southsider2k5 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falstaff Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 (edited) The Sox were 29th in 2023 revenue !?, holy cow. I had no clue they were that far down the list. A new owner will move the club out of Chicago in a heartbeat. Edited July 19 by Falstaff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 2 minutes ago, Falstaff said: The Sox were 29th in 2023 revenue !?, holy cow. I had no clue they were that far down the list. A new owner will move the club out of Chicago in a heartbeat. It's not the city, it's the franchise. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falstaff Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 5 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: It's not the city, it's the franchise. I hear you loud and clear , but someone with no ties to Chicago and spending billions to acquire the club might have a different plan. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19 Author Share Posted July 19 15 minutes ago, Falstaff said: The Sox were 29th in 2023 revenue !?, holy cow. I had no clue they were that far down the list. A new owner will move the club out of Chicago in a heartbeat. They were 29th because they had a 100 loss team. A new owner would see there is huge potential to the upside waiting to be captured. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 How in the heck did the Sox make almost 300 million last year? Where is all this TV money coming from?? All you hear about is companies struggling in this wretched economy and yet sports teams are not struggling at all cause of TV money. Where is all this money coming from for TV to make so much money? Advertisers?? I kind of find that hard to believe. Jersey sales? Concessions and parking? I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 20 minutes ago, Falstaff said: The Sox were 29th in 2023 revenue !?, holy cow. I had no clue they were that far down the list. A new owner will move the club out of Chicago in a heartbeat. The prospect of the White Sox moving out of Chicago has always titillated Cub fans. Not going to Happen. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: They were 29th because they had a 100 loss team. A new owner would see there is huge potential to the upside waiting to be captured. They still made almost 300 mill. The new owner will be swimming in dollar bills even tho I don't see how. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19 Author Share Posted July 19 4 minutes ago, greg775 said: They still made almost 300 mill. The new owner will be swimming in dollar bills even tho I don't see how. You do see that they lost money last year, right? According to these tables, they have lost money four years running. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falstaff Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 9 minutes ago, tray said: The prospect of the White Sox moving out of Chicago has always titillated Cub fans. Not going to Happen. sweet sweet music to my ears, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falstaff Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 (edited) The Cubs owners have much deeper pockets than Reinsdorf and are reaping in tons of cash from the properties they own around the Wrigley . Reinsy is supposed to be a big time real estate mogul , yeah right, another cheap move of zero investment in the neighborhood. dang , Edward DeBartollo should have been the man Edited July 19 by Falstaff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 18 minutes ago, greg775 said: How in the heck did the Sox make almost 300 million last year? Where is all this TV money coming from?? All you hear about is companies struggling in this wretched economy and yet sports teams are not struggling at all cause of TV money. Where is all this money coming from for TV to make so much money? Advertisers?? I kind of find that hard to believe. Jersey sales? Concessions and parking? I guess. Until any team allows an independent accountant to examine their books this is all speculation but Manfred has said MLB is now at least a 10 Billion dollar a year business. There are more revenue streams both domestically and internationally for MLB than ever before. And in the Sox case it is not just revenue from merchandise, parking, concessions and advertising it is the very team-friendly deal they have on the stadium with the ISSA. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19 Author Share Posted July 19 5 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said: Until any team allows an independent accountant to examine their books this is all speculation but Manfred has said MLB is now at least a 10 Billion dollar a year business. There are more revenue streams both domestically and internationally for MLB than ever before. And in the Sox case it is not just revenue from merchandise, parking, concessions and advertising it is the very team-friendly deal they have on the stadium with the ISSA. The Stadium deal would be within this shell. Parking revenue would not because Jerry owns the lots under a separate company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 28 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: The Stadium deal would be within this shell. Parking revenue would not because Jerry owns the lots under a separate company. Agreed but that income still goes to him. That's why it is so tricky to get a real accurate read on what a team does or does not make. There are so many ancillary companies and areas to stash revenue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 57 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: You do see that they lost money last year, right? According to these tables, they have lost money four years running. They didn't lose money. No team is opening their books to the honest figures, not publicly anyways. Lip man detailed it well. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 19 Share Posted July 19 13 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: They didn't lose money. No team is opening their books to the honest figures, not publicly anyways. Lip man detailed it well. The book The Lords of the Realm by John Helyar goes into detail on some of the ways teams were hiding income when MLB agreed (for the only time) to let an independent accountant examine their books. He was from Stanford. The accountant exploded Bud Selig's myth that 18 teams were losing money at the time of the 1994-95 labor impasse. MLB vowed they'd never open their books again (and they haven't) One example Helyar went into was the Braves under Ted Turner. Instead of putting up the broadcast rights for the club on the open market in Atlanta, he simply gave them to his own WTBS at a reduced rate. Then claimed that the Braves weren't bringing in as much revenue as they should have and were "losing" money in this area. Smart people can make numbers say just about anything you want them to when they are done with all the manipulations. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 3 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said: Until any team allows an independent accountant to examine their books this is all speculation but Manfred has said MLB is now at least a 10 Billion dollar a year business. There are more revenue streams both domestically and internationally for MLB than ever before. And in the Sox case it is not just revenue from merchandise, parking, concessions and advertising it is the very team-friendly deal they have on the stadium with the ISSA. Why would a privately owned business need an independent accountant to examine and disclose their books? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan18 Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 (edited) 2 hours ago, TaylorStSox said: Why would a privately owned business need an independent accountant to examine and disclose their books? Well, the 30 clubs share 48% of all locally driven revenue. Meaning there's incentive for teams to hide what they're making to keep it all, rather than 52%. Edited July 20 by soxfan18 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 1 minute ago, soxfan18 said: Well, the 30 clubs share 48% of all locally driven. Meaning there's incentive for teams to hide what they're making to keep it all, rather than 52%. That also was brought up in The Lords of the Realm. Owners are so dishonest they'll even attempt to screw each other over after supposedly agreeing on something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 2 hours ago, TaylorStSox said: Why would a privately owned business need an independent accountant to examine and disclose their books? If for no other reason to give credence when they claim they are "losing" money which most fans on the surface simply do not believe. But you don't have to worry, after the Stanford economist destroyed that claim in 94-95, owners vowed they'd never do it again. The Braves are the only exception because they are a publicly owned company and have to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 14 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said: If for no other reason to give credence when they claim they are "losing" money which most fans on the surface simply do not believe. But you don't have to worry, after the Stanford economist destroyed that claim in 94-95, owners vowed they'd never do it again. The Braves are the only exception because they are a publicly owned company and have to do so. If the data doesn't fit your hypothesis, change the data. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 21 minutes ago, ptatc said: If the data doesn't fit your hypothesis, change the data. The other reason the owners agreed to do it back in 94-95 was to try to move negotiations forward towards a settlement on their terms. Needless to say the result they got wasn't what they wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 18 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said: The other reason the owners agreed to do it back in 94-95 was to try to move negotiations forward towards a settlement on their terms. Needless to say the result they got wasn't what they wanted. It works both ways. Either extreme is just tailoring it to their own narratives. Lile most other things the truth is somewhere in the middle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 4 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said: If for no other reason to give credence when they claim they are "losing" money which most fans on the surface simply do not believe. But you don't have to worry, after the Stanford economist destroyed that claim in 94-95, owners vowed they'd never do it again. The Braves are the only exception because they are a publicly owned company and have to do so. No private business is obligated to disclose their books to the public. That's silly. Being a White Sox fan is voluntary. Also, as you know, being an obsessed and scorned White Sox hater is voluntary and doesn't make you privy to their books. It's incredibly weird to even bring it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted July 20 Share Posted July 20 13 hours ago, Falstaff said: The Sox were 29th in 2023 revenue !?, holy cow. I had no clue they were that far down the list. A new owner will move the club out of Chicago in a heartbeat. We're all moving to cul de sacs in Nashville suburbs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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