man roster decisions in an attempt to fix things when those efforts are quite obviously futile have only made things worse. Anyone who doesn’t see this and can’t admit it must be blindly supporting Getz. Our GM is making decisions like a meth addict who ran out of his stash. Everyone knows Jeremy Haber's BlackBerry is still secretly running roster transactions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 35 minutes ago, Quin said: Everyone knows Jeremy Haber's BlackBerry is still secretly running roster transactions. Is he still attempting to hide out with Hahn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 2 hours ago, greg775 said: The Royals let Witt do his thing last year despite a horrific team/lineup. I say play anybody close to ready rather than Maldy and DeJong and other various stiffs on the club. Sosa is not the equal of Witt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 (edited) 19 hours ago, WestEddy said: Sosa is not the equal of Witt. If you were comparing to Thomas and Ventura (being top prospects who they gave a lot of rope to)...Robin might be the closest, but he was a polished All Everything collegian compared to a raw high schooler. Montgomery is the closest parallel. Edited May 2 by caulfield12 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 20 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: OK Boomer. That's what you often called me, back in the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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