Managerial “Search”

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 10/14/2024 at 12:30 PM, southsider2k5 said:

Which tells me that I shouldn't take ANYTHING they say seriously, including doing this rebuild fully and correctly, because their recent history tells me they will 100% lie to the general public to sell a few more ticket, and they will absolutely cut corners, incest hire, and not do everything they need to do to win in 2025 and beyond as long as Jerry and his hand picked stooge are running the show.

Now you get it. Were you actually so naive before this or just pretending to be righteously indignant ? If JR actually fired Getz it'll be for one reason, he's not doing what JR wants. Getz might actually think he can get the Sox out of the Stoneage and make massive firings and hirings in domestic and international scouting and development and analytics and be blocked by JR every step of the way and we would never know. Getz could be trying to juggle what little budget he's allowed and not put it into the team which might lead to terrible records while putting the money into infrastructure in a a way no other Sox GM has before.

While Getz may not be qualified or may have been hired to be a stooge , rest assured if he's fired by JR it's because he's doing fundamental things that JR has never believed in doing. But you'll be happy because the GM who gave you the record breaking bad season is gone and the next guy may just say hey JRs got other things to do more important than the Sox so we're going to suck for a while . Please buy season tickets. Thank you for your patience. I'll do my best to turn the garbage I'm allowed to spend on into gold . Hey JR can't live forever right ? Shh don't tell anyone I said that !

[Falstaff]

After hearing other possible candidates, my choices are:

#1 - Skip

#2 - Grady

I am optimistic for 2025 to see the pitching staff improvements and what position players take the next step.

[JoeC]

The 2025 staff shouldn't be focused on wins and losses so much as an extension of player development.

I'm still a firm believer that, when TLR came on board, all player discipline went out the window with regards to professional mentality. The clubhouse was basically turned over to the players, and their natural laziness and personalities took over.

The team needed Ricky, or someone similar, for one more year to teach the young kids what it actually means to be a big leaguer. It seems like the previous core didn't have that.

[southsider2k5]

3 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Now you get it. Were you actually so naive before this or just pretending to be righteously indignant ? If JR actually fired Getz it'll be for one reason, he's not doing what JR wants. Getz might actually think he can get the Sox out of the Stoneage and make massive firings and hirings in domestic and international scouting and development and analytics and be blocked by JR every step of the way and we would never know. Getz could be trying to juggle what little budget he's allowed and not put it into the team which might lead to terrible records while putting the money into infrastructure in a a way no other Sox GM has before.

While Getz may not be qualified or may have been hired to be a stooge , rest assured if he's fired by JR it's because he's doing fundamental things that JR has never believed in doing. But you'll be happy because the GM who gave you the record breaking bad season is gone and the next guy may just say hey JRs got other things to do more important than the Sox so we're going to suck for a while . Please buy season tickets. Thank you for your patience. I'll do my best to turn the garbage I'm allowed to spend on into gold . Hey JR can't live forever right ? Shh don't tell anyone I said that !

hahahahaha

[Y2Jimmy0]

With the break in the schedule, I'm expecting the White Sox to hire a manager this week. I'd be fine with any of Will Venable, Donnie Ecker, George Lombard or Clayton McCullough. 

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, JoeC said:

The 2025 staff shouldn't be focused on wins and losses so much as an extension of player development.

I'm still a firm believer that, when TLR came on board, all player discipline went out the window with regards to professional mentality. The clubhouse was basically turned over to the players, and their natural laziness and personalities took over.

The team needed Ricky, or someone similar, for one more year to teach the young kids what it actually means to be a big leaguer. It seems like the previous core didn't have that.

While Ricky would have been better, he had some of the flaws that doomed TLR. In Rickys case, he was obsessed with the way things used to be and angered by the notion that the game had changed. Famously, in like 2019, he was asked a standard, boilerplate, article preparing question of "how do you use analytics in your managing" and he responded with the detailed, dignified answer "F*** you". That tells a lot about the professionalism of his whole staff, too.

Just like TLR was obsessed with having guys bunt, steal bases, defensive positioning is a sin, guys should play through injuries, be aggressive at the plate as walks clog up bases, starting pitchers should go 8 innings in the playoffs, hit the ball on the ground all the time, Ricky had the same problems with that.

I think you're right that the personality implosion wouldn't have happened, at least not in the same way. But Ricky, like Grifol and Ventura both, as well as Chris Getz and Jerry Reinsdorf, were obsessed with David Ecksteins, white guys who play the game the right way way" and that left them completely outmatched against managers who understood that the game isn't even the same as it was 5 years ago.

[JoeC]

12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

While Ricky would have been better, he had some of the flaws that doomed TLR. In Rickys case, he was obsessed with the way things used to be and angered by the notion that the game had changed. Famously, in like 2019, he was asked a standard, boilerplate, article preparing question of "how do you use analytics in your managing" and he responded with the detailed, dignified answer "F*** you". That tells a lot about the professionalism of his whole staff, too.

Just like TLR was obsessed with having guys bunt, steal bases, defensive positioning is a sin, guys should play through injuries, be aggressive at the plate as walks clog up bases, starting pitchers should go 8 innings in the playoffs, hit the ball on the ground all the time, Ricky had the same problems with that.

I think you're right that the personality implosion wouldn't have happened, at least not in the same way. But Ricky, like Grifol and Ventura both, as well as Chris Getz and Jerry Reinsdorf, were obsessed with David Ecksteins, white guys who play the game the right way way" and that left them completely outmatched against managers who understood that the game isn't even the same as it was 5 years ago.

Yeah, Ricky definitely had his flaws, but I'm of the opinion that the team in 2022 (and 2023) would have been in much better shape had Ricky been in charge in 2021 rather than TLR.

[Balta1701]

9 minutes ago, JoeC said:

Yeah, Ricky definitely had his flaws, but I'm of the opinion that the team in 2022 (and 2023) would have been in much better shape had Ricky been in charge in 2021 rather than TLR.

I think you'd have seen continued regression from the pitchers and the hitters both, much like we saw. However, I think the clear personality conflicts would have been minimized because Ricky wouldn't put up with that stuff while LaRussa didn't care.

That 8 game losing streak in April 2022, where it started off with a game that looked like the entire infield forgot how to play baseball? Clearly Anderson and others were distracted and it stayed that way for weeks? Yeah that's a LaRussa special.

[southsider2k5]

I will be honest, I don't know that I can bring myself to really care enough to be upset/excited about who we hire here.  I think the one thing I am looking for is maybe a sign that Getz is free of his octogenarian overlords.  If he bring in Skip Shumaker, it tells me that Tony is probably the guy running the show to some extent.

[Bob Sacamano]

10 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I will be honest, I don't know that I can bring myself to really care enough to be upset/excited about who we hire here.  I think the one thing I am looking for is maybe a sign that Getz is free of his octogenarian overlords.  If he bring in Skip Shumaker, it tells me that Tony is probably the guy running the show to some extent.

Yeah, no manager is going to magically make this a good team and a good chunk of the players won't be around in 3+ years anyway.

[southsider2k5]

5 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Yeah, no manager is going to magically make this a good team and a good chunk of the players won't be around in 3+ years anyway.

I don't see a path this hire being around for our next playoff team.  There is going to be so much losing in the near future, I just hope for someone who can develop and keep people healthy.

[Balta1701]

16 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I will be honest, I don't know that I can bring myself to really care enough to be upset/excited about who we hire here.  I think the one thing I am looking for is maybe a sign that Getz is free of his octogenarian overlords.  If he bring in Skip Shumaker, it tells me that Tony is probably the guy running the show to some extent.

I want to hear someone give a correct message. No more talk about the importance of bunting or playing fast and aggressive or fiery or whatever. No more lectures about how baseball was correct 20 years ago and everything is wrong today. Talk about being smart, being well prepared, putting guys in position to succeed. A person who at least sounds like they understand that there is a modern aspect to baseball. 

Add in some actual professionalism. That's one I've been asking about for 10 years or so, actually look prepared and treat things and other people like you're the public representative of a billion dollar business.

[Rey21]

1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

With the break in the schedule, I'm expecting the White Sox to hire a manager this week. I'd be fine with any of Will Venable, Donnie Ecker, George Lombard or Clayton McCullough. 

Skip Schumaker, Donnie Ecker, or Will Venable for me 

[JoeC]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

I think you'd have seen continued regression from the pitchers and the hitters both, much like we saw. However, I think the clear personality conflicts would have been minimized because Ricky wouldn't put up with that stuff while LaRussa didn't care.

That 8 game losing streak in April 2022, where it started off with a game that looked like the entire infield forgot how to play baseball? Clearly Anderson and others were distracted and it stayed that way for weeks? Yeah that's a LaRussa special.

We'll never know, of course, but I'm of the opinion that the regression would have been less severe.

[Tnetennba]

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

I will be honest, I don't know that I can bring myself to really care enough to be upset/excited about who we hire here.  I think the one thing I am looking for is maybe a sign that Getz is free of his octogenarian overlords.  If he bring in Skip Shumaker, it tells me that Tony is probably the guy running the show to some extent.

I don't know which is more frightening, Getz's decision making or JR/TLR meddling in said decisions.

[JoeC]

16 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

I don't know which is more frightening, Getz's decision making or JR/TLR meddling in said decisions.

The one area that Getz seems to be competent is in making personnel hires. I don't have high expectations, but I'm less frightened by the idea that Getz would pick his own guy.

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

While Ricky would have been better, he had some of the flaws that doomed TLR. In Rickys case, he was obsessed with the way things used to be and angered by the notion that the game had changed. Famously, in like 2019, he was asked a standard, boilerplate, article preparing question of "how do you use analytics in your managing" and he responded with the detailed, dignified answer "F*** you". That tells a lot about the professionalism of his whole staff, too.

Just like TLR was obsessed with having guys bunt, steal bases, defensive positioning is a sin, guys should play through injuries, be aggressive at the plate as walks clog up bases, starting pitchers should go 8 innings in the playoffs, hit the ball on the ground all the time, Ricky had the same problems with that.

I think you're right that the personality implosion wouldn't have happened, at least not in the same way. But Ricky, like Grifol and Ventura both, as well as Chris Getz and Jerry Reinsdorf, were obsessed with David Ecksteins, white guys who play the game the right way way" and that left them completely outmatched against managers who understood that the game isn't even the same as it was 5 years ago.

Well, except Edman is the quintessential Eckstein clone...

[The Mighty Mite]

2 hours ago, JoeC said:

Yeah, Ricky definitely had his flaws, but I'm of the opinion that the team in 2022 (and 2023) would have been in much better shape had Ricky been in charge in 2021 rather than TLR.

Ricky never should have been fired, this team went south because of  the hiring of TLR, the worst move in a long list of bad moves by JR, along with players who never really lived up to expectations like Eloy, Moncada and even Robert, then there was Tim Anderson who completely lost his game, they also rushed Vaughn while never filling gaping holes at second base and right field. 

Edited 14 hours ago by The Mighty Mite

[Harold's Leg Lift]

4 hours ago, Tnetennba said:

I don't know which is more frightening, Getz's decision making or JR/TLR meddling in said decisions.

LaRussa is part of the interview team so......

[Tnetennba]

12 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

LaRussa is part of the interview team so......

Welp, we're boned.

[Boopa1219]

22 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

LaRussa is part of the interview team so......

According to who?

[Chicago White Sox]

2 hours ago, Tnetennba said:

Welp, we're boned.

Yup, we are even more fucked now.

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

LaRussa is part of the interview team so......

If that's the case then Schumaker it is.  

[ScootsMcGoots]

8 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

I want to hear someone give a correct message. No more talk about the importance of bunting or playing fast and aggressive or fiery or whatever. No more lectures about how baseball was correct 20 years ago and everything is wrong today. Talk about being smart, being well prepared, putting guys in position to succeed. A person who at least sounds like they understand that there is a modern aspect to baseball. 

Add in some actual professionalism. That's one I've been asking about for 10 years or so, actually look prepared and treat things and other people like you're the public representative of a billion dollar business.

Except, this is exactly how Grifol sounded when he was hired. Said all the right things, sounded professional before he stepped into the dugout. Continually talked about being smart and well-prepared. He proved to be the exact opposite of that. Turned out to be one of the worst managers in the history of the team in just 2 years time.

[southsider2k5]

3 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

LaRussa is part of the interview team so......

 

7 hours ago, Tnetennba said:

I don't know which is more frightening, Getz's decision making or JR/TLR meddling in said decisions.

Nope, Harold wins.