Robert

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, oldsox said:

What did Law say?

Lewis Brinson

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

22 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Alex Rios and Leury say sure what’s the worst that could possibly happen?

Greg is still traumatized by Rios.

And Rios was a 2 time all star when the Sox acquired him. He was coming off a 4 WAR season the season before the Sox traded him to the Rangers. The Sox will be very lucky if Robert produces a 4 WAR season in 2025 or 2026.

[Lip Man 1]

13 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

And Rios was a 2 time all star when the Sox acquired him. He was coming off a 4 WAR season the season before the Sox traded him to the Rangers. The Sox will be very lucky if Robert produces a 4 WAR season in 2025 or 2026.

August 10, 2009 - In an aggressive move the White Sox claimed two-time All-Star Alex Ríos off of waivers from the Toronto Blue Jays. Rios was hitting .264 at the time, with 14 home runs, 62 RBIs but was also due $58.6 million through 2015. Rios’ tenure with the White Sox was a mixed bag, playing poorly after being claimed in 2009, and in the ballyhooed 2011 “All-In” season but flashing the talent that got him claimed by G.M. Ken Williams in the first place in 2010 (3.3 WAR) and 2012 (4.8 WAR). Rios was off to a so-so start in 2013 before the White Sox dealt him to Texas for Leury García. The deal off-loaded more than $20 million the White Sox were on the hook for, but overall, doling Rios out $37.2 million to produce 7.0 WAR in his career on the South Side was a significant overpay.

[poppysox]

3 hours ago, WookiesOnRitalin said:

Most players do not play for the sake of the game anymore. Those days seem to be gone or those players seem to be gone. 

Luis has very little love for the game and is at a point where he clearly does not care. He went from being poor to being rich with the swing of a bat. It's too bad since he really does have that much talent. 

I'll take the Rowands and Konerkos every day over the Roberts of the world. 

These gigantic salaries are killing the motivation to work hard.  Robert and Moncada are very rich men while having limited success.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

25 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

August 10, 2009 - In an aggressive move the White Sox claimed two-time All-Star Alex Ríos off of waivers from the Toronto Blue Jays. Rios was hitting .264 at the time, with 14 home runs, 62 RBIs but was also due $58.6 million through 2015. Rios’ tenure with the White Sox was a mixed bag, playing poorly after being claimed in 2009, and in the ballyhooed 2011 “All-In” season but flashing the talent that got him claimed by G.M. Ken Williams in the first place in 2010 (3.3 WAR) and 2012 (4.8 WAR). Rios was off to a so-so start in 2013 before the White Sox dealt him to Texas for Leury García. The deal off-loaded more than $20 million the White Sox were on the hook for, but overall, doling Rios out $37.2 million to produce 7.0 WAR in his career on the South Side was a significant overpay.

If the Sox pick up both options, they owe Robert $55M between 2025-2027. I’d set the over/under at 7 WAR for those 3 seasons combined and certainly wouldn’t be surprised to see him come under. If Rios was a significant overpay at $37.2M (probably roughly equivalent to $55M in today’s dollars) to produce 7 WAR what is Robert’s value if he doesn’t at least produce 7 WAR over the next 3 seasons? 

Edited August 12 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[TheFutureIsNear]

Robert has been in the league for way too long to still have no idea what a good at bat is. Even in what was considered a good season for him last year he still had a .315 OBP. That’s not a good way to have sustainable success.

My guess is that Robert is the type of guy that has gotten by on pure talent/being bigger, faster, stronger his entire life and now that he has to adjust, make changes, and even study it’s just not happening. Hopefully this is a wake up call for him, but I also think a mentor would sure help. Unfortunately I’m not sure that person exists within the Sox organization.

[southsider2k5]

 

[baseball_gal_aly]

And ppl called me crazy for saying his options might not be picked up. 

Edited August 12 by baseball_gal_aly

[DFAthewave69420]

Luis Robert has to come into 2025 with a chip on his shoulder.  What a dissapointment of a season. 

 

If he doesn't want to play the last couple months, let someone play who does and Phantom IL him.

[Tony]

3 hours ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

Robert has been in the league for way too long to still have no idea what a good at bat is. Even in what was considered a good season for him last year he still had a .315 OBP. That’s not a good way to have sustainable success.

My guess is that Robert is the type of guy that has gotten by on pure talent/being bigger, faster, stronger his entire life and now that he has to adjust, make changes, and even study it’s just not happening. Hopefully this is a wake up call for him, but I also think a mentor would sure help. Unfortunately I’m not sure that person exists within the Sox organization.

While I am a big advocate of personal responsibility (just in life in general) we've seen too many instances, for far too many years, to think this is just a player problem. How many guys leave here and find new life with different teams? Be it motivation, better lineup protection, better usage, better coaching staff, better analytics staff...If Robert was on a better team, my guess is he becomes a much better player. I've also always contended if Andrew Vaughn was drafted by say, the Brewers, his MLB career would have been much different than it is today. 

[DoUEvenShift]

Robert riding pine today

[southsider2k5]

24 minutes ago, Tony said:

While I am a big advocate of personal responsibility (just in life in general) we've seen too many instances, for far too many years, to think this is just a player problem. How many guys leave here and find new life with different teams? Be it motivation, better lineup protection, better usage, better coaching staff, better analytics staff...If Robert was on a better team, my guess is he becomes a much better player. I've also always contended if Andrew Vaughn was drafted by say, the Brewers, his MLB career would have been much different than it is today. 

He looks like a mental trainwreck

[greg775]

5 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Alex Rios and Leury say sure what’s the worst that could possibly happen?

Greg is still traumatized by Rios.

Man. Alex Rios looks like Babe Ruth compared to our current players. If I knew how bad it was going to get I never could have been that hard on Rios. Sox have reached the stage it's hard to remember when the team had any good MLB players. I must have been down on Rios for what he did in 09. His stats were not that bad the other years. These current Sox trash teams have made me forget why I hated certain players in the past who look like all time Sox greats now.

[2Deep]

Man...... I miss the days of being mad about a guy hitting .265

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

Man. Alex Rios looks like Babe Ruth compared to our current players. If I knew how bad it was going to get I never could have been that hard on Rios. Sox have reached the stage it's hard to remember when the team had any good MLB players. I must have been down on Rios for what he did in 09. His stats were not that bad the other years. These current Sox trash teams have made me forget why I hated certain players in the past who look like all time Sox greats now.

Things came so easily to him physically he usually looked like he was loafing…he just glided around CF on defense.

And his attitude was quite similar to Moncada’s.  Very passive or seemingly indifferent.  The anti-Paul O’Neill.

[southsider2k5]

 

[caulfield12]

https://www.thescore.com/news/3053978
 

Embarrassing for the organization. Sigh. We can’t even find ONE 700 hitter, let alone 805 career with GG caliber defense.

Where were the hitting coaches and Grifol all season long?

Jason Benetti would have brought this situation to someone on the coaching staff even. Or Darrin Jackson.

 

And just consider all the rostered OPS numbers lower than Robert’s in the mid 600s.

Edited August 14 by caulfield12

[southsider2k5]

2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.thescore.com/news/3053978
 

Embarrassing for the organization. Sigh. We can’t even find ONE 700 hitter, let alone 805 career with GG caliber defense.

Where were the hitting coaches and Grifol all season long?

Jason Benetti would have brought this situation to someone on the coaching staff even. Or Darrin Jackson.

 

And just consider all the rostered OPS numbers lower than Robert’s in the mid 600s.

Jason Benetti would have fixed Luis Robert.

Huh.

I have literally no idea how to process this information. 

[caulfield12]

15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Jason Benetti would have fixed Luis Robert.

Huh.

I have literally no idea how to process this information. 

 

15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Jason Benetti would have fixed Luis Robert.

Huh.

I have literally no idea how to process this information. 

Nowhere did i write THAT.  Twisting words again.

I said he would have slowly noticed something was obviously quite wrong by his body language and run it up the chain.

Remember Montoyo had no memorable interaction with Robert. Abreu and Grandal are long gone.  Moncada might as well be on Mars at this point. Robert and Vargas both seem completely lost/isolated. That much is pretty clear.

This is almost Zach Greinke land.

Hahn Grifol and Getz all don’t seem like they are very hands on types like a Joe Maddon or Ron Washington and have their fingers on the pulse of the org.

The hitting coaches have never come close to reaching Bannister/Katz levels of credibility.

 

Clearly the guy was struggling and everyone just left him alone.  Benetti at least has a high enough EQ to notice that and bring it to the attention of the sports psychologist or someone like Mike Gellinger.

Heck, I worked in minor league baseball and spent one month with Jose Guillen driving him around everywhere and looking after him after a quite serious knife drawing incident incident in Bradenton…because I spoke Spanish.  My friend had to similarly babysit Sean Kemp with the Sonics, just basically keep him out of trouble.

At any rate, I would still give Benetti a better shot at fixing Robert than Hahn or Getz.

 

Edited August 14 by caulfield12

[southsider2k5]

3 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

 

Nowhere did i write THAT.  Twisting words again.

I said he would have slowly noticed something was obviously quite wrong by his body language and run it up the chain.

Remember Montoyo had no memorable interaction with Robert. Abreu and Grandal are long gone.  Moncada might as well be on Mars at this point. Robert and Vargas both seem completely lost/isolated. That much is pretty clear.

This is almost Zach Greinke land.

Hahn Grifol and Getz all don’t seem like they are very hands on types like a Joe Maddon or Ron Washington and have their fingers on the pulse of the org.

The hitting coaches have never come close to reaching Bannister/Katz levels of credibility.

 

Clearly the guy was struggling and everyone just left him alone.  Benetti at least has a high enough EQ to notice that and bring it to the attention of the sports psychologist or someone like Mike Gellinger.

Heck, I worked in minor league baseball and spent one month with Jose Guillen driving him around everywhere and looking after him after a quite serious knife drawing incident incident in Bradenton…because I spoke Spanish.  My friend had to similarly babysit Sean Kemp with the Sonics, just basically keep him out of trouble.

At any rate, I would still give Benetti a better shot at fixing Robert than Hahn or Getz.

 

Again, I have no idea how to process what you are saying. I have no idea what Jason was going to do that everyone else has not, or what everyone listed has to do with it.

[caulfield12]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Again, I have no idea how to process what you are saying. I have no idea what Jason was going to do that everyone else has not, or what everyone listed has to do with it.

How do you know they’ve done a single thing?  We are all making assumptions now until how the situation reached this point is clarified.

Schiffren is too consumed by his own personal grudges and media wars to not be totally oblivious at this point.

At least Benetti had the best interests of the organization and players at heart.

 

And I wouldn't be shocked at all if Frank Thomas or Guillen said something before an actual member of the paid organization.

Edited August 14 by caulfield12

[fathom]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Again, I have no idea how to process what you are saying. I have no idea what Jason was going to do that everyone else has not, or what everyone listed has to do with it.

Especially when he probably has the least amount of baseball experience of any announcer 

[Jerksticks]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Again, I have no idea how to process what you are saying. I have no idea what Jason was going to do that everyone else has not, or what everyone listed has to do with it.

 

12 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

 

Nowhere did i write THAT.  Twisting words again.

I said he would have slowly noticed something was obviously quite wrong by his body language and run it up the chain.

Remember Montoyo had no memorable interaction with Robert. Abreu and Grandal are long gone.  Moncada might as well be on Mars at this point. Robert and Vargas both seem completely lost/isolated. That much is pretty clear.

This is almost Zach Greinke land.

Hahn Grifol and Getz all don’t seem like they are very hands on types like a Joe Maddon or Ron Washington and have their fingers on the pulse of the org.

The hitting coaches have never come close to reaching Bannister/Katz levels of credibility.

 

Clearly the guy was struggling and everyone just left him alone.  Benetti at least has a high enough EQ to notice that and bring it to the attention of the sports psychologist or someone like Mike Gellinger.

Heck, I worked in minor league baseball and spent one month with Jose Guillen driving him around everywhere and looking after him after a quite serious knife drawing incident incident in Bradenton…because I spoke Spanish.  My friend had to similarly babysit Sean Kemp with the Sonics, just basically keep him out of trouble.

At any rate, I would still give Benetti a better shot at fixing Robert than Hahn or Getz.

 

This is one of your best and should be worked into the Soxtalk constitution somewhere

[southsider2k5]

13 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

How do you know they’ve done a single thing?  We are all making assumptions now until how the situation reached this point is clarified.

Schiffren is too consumed by his own personal grudges and media wars to not be totally oblivious at this point.

At least Benetti had the best interests of the organization and players at heart.

 

And I wouldn't be shocked at all if Frank Thomas or Guillen said something before an actual member of the paid organization.

Why do you assume literally no one has tried to help the teams biggest star?  At the very least people's jobs are at stake, which Pedro and others learned the hard way if they didn't before. I mean there is making assumptions based on common sense, and there is making assumptions based on... well I am not sure what to be fully honest.  

[caulfield12]

35 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Why do you assume literally no one has tried to help the teams biggest star?  At the very least people's jobs are at stake, which Pedro and others learned the hard way if they didn't before. I mean there is making assumptions based on common sense, and there is making assumptions based on... well I am not sure what to be fully honest.  

Because they completely fucked up the Crochet situation to the point where he or his agent felt no choice was left but to leak to the media…do we really believe anyone would consciously choose to be stuck on the worst team in MLB history if they felt negotiations hadn’t reached an impasse??

Edited August 15 by caulfield12