southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 13 hours ago, ChiSox59 said: Seems like a weird time to push Robert but here we are Seems like a weird time to not. Like what does having Robert the next few years give us anyway, and as a Boras guy, its not like he will extend again. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 1 minute ago, hi8is said: Yes he was https://www.fangraphs.com/players/rafael-devers/17350/stats?position=3B JR never would never have authorized his extension, but obviously they would had three hauls coming back via trade rather than merely two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 51 minutes ago, Quin said: So the idiot that was supposed to create depth for that rebuild "deserves" a shot? Deserve is a terrible word to use as a positive for anyone in this franchise, but realistically it is the move that makes the most sense, no matter who is doing it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 48 minutes ago, striker said: I like the Cubs or Orioles for Robert. Cubs: Caissie plus one of Shaw/Alcantara Orioles: Mayo, Beavers, Povich I’ll pass on beavers with a side of mayo. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 4 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: I like the Mariners but I don’t like who their headliner would be. Kjerstad + Mayo + Beavers makes a lot of sense for the Sox and I think would be about what I’d need to part with 3.5 years of Robert I just don't see the O's parting with their prospects. Especially not for a position player. They just lost two starting pitchers for the rest of the season, if they are making a trade that's where I think they would look to add. Mariners on the other hand desperately need a proven bat, two even. High-A is stacked with talent, but I think Getz would want guys closer to the bigs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 4 minutes ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: Do we think now that suddenly they will compliment a young core they get in return with 1st class free agents? They will not. It will be the same s%*#. Luis Robert will not be here by the time they have a competitive core anyway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 23 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said: SoxTalk- where trading an insignificant single A reliever for Corey Julks is sheer panic but firing the GM you hired 9 months ago for optics is reasonable. Mr Stawman build me a meme. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Seems like a weird time to not. Like what does having Robert the next few years give us anyway, and as a Boras guy, its not like he will extend again. If the Sox were only a 90 loss disappointment, I would worry less about Robert being wasted in this toxic org. But we are a far cry from a mere disappointment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 Perfectly ok with this. Robert isn't going to be on the next competitive team whenever that will be, but he won't be here because JR won't pay him. And Reinsdorf treats this team as a mid market team rather than the large market that they are. Crochet and Robert will have very high value Fedde and Kopech will bring back something useful DeJong, Pham and Sheets will bring back lottery tickets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Mite Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 3 hours ago, caulfield12 said: https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/scouting-industry-endures-most-brutal-offseason-in-recent-memory/ Everything was (relatively) fine with the White Sox scouting budgets until all the cutbacks these last two offseasons… One of the reasons JR must sell, he doesn’t believe in spending money on the minor league teams but he also won’t bring in top free agents so here we are, the worst team in baseball and maybe one of the worst of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBooneLoganEra Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Luis Robert will not be here by the time they have a competitive core anyway. Kicking the can for the next competitive team to 2028 is unacceptable and this fan base should not tolerate it. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 5 minutes ago, Tnetennba said: If the Sox were only a 90 loss disappointment, I would worry less about Robert being wasted in this toxic org. But we are a far cry from a mere disappointment. The Sox as a 90 loss team would be about 20 games from the playoffs. As they are on pace now they are 50 GAMES AWAY FROM THE PLAYOFFS! There are no sacred cows when you are staring in the eyes of the worst record in the history of modern baseball. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 4 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said: One of the reasons JR must sell, he doesn’t believe in spending money on the minor league teams but he also won’t bring in top free agents so here we are, the worst team in baseball and maybe one of the worst of all time. He said in the past that he doesn't believe in paying for "potential." and it shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 5 minutes ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: Kicking the can for the next competitive team to 2028 is unacceptable and this fan base should not tolerate it. Look at what is out on the field right now. The can is long past 2028 with Robert and Crochet in the picture. The can is already flying into the next decade. You can "tolerate" whatever you like, but there is no way to make up a 50 game gap between where we are now, and where we need to be to be a playoff team with the talent in the system right now. It just isn't there. Keeping 2 good pieces actually slows the process of getting enough talent into the system, and doesn't speed it up at all. As of today you can squint and see about half an offense? Where do the rest of it come from by 2028, because it sure isn't free agency. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 (edited) 15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Mr Stawman build me a meme. Imagine defending a guy who failed to develop players in his previous role (the very purpose of his job) and whom one of the worst owners in two professional sports then promoted to the most important job with the team without even interviewing another candidate. Edited June 7 by WhiteSox2023 2 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 10 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said: One of the reasons JR must sell, he doesn’t believe in spending money on the minor league teams but he also won’t bring in top free agents so here we are, the worst team in baseball and maybe one of the worst of all time. Two of our minor league teams are ranked top five of all affiliated minor league teams in organized baseball. Drafting, scouting and development has gotten better. We'll see what Reinsdorf's philosophy on signing top free agents is with TLR and Getz in his ear instead of KW/Hahn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 The idea of keeping Crochet and Robert makes way more sense if this was a 72-90 type season. This is not just a bad roster having a bad season, this is a historically bad roster on pace to have the worst season in baseball history. This is not something that can be fixed by next season, and probably not the season after. And by that time you’ll be about to lose those two anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBooneLoganEra Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Look at what is out on the field right now. The can is long past 2028 with Robert and Crochet in the picture. The can is already flying into the next decade. You can "tolerate" whatever you like, but there is no way to make up a 50 game gap between where we are now, and where we need to be to be a playoff team with the talent in the system right now. It just isn't there. Keeping 2 good pieces actually slows the process of getting enough talent into the system, and doesn't speed it up at all. As of today you can squint and see about half an offense? Where do the rest of it come from by 2028, because it sure isn't free agency. It's delusional to think an 81 win team can't be constructed in one off season. It can. And thats all we should be asking at this point. It takes cash and proper scouting. This organization has fooled you into thinking it's impossible. This team would be 10 games better with a competent manager on top of that. Then go from there. Rick had to convince Jerry the fan base would go along with a rebuild and we did. Shame on us. We shouldn't be fooled into it again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBooneLoganEra Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 This fan base is so broken. Colson Montgomery is gonna come up, have an all star 1st half in 2025, and half this board will push to trade him for prospects since we're not competing until 2030. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 2 minutes ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: It's delusional to think an 81 win team can't be constructed in one off season. It can. And thats all we should be asking at this point. It takes cash and proper scouting. This organization has fooled you into thinking it's impossible. This team would be 10 games better with a competent manager on top of that. Then go from there. Rick had to convince Jerry the fan base would go along with a rebuild and we did. Shame on us. We shouldn't be fooled into it again. The mob smugly assuring us we're 8-10 years away from anything are the same people screaming that signing Michael A. Taylor, Amed Rosario, Frankie Montas and a couple better relievers would have had this team "competitive" this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nardiwashere Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 6 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Imagine defending a guy who failed to develop players in his previous role (the very purpose of his job) and whom one of the worst owners in two professional sports then promoted to the most important job with the team without even interviewing another candidate. Its defending him to point out he isn't getting fired after less than a season of being hired? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 5 minutes ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: It's delusional to think an 81 win team can't be constructed in one off season. It can. And thats all we should be asking at this point. It takes cash and proper scouting. This organization has fooled you into thinking it's impossible. This team would be 10 games better with a competent manager on top of that. Then go from there. Rick had to convince Jerry the fan base would go along with a rebuild and we did. Shame on us. We shouldn't be fooled into it again. Unless you are willing to spend a billion dollars this off-season and trade away top prospects for talent, there is no way to make this shithole roster into an 80 win team next year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 It is June of 2024. Robert is only signed through 2027. This org doesn't even have foundational pieces that you could dream on being Major League players by the time Robert's deal is up. There is zero path with the way this org operates that they will be a competitive team again with Robert still under contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 1 minute ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: This fan base is so broken. Colson Montgomery is gonna come up, have an all star 1st half in 2025, and half this board will push to trade him for prospects since we're not competing until 2030. No, there's a difference. Next year, Colson at the AS break will have 5.5 years of control. Crochet has 2.5 years remaining, first time starting, and probably won't resign. Robert has 3.5 years remaining, consistently hurt and will bring back a ton. Also, has Boras as his agent, so he won't resign. It's quite simple logic actually, especially with the loser Reinsdorf owning this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 1 minute ago, TheBooneLoganEra said: It's delusional to think an 81 win team can't be constructed in one off season. It can. And thats all we should be asking at this point. It takes cash and proper scouting. This organization has fooled you into thinking it's impossible. This team would be 10 games better with a competent manager on top of that. Then go from there. Rick had to convince Jerry the fan base would go along with a rebuild and we did. Shame on us. We shouldn't be fooled into it again. I was thinking about this yesterday. In 1970 the Sox lost 106 games, the very next year they went 79-83, one of the biggest turnarounds from one season to the next in baseball history. Both Roland Hemond and Chuck Tanner told me the basic philosophy was, 'we'll trade a good player we have (Aparicio, Berry) for two players you have.' The Sox were getting back solid major league players (Andrews, Alvarado, Kelly, Reichardt, Johnstone, Egan, Bradley). Like I was told they weren't superstars but they were solid players that gave the Sox depth and experience. But times have changed, would Seattle give the Sox say three of the guys on their big league roster for Robert? Would the Padres give the Sox two of the guys on their big league roster for Crochet? I don't see how that would be possible. I just don't see how the Sox could turn things around so dramatically in a single season like you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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