caulfield12 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 12 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Plenty of guys had control who they dealt. And Chisholm the most expensive. And now hurt, yet again. Likely out for most of the remainder of the regular season. Bell successfully dumped hitting worse than Vaughn and much more expensive to replace Christian Walker. Youngish underachieving outfielders, etc. with tons more potential than anyone on Sox roster. Tanner Scott, for example, FA to be. Edited August 14 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 20 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Plenty of guys had control who they dealt. I only see three players that the Marlins traded that fit what you are saying — De La Cruz, who is just a mediocre fourth outfielder, and Brazoban and Hoeing. It looks like they sold high on Brazoban and Hoeing due to their first half performances and the fact that relievers had a ton of value this trade deadline. Marlins Trade Subtractions: CL Tanner Scott — Impending FA: $5.4M this year CF/2B Jazz Chisholm Jr. — 2 more years of control; $2.63M this year 1B/DH Josh Bell — Impending FA; $16.5M this year OF Bryan De La Cruz — 3 more years of control; $768K this year LHP Trevor Rogers — 2 more years of control; $1.53M this year LHP A.J. Puk — 2 more years of control; $1.8M this year RHP Huascar Brazoban — 4 more years of control; $753K this year RHP JT Chargois — 1 more year of control; $1.29M this year RHP Bryan Hoeing — 4 more years of control; $751K this year Edited August 14 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 3 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I only see three players that the Marlins traded that fit what you are saying — De La Cruz, who is a mediocre to bad outfielder and Brazoban and Hoeing. And it looks like they sold high on Brazoban and Hoeing due to their first half performances and the fact that relievers had a ton of value this trade deadline. Marlins Trade Subtractions: CL Tanner Scott — Impending FA: $5.4M this year CF/2B Jazz Chisholm Jr. — 2 more years of control; $2.63M this year 1B/DH Josh Bell — Impending FA; $16.5M this year OF Bryan De La Cruz — 3 more years of control; $768K this year LHP Trevor Rogers — 2 more years of control; $1.53M this year LHP A.J. Puk — 2 more years of control; $1.8M this year RHP Huascar Brazoban — 4 more years of control; $753K this year RHP JT Chargois — 1 more year of control; $1.29M this year RHP Bryan Hoeing — 4 more years of control; $751K this year Thanks for proving my point, they traded guys with long control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 7 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Thanks for proving my point, they traded guys with long control. Only 3 of the 9 players the Marlins traded seem to fit what you said and I think they chose those 3 guys for a reason. A fourth outfielder that they won’t miss because he’s not good, along with two relievers that they sold high on, knowing that relievers had a ton of value for this year’s trade deadline, yet are fickle performers from year to year. Those guys aren’t exactly the same as an .800 OPS, 35 HR power hitter earning peanuts for the next 4 years. That kind of power is tough to come by for a low payroll team like the Marlins. They obviously can’t easily afford to sign a player with that type of power on the free agent market. Edited August 14 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 3 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: Only 3 of the 9 players the Marlins traded seem to fit what you said and I think they chose those 3 guys for a reason. A fourth outfielder that they won’t miss because he’s not good, along with two relievers that they sold high on, knowing that relievers had a ton of value for this year’s trade deadline, yet are fickle performers from year to year. Those guys aren’t exactly the same as an .800 OPS, 35 HR power hitter earning peanuts for the next 4 years. That kind of power is tough to come by for a low payroll team like the Marlins. They obviously can’t easily afford to sign a player with that type of power on the free agent market. Except Jake Burger wasn't even that guy two weeks ago, which is why no one wanted him then. He had a .680 OPS at that point in time. 10 of his homers also came after that point. He was rolling out the huge .233/.281/.399/.680 with 13 homers, or remarkably close to Andrew Vaughn, who also didn't great traded. Also when absolutely no one cared about Jake Burger. Trust me, if someone thought he was decent, Houston was begging for a real 1B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Except Jake Burger wasn't even that guy two weeks ago, which is why no one wanted him then. He had a .680 OPS at that point in time. 10 of his homers also came after that point. He was rolling out the huge .233/.281/.399/.680 with 13 homers, or remarkably close to Andrew Vaughn, who also didn't great traded. Also when absolutely no one cared about Jake Burger. Trust me, if someone thought he was decent, Houston was begging for a real 1B. Yep, great point. I think they keep Burger now because he turned it around. But like the Marlins and Rays always have to do, I sure wouldn’t be surprised to see them deal him within the next two years. They will try to sell high on him with 2+ years of control left. Edited August 14 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry McNertney Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 Burger wasn't traded to the Marlins, he was donated. Eder? Come on. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 2 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I don’t know about this. Power is expensive and the Marlins still have 4 more years of control over Burger. He hasn’t gotten expensive yet (only cost them $740K this year). I’m sure, just like the Rays, the Marlins will be trading Burger once his arbitration years get expensive but he’s not quite there yet. Which do you think is more likely; the Marlins chose to not make Burger available as he is a piece they want to build around OR his atrocious performance to date coupled with his age, streakiness, injury history and positional flexibility netted little interest? I think the safe assumption is the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 2 minutes ago, T R U said: Which do you think is more likely; the Marlins chose to not make Burger available as he is a piece they want to build around OR his atrocious performance to date coupled with his age, streakiness, injury history and positional flexibility netted little interest? I think the safe assumption is the latter. What do you think is more likely, Jake Eder is a contributor for the Chicago White Sox, or Jake Eder has a future with the Chicago Dogs? I think the safe assumption is the latter. It was a bad trade. You are one of the Burger haters, but at least he's been good since the trade. The guy the Sox got for him? Not so much. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 2 hours ago, Quin said: The mistake wasn't trading him, it was how it went down. 1) Hahn was working on a TA to Miami deal. Considering Burger was a last second move to Miami by Kenny, I'm guessing TA for Eder might have been the deal. Note: Pure speculation on my part. 2) Considering Burger was on fire and under a lot of control, they should have gotten more than Eder. 3) Hahn had a wild trade deadline on his way out (Quero, Bush and Lee alone make it a win), but @WhiteSox2023 is right: stop letting dudes about to be fired dictate trades. Here's the problem with the White Sox and what I believe happened. Kenny and Hahn were not going to get fired in season, but after the deadline things got so bad that JR was finally forced to do it now. Pedro and his buddies weren't going to be fired in season either, but then they lose 21 games in a row and again JR is forced to make a decision now instead of waiting. There is no other plausible reason why you would let someone run your trade deadline and then fire them a few weeks later. Same deal with the Vargas thing where apparently someone suggested him and then was promptly fired a few weeks later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 3 minutes ago, T R U said: Here's the problem with the White Sox and what I believe happened. Kenny and Hahn were not going to get fired in season, but after the deadline things got so bad that JR was finally forced to do it now. Pedro and his buddies weren't going to be fired in season either, but then they lose 21 games in a row and again JR is forced to make a decision now instead of waiting. There is no other plausible reason why you would let someone run your trade deadline and then fire them a few weeks later. Same deal with the Vargas thing where apparently someone suggested him and then was promptly fired a few weeks later. They let Hostetler run the draft then re-assigned him. It's the White Sox way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 Just now, Dick Allen said: What do you think is more likely, Jake Eder is a contributor for the Chicago White Sox, or Jake Eder has a future with the Chicago Dogs? I think the safe assumption is the latter. It was a bad trade. You are one of the Burger haters, but at least he's been good since the trade. The guy the Sox got for him? Not so much. The trade looks like a bust so far for the Sox. Im not trying to argue the trade was good. Trading Burger, was absolutely the right move. Last time I checked, the Marlins were 30 games under .500 I don't think they're running a victory lap about this trade either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 3 minutes ago, T R U said: The trade looks like a bust so far for the Sox. Im not trying to argue the trade was good. Trading Burger, was absolutely the right move. Last time I checked, the Marlins were 30 games under .500 I don't think they're running a victory lap about this trade either. If you want to argue the right move, that was probably to get rid of Vaughn and put Burger at 1B. Burger would have played better defense at 1B than Vaughn and certainly would have hit for more power. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 1 hour ago, T R U said: The trade looks like a bust so far for the Sox. Im not trying to argue the trade was good. Trading Burger, was absolutely the right move. Last time I checked, the Marlins were 30 games under .500 I don't think they're running a victory lap about this trade either. This again. And it has also been like weeks of the good Jake Burger. He was a White Sox level bat up until about the trade deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 8 hours ago, hogan873 said: How many threads do we need crying about the Burger trade? All we can do as Sox fans is point out the organization's blunders. We're left with that. They gave us this embarrassing record and management has not yet apologized. "Crying?" That's hilarious. I don't forgive this organization for becoming the laughingstock of all sports teams. So we should cry some more about Burger and Jerry and the rest of these sports laughingstocks. Can you believe the Sox have not formally apologized for what is here and to come the next several seasons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 1 hour ago, wegner said: If you want to argue the right move, that was probably to get rid of Vaughn and put Burger at 1B. Burger would have played better defense at 1B than Vaughn and certainly would have hit for more power. Remember the days people actually complained about Abreu's defense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 1 hour ago, wegner said: If you want to argue the right move, that was probably to get rid of Vaughn and put Burger at 1B. Burger would have played better defense at 1B than Vaughn and certainly would have hit for more power. This is where I'm at. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 9 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: This again. And it has also been like weeks of the good Jake Burger. He was a White Sox level bat up until about the trade deadline. I think someone may have mentioned it already, but Burger was dealing with a nagging strained left oblique injury since April 15th that was probably the main cause for his slumping bat. https://www.mlb.com/news/jake-burger-has-left-oblique-injury Edited August 14 by WhiteSox2023 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 1 minute ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I think someone may have mentioned it already, but Burger was dealing with a nagging left oblique injury since April 15th that was probably the main cause for his slumping bat. https://www.mlb.com/news/jake-burger-has-left-oblique-injury Does that excuse work for Eloy and Robert who have been playing after coming back early from injuires? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Does that excuse work for Eloy and Robert who have been playing after coming back early from injuires? All three of them are always playing after coming back from (early) injuries. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Does that excuse work for Eloy and Robert who have been playing after coming back early from injuires? The problem is that Eloy and Moncada continue to get reinjured. Moncada is still out. Eloy came back but hasn’t put up numbers as good as Burger’s since 2022. He also hasn’t hit a home run since May 14th — either an issue with his groundball swing or nagging injuries? Not sure, but the Sox did bring him back too early and you could tell he was still hobbled by his hammy. Edited August 14 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 1 minute ago, WhiteSox2023 said: The problem is that Eloy and Moncada continue to get reinjured. Moncada is still out. Eloy came back but hasn’t put up numbers as good as Burger’s since 2022. He also hasn’t hit a home run since May 14th — either an issue with his groundball swing or nagging injuries? Not sure, but the Sox did bring him back too early and you could tell he was still hobbled by his hammy. Because Jake Burger has no injury history? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 Just now, southsider2k5 said: Because Jake Burger has no injury history? No, he does. However, he still ends up outperforming Eloy and Moncada with his bat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 22 minutes ago, greg775 said: Remember the days people actually complained about Abreu's defense? Who? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 14 Share Posted August 14 7 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: No, he does. However, he still ends up outperforming Eloy and Moncada with his bat. Today he does. The other three months of the year, he has been just as bad, if not worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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