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Story on Sox trade possibilities...

Lip Man 1

By Lip Man 1
in Trade Winds 2024

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Tony Grand Master

Tony

Posted
Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 4:24 PM, Bob Sacamano said:

Hopefully. But whether they are actually good contributors is another discussion.

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And that's kind of the key. It all has to work together. I'm probably wrong on this, I get that...but I really believe if Andrew Vaughn got drafted by, say the Brewers, he's a much better hitter in the Majors than he is today. Development happens in both the minor and major league levels. And while the drafts have seemingly been better under Mike Shirley (jury still very much out on that) it doesn't mean it's going to translate at the ML Level. I need to see that first, on a regular basis, before I believe the Sox have turned any sort of corner. 

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Y2Jimmy0
Y2Jimmy0

Th The issue is that the Sox don't get the perks of small market clubs. Can only draft in the top 6 one time instead of twice in a row, they don't receive extra competitive balance draft picks

southsider2k5
southsider2k5

And that is just from his own players wanting to leave.

southsider2k5
southsider2k5

If the return for Crochet was reduced for taking the Benny contract, Chris Getz should be fired for making that theoretical deal.

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JUSTgottaBELIEVE Grand Master

JUSTgottaBELIEVE

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  On 6/24/2024 at 4:57 PM, southsider2k5 said:

You mean the guy with an OPS 120 points higher than anyone on the Sox or with 5.2fWAR more than the entire position player roster combined, including double any one single players fWAR this year?  Yeah, what we would ever do with that kind of a failure.

And Cleveland has Jose Ramirez.

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9 fWAR in 2.5 season with the twins (~3.6 fWAR per season on average). Very good but he’s not a superstar. And Guardians have never signed a star free agent.

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JUSTgottaBELIEVE Grand Master

JUSTgottaBELIEVE

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  On 6/24/2024 at 5:34 PM, Tony said:

And that's kind of the key. It all has to work together. I'm probably wrong on this, I get that...but I really believe if Andrew Vaughn got drafted by, say the Brewers, he's a much better hitter in the Majors than he is today. Development happens in both the minor and major league levels. And while the drafts have seemingly been better under Mike Shirley (jury still very much out on that) it doesn't mean it's going to translate at the ML Level. I need to see that first, on a regular basis, before I believe the Sox have turned any sort of corner. 

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I agree. The jury is still out on Shirley. Just like the jury is still out on Getz even though many already have him pinned as worst GM in mlb. The early returns on Shirley drafts are encouraging though. I would think we could all agree on that at least?

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WestEddy Grand Master

WestEddy

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  On 6/24/2024 at 5:45 PM, JoeC said:

Let's start one.

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GreenSox Grand Master

GreenSox

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  On 6/24/2024 at 4:35 PM, southsider2k5 said:

Tim Anderson was that guy, at least until whatever happened after TLR got here.

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Anderson never had that level of OBP.

it's not that unusual for a player to have a few good years and then head south.  But when you had 2 glaring holes even when winning  (2b and RF) and no depth should something bad happen, it gets magnified.

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Timmy U Grand Master

Timmy U

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  On 6/24/2024 at 5:50 PM, WestEddy said:

 

 

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I have watched Termarr Johnson play A LOT. He walks. That is his only skill. He was supposed to be a 70 hitter. Thus far he is nowhere near that. He's 2b only and subpar there. You need an aircraft carrier in return for Robert, not a multitude of questionable guys. Why make this trade when you can just draft JJ Wetherholt? Hard. Pass.

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WestEddy Grand Master

WestEddy

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Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:56 PM, Timmy U said:

I have watched Termarr Johnson play A LOT. He walks. That is his only skill. He was supposed to be a 70 hitter. Thus far he is nowhere near that. He's 2b only and subpar there. You need an aircraft carrier in return for Robert, not a multitude of questionable guys. Why make this trade when you can just draft JJ Wetherholt? Hard. Pass.

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Unfortunately, idiot blogger trade proposals are probably all that will be bouncing around out there at least until after the draft.

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southsider2k5 Grand Master

southsider2k5

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  On 6/24/2024 at 5:39 PM, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

9 fWAR in 2.5 season with the twins (~3.6 fWAR per season on average). Very good but he’s not a superstar. And Guardians have never signed a star free agent.

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If he isn't a guy, then we are in real trouble, because Colson Montgomery hasn't shown anything near Carlos Correa.

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southsider2k5 Grand Master

southsider2k5

Posted
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  On 6/24/2024 at 5:34 PM, Tony said:

And that's kind of the key. It all has to work together. I'm probably wrong on this, I get that...but I really believe if Andrew Vaughn got drafted by, say the Brewers, he's a much better hitter in the Majors than he is today. Development happens in both the minor and major league levels. And while the drafts have seemingly been better under Mike Shirley (jury still very much out on that) it doesn't mean it's going to translate at the ML Level. I need to see that first, on a regular basis, before I believe the Sox have turned any sort of corner. 

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And instead of figuring that out, we are playing the geriatric crew for some reason.

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Squirmin' for Yermin Grand Master

Squirmin' for Yermin

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Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:56 PM, WestEddy said:

Blogger makes up Crochet to Mets proposal

 

https://fansided.com/posts/2-trades-to-save-mets-playoff-hopes-before-it-s-too-late

 

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That feels about right.  I'd try to swap Parada and Vasil for one guy higher though and make it a 2-1.

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Chicago White Sox Grand Master

Chicago White Sox

Posted
Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:56 PM, Timmy U said:

I have watched Termarr Johnson play A LOT. He walks. That is his only skill. He was supposed to be a 70 hitter. Thus far he is nowhere near that. He's 2b only and subpar there. You need an aircraft carrier in return for Robert, not a multitude of questionable guys. Why make this trade when you can just draft JJ Wetherholt? Hard. Pass.

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It’s a horrible proposal and Pirates fan are saying it’s way too much…lol.

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bighurt574 Experienced

bighurt574

Posted
Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 12:58 PM, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

You think if the Sox draft Jac next month it’s going to take 5+ years for him to be an MLB contributor? Why?

And you don’t need a lineup full of stars. Cleveland’s lineup is built around Jose Ramirez and 2018 5th round pick Steven Kwan.

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Never said that.  Jac is one guy.  Need a lot more than that, even if they're not all "stars."  

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bighurt574 Experienced

bighurt574

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  On 6/24/2024 at 3:28 PM, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Simple question. Do you think a draftee like Jac Caglianone won’t be an MLB contributor until 2029 at the earliest? That’s 5+ years from next months draft.

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No one said that.  Jac is one guy.  We need multiples.  We need several years of strong position player draftees at this point.  For each, you're likely looking at a couple years before they're MLB ready, and another year or two to get some MLB experience under their belt.  (Not many playoff teams led by rookies.)  

Best hope is to use a Robert, Crochet, and/or Fedde trade to jump start that some.  

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GreenSox Grand Master

GreenSox

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:56 PM, WestEddy said:

Blogger makes up Crochet to Mets proposal

 

https://fansided.com/posts/2-trades-to-save-mets-playoff-hopes-before-it-s-too-late

 

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That's a big negatory.  
Cease only yielded 1 bottom half top 100, so I guess that's what we can expect.  But I just don't care for those players.

I don't really care about top 100 either, given that we aren't going to get an elite prospect anyway,  It's asking a lot, but I'd like the Sox to be on top of some of these farm systems and find the players who will be top 100 this time next year.   The other team will be more amenable, will give up more of them, and they will have a "who could have known" excuse ready-made, which they will hopefully need.

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WestEddy Grand Master

WestEddy

Posted
Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 6:26 PM, Rey21 said:

White Sox could have simply taken De Los Santos in the Rule 5 draft in the offseason, looking at his number think they’re bummed they passed on him? 

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His 2023 numbers at AA didn't look like he was a break-out in the majors candidate, and besides, he was blocked by Yoan and Vaughn. 

oops

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bighurt574 Experienced

bighurt574

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:34 PM, Tony said:

And that's kind of the key. It all has to work together. I'm probably wrong on this, I get that...but I really believe if Andrew Vaughn got drafted by, say the Brewers, he's a much better hitter in the Majors than he is today. Development happens in both the minor and major league levels. And while the drafts have seemingly been better under Mike Shirley (jury still very much out on that) it doesn't mean it's going to translate at the ML Level. I need to see that first, on a regular basis, before I believe the Sox have turned any sort of corner. 

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Shirley seems like an improvement and has a good knack for spotting first round talent, but we still have a ways to go from a depth standpoint.  Need to hit on a few later picks too.  

2019 - pretty sparse after Vaughn, Thomas and Dahlquist have struggled

2020 - pretty sparse after Crochet, Kelley has struggled

2021 - pretty sparse after Montgomery though it's obviously early

2022 - after Schultz, you have Cannon and not much else at this point though it's early

2023 - after Gonzalez, it's obviously early, but hopefully Taylor develops

 

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GreenSox Grand Master

GreenSox

Posted
Posted
  On 6/24/2024 at 5:56 PM, Timmy U said:

I have watched Termarr Johnson play A LOT. He walks. That is his only skill. He was supposed to be a 70 hitter. Thus far he is nowhere near that. He's 2b only and subpar there. You need an aircraft carrier in return for Robert, not a multitude of questionable guys. Why make this trade when you can just draft JJ Wetherholt? Hard. Pass.

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Law concurs in your evaluation.  Pushed him out of his June top 50.

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