WhiteSox2023 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Timmy U said: MLB had both guys listed as 50 ovr prospects in the Dodgers system. Now in the Sox system, they’re both listed as 45. They were adjusted for the impact of the Sox farm system. ? Edited July 30 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalChiSox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 If the reliever market is that seller friendly, they should be able to get some good pieces for Banks and Brebbia tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 Vargas highlight reels look good by the way. Since Pham is just another guy and Kopech nothing special, and Fedde a nice reclamation project gone good (could go bad any time) that trade might be OK. Vargas might be what Moncada wanted to be. He's young and looks good in a uniform. Getz called him one of the brightest young bats in the game. This trade might be OK cause those guys the Sox gave up were nothing to lose sleep over. Sox are due to have a prospect excel. Maybe Vargas will be the answer in the corner outfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 33 minutes ago, greg775 said: Vargas highlight reels look good by the way. Since Pham is just another guy and Kopech nothing special, and Fedde a nice reclamation project gone good (could go bad any time) that trade might be OK. Vargas might be what Moncada wanted to be. He's young and looks good in a uniform. Getz called him one of the brightest young bats in the game. This trade might be OK cause those guys the Sox gave up were nothing to lose sleep over. Sox are due to have a prospect excel. Maybe Vargas will be the answer in the corner outfield. Collins was once called a 1-1 caliber pick by Hostetler 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 9 hours ago, ptatc said: Yeah, how do the cardinals give up only edman and get fedde and pham? I'm not sure edman will ever play much with his weird wrist injury. The cardinals killed it here. Because our awful GM didn’t demand anything from the Cardinals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 4 hours ago, SoCalChiSox said: If the reliever market is that seller friendly, they should be able to get some good pieces for Banks and Brebbia tomorrow. LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolle Tide Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 4 hours ago, SoCalChiSox said: If the reliever market is that seller friendly, they should be able to get some good pieces for Banks and Brebbia tomorrow. I’m still hoping the Orioles offer something decent for Brebbia. Is Corchet definitely staying put? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 6 hours ago, 46DidIt said: I just want to point out I predicted Kopech as a member of the Dodgers’ rotation by 2026 on a couple occasions a few months ago. Not sure how to search the forum in order to prove it, but I hope it is duly noted nonetheless I still believe you will be wrong on that but noted 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 40 minutes ago, Rolle Tide said: I’m still hoping the Orioles offer something decent for Brebbia. Is Corchet definitely staying put? We can definitely worked a trade for both of them. Mayo, Norby, Beavers, and a pitcher. Deal done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 7 hours ago, SoxBlanco said: I doubt we get Perez without Kopech in the trade, so we didn’t get nothing. OK, then we got ripped off on the Fedde/Pham side of the deal. If the reports are right that Getz agreed with Mozeliak that Edman was fair value for Fedde, then the starting point of this trade was incongruent and it’s easy to see how the White Sox got ripped off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: We can definitely worked a trade for both of them. Mayo, Norby, Beavers, and a pitcher. Deal done. Elias says no to dealing Mayo. Has any GM dealt a top position player prospect this trade deadline? Edited July 30 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 9 hours ago, GreenSox said: I wonder if Getz doesn't box himself into a corner by insisting on position prospects. To some extent it goes back to the draft when they had a choice of the 3 position players that they had dreamed of, and passed on all 3. Now, they almost have to take position players, even though the value may be in pitching. I would be more livid if we kept trading for pitching prospects just because they were more available. Hitting is expensive as hell right now, but look how much easier it is to compete with all world hitting (orioles) than all world pitching (mariners). Pitching can be found so much cheaper, I don’t think that means hoarding. Moneyball or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 (edited) 29 minutes ago, bmags said: I would be more livid if we kept trading for pitching prospects just because they were more available. Hitting is expensive as hell right now, but look how much easier it is to compete with all world hitting (orioles) than all world pitching (mariners). Pitching can be found so much cheaper, I don’t think that means hoarding. Moneyball or not. Kind of a unfair comp since Baltimore is top six in both pitching and hitting WAR. The Mariners are 22nd in offensive WAR and 2nd in pitching. Mets on the other hand are 4th in offense and 29th in pitching. Edited July 30 by Look at Ray Ray Run Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 6 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: Kind of a unfair comp since Baltimore is top six in both pitching and hitting WAR. The Mariners are 22nd in offensive WAR and 2nd in pitching. Mets on the other hand are 4th in offense and 29th in pitching. Baltimore built their pitching staff pretty easily. Mariners are going to have a much tougher time. If you guys want to believe it’s easier to move into the top half of the league in hitting than pitching in an offseason, my hats off to you. Enjoy the wonders of timing young pitching prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 8 hours ago, Tnetennba said: In a 30 game sample size. Being better than any current Sox hitter isn't exactly a ringing endorsement either. It’s a 30 game sample, yes. But his minor league sample is quite good. Look, I’m not defending the trade, but Vargas is a much better player than 90% of Sox fans are giving them credit for. Return should have included one of STLs best prospects as well, tho. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 8 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said: MLB.com says that it is a PTBNL OR cash from the Dodgers, so it could just be cash and not a player. Very unlikely. Cash is always just an option in case they don’t want one of the players they agreed to select from. Dodgers didn’t even send anyone making any $; cash doesn’t make any sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleAleSox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 41 minutes ago, bmags said: I would be more livid if we kept trading for pitching prospects just because they were more available. Hitting is expensive as hell right now, but look how much easier it is to compete with all world hitting (orioles) than all world pitching (mariners). Pitching can be found so much cheaper, I don’t think that means hoarding. Moneyball or not. I agree with you. It's an unfortunate situation in this climate that the Sox DESPERATELY need hitting, because it cost far more than pitching currently does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 Vargas’ AAA StatCast figures are fascinating. For a guy known for his hit tool, his xBA is only .250 (vs. an actual BA of .290). This is much lower than most of the top AAA hitters despite K & Whiff rates in line or better than them (must be batted ball related, but that data is not available). However, his 19.9% BB rate helps offset this somewhat low average and pushes him to a xOBP to .413. But his high-end xwOBA isn’t just driven by his elite BB rate. He’s shown pretty good power figures demonstrated by his .276 ISO and .460 xSLG. But what’s super interesting (and maybe not good) is his hard contact rate of 35.3% is well below anyone putting up similar or better power figures and his Barrel rate of 5.8% is also on the low end for hitters in this area. Again, without batted ball data it’s hard to put the whole puzzle together, but at least his average launch angle of 21 degrees should theoretically be resulting in lots of line drives. The big question is how much of this is sustainable in the majors. His Statcast figures in the majors are putrid with poor quality of contact. And this year he has a pull % 16 points above league average which is clearly not sustainable and probably not helping given his profile. He has walked at very nice clips but well below that elite AAA level. If he can bump up the walk rate some and the quality of contact improves to a certain extent (which it should for a guy with a 65 hit tool), he’s going to be an above average hitter. I’m not sure he’s got the power you’re looking for in the middle of the order, but it feels like he could be a really nice top of the lineup table setter who provides a high OBP, pretty good speed, and probably average power. The lack of a position is obviously concerning, but it feels like he should have the tools to play a solid OF corner at some point his speed and arm. I know the OF is fairly new to him, but I would immediately put him in LF and let him get comfortable there (sorry Benintendi but you’re being relegated to worse DH in baseball history). He’s certainly not the sexiest of profiles and I don’t think Getz got all he could for the trio of players traded, but I feel like Vargas can be a nice piece of the puzzle if he can a defensive spot where he can be roughly average. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 48 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Elias says no to dealing Mayo. Has any GM dealt a top position player prospect this trade deadline? Oh they won’t make that trade, just saying I’d hook them up with a legit ace under cheap control if they were willing to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 10 minutes ago, PaleAleSox said: I agree with you. It's an unfortunate situation in this climate that the Sox DESPERATELY need hitting, because it cost far more than pitching currently does. It’s true but also if they can’t generate any hitting internally the ability to trade for it is fools gold anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 10 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Very unlikely. Cash is always just an option in case they don’t want one of the players they agreed to select from. Dodgers didn’t even send anyone making any $; cash doesn’t make any sense. Yeah, the issue is we overpaid for Edman. I think turning Edman, Kopech, and Gonzalez (if you assume he was for Pham) into the three pieces we got from the Dodgers is mostly fine. But Fedde for Edman straight up feels like a very large miss and certainty a solid prospect short. I have come to terms overnight that this is both a bad deal for the Sox and one that could work out fine in the end. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Yeah, the issue is we overpaid for Edman. I think turning Edman, Kopech, and Gonzalez (if you assume he was for Pham) into the three pieces we got from the Dodgers is mostly fine. But Fedde for Edman straight up feels like a very large miss and certainty a solid prospect short. I have come to terms overnight that this is both a bad deal for the Sox and one that could work out fine in the end. I think my reaction was mostly guided by feeling like I “saw the future” a few days ago (all the top prospects people were amazed by being traded a few days ago were all pitching driven, sellers were being more disciplined in settling for alternative options) and already coming to terms with it. Im just much more frustrated with the failure to turnover our hitting instruction meaningfully, our poor record in finding talent on the margins, and the attachment to veterans for zero reason in a lost year than these trades. I thought we had good timing in being sellers this year, but I don’t think we did. It also doesn’t matter until this s%*# org can take player development and international seriously. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 So St Louis and the White Sox agree that Edman and Fedde match up so Getz goes out gets the Dodgers to pick up Edman's contract from St Louis and finds some prospects he likes with the Dodgers. Then St Louis says give us Pham as well....Getz says OK and then St Louis says give us some cash as well and Getz says OK. At that point I think St Louis just felt bad for Getz and ending asking for things. The Dodgers took a flyer on Edman and Kopech for those three guys. They have the luxury of doing that. If they thought highly of Vargas at all they would not have looked at Edman and then Rosario. I guess they did miss on the guy they traded to the cubs so who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleAleSox Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 8 minutes ago, bmags said: It’s true but also if they can’t generate any hitting internally the ability to trade for it is fools gold anyway. Well, I'll hold out hope they can actually start developing some hitters at some point because what else do I have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted July 30 Share Posted July 30 My thought is Pham was given to the Cardinals for “free” since he didn’t have much interest, so the Sox sent him to a team he wanted to go to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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