Michael Lorenzen pitching himself as a 2-way player, possibly to Sox

[Quin]

Quote

 

Shohei Ohtani is the only player to qualify for two-way designation since Major League Baseball introduced the criteria in 2020. But the potential for right-hander Michael Lorenzen to achieve two-way status is creating a fascinating twist in his free agency.

Lorenzen, who turns 33 on Jan. 4, has not hit in a major-league game since 2021, and has not had more than one plate appearance in a season since 2019. Not to worry. The idea conceived by Lorenzen and his agent, Ryan Hamill of CAA, could make the pitcher a free-agent fit for non-contenders such as the Chicago White Sox and Miami Marlins — and a coveted trade target later.

Hamill, according to sources briefed on his conversations, is talking with such clubs about signing Lorenzen, getting him the necessary plate appearances to qualify for two-way status and then flipping him to a contender that would benefit from carrying him as a 14th pitcher.

 

 

 

 

[caulfield12]

Shades of Matt Davidson?

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Sox were just kind of used as an example of a team he could try this with, not that there was actual interest fwiw.

[WhiteSox2023]

2 hours ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Sox were just kind of used as an example of a team he could try this with, not that there was actual interest fwiw.

Yeah, I think it would be funny if Lorenzen was actually trying to sell himself to the Sox to try to get them to throw millions at him.  He would definitely be barking up the wrong tree.  The Sox are only interested if your value and price are low based on previous season(s).

[nrockway]

I hope he gets a chance. Hate the designated hitter, takes value away from a guy like Lorenzen or MadBum. Lorenzen would probably be one of the better hitters on this team...

[caulfield12]

7 minutes ago, nrockway said:

I hope he gets a chance. Hate the designated hitter, takes value away from a guy like Lorenzen or MadBum. Lorenzen would probably be one of the better hitters on this team...

Cease would have been one of the best hitters on last year's team...

[nrockway]

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Cease would have been one of the best hitters on last year's team...

Right? This is an all-time Sox performance. It's a tragedy he'll never get a real chance.  

 

[Snopek]

Lol sox would have this dude playing RF by mid April.

[southsider2k5]

It's wild to watch this go from they could sell this to a team like the White Sox, to the White Sox have interest, even though it was never said the White Sox have interest.  This was just a great sales job by his agent.

[southsider2k5]

2 hours ago, Snopek said:

Lol sox would have this dude playing RF CF by mid April.

 

[Quin]

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

It's wild to watch this go from they could sell this to a team like the White Sox, to the White Sox have interest, even though it was never said the White Sox have interest.  This was just a great sales job by his agent.

Half of the article is just "Lorenzen wants to join a team that has nothing to lose, like the Marlins or White Sox, who suck and aren't trying, and his pitch to them is 'let me do this, then trade me and we all win.'"

[Quin]

12 hours ago, nrockway said:

Right? This is an all-time Sox performance. It's a tragedy he'll never get a real chance.  

 

Counter point: Would you rather have more Frank Thomas and Jim Thome or more Dylan Cease and Michael Lorenzen.

[wegner]

Since he is a 2 way player, Mr Reinsdorf has approved an offer of twice the league minimum........plus incentives!!!

[nrockway]

6 hours ago, Quin said:

Counter point: Would you rather have more Frank Thomas and Jim Thome or more Dylan Cease and Michael Lorenzen.

Truly, the latter. Defense is a relevant aspect of baseball, if you can't even play first base, you probably shouldn't be playing professionally anymore. Frank compiled another ~9ish WAR after moving to permanent DH, maybe that was the difference between him entering the Hall or not. But I wouldn't change my opinion on this for Homeristic reasons, I reckon he would've got in anyway, eventually. Thome is fundamentally an Indians player so I don't really care.

[Balta1701]

19 minutes ago, nrockway said:

Truly, the latter. Defense is a relevant aspect of baseball, if you can't even play first base, you probably shouldn't be playing professionally anymore. Frank compiled another ~9ish WAR after moving to permanent DH, maybe that was the difference between him entering the Hall or not. But I wouldn't change my opinion on this for Homeristic reasons, I reckon he would've got in anyway, eventually. Thome is fundamentally an Indians player so I don't really care.

What exactly are you calling a permanent DH? Frank Thomas played a total of 131 games at 1b in his final 11 seasons, never more than 49 games at 1b per year. Over that time he accounted for 23.4 fWAR.  This included a 5.9 fWAR season where he was 2nd in the MVP voting to a guy loaded with steroids.

[nrockway]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

What exactly are you calling a permanent DH? Frank Thomas played a total of 131 games at 1b in his final 11 seasons, never more than 49 games at 1b per year. Over that time he accounted for 23.4 fWAR.  This included a 5.9 fWAR season where he was 2nd in the MVP voting to a guy loaded with steroids.

2005-2008 is what I was looking at in which he did not play the field at all, although he was essentially the DH from 1998 on, only (like you say) playing 131 games at 1B the rest of his career. I picked 2005 because he played 0 games at 1b after that year. However, his defensive stats were 'fine' over that period (1998-2004). Maybe moving to DH extended his career in terms of injuries, but I don't really see evidence of that. If the DH doesn't exist, I speculate Frank is still putting up the same hitting numbers and continuing to play 1b, his Hall of Fame legacy intact. 

I'd rather use David Ortiz as an example. That guy shouldn't be in the Hall for, primarily steroids, but also the fact that he could not play the field. Frank played four fewer seasons but compiled 6000 more innings in the field. Principally, I think baseball players should play both sides of the ball and I imagine Thomas, Thome, Edgar Martinez could have still played the field and had Hall of Fame careers if the DH never existed. And if they were forced into an earlier retirement, then maybe they weren't good enough at the entire sport of baseball. The sport isn't exclusively hitting and pitching. Frank Thomas is one of my favorite players and the homer in me says he would've made it no matter what. But I sorta think if you can't play the field anymore, if your bad defense outweighs your good offense, it's time to call it quits.

I don't think the MLB ever really needed to make rules to make offense more prevalent (besides the dead ball). Baseball is a pretty slow sport, adding a couple more hits per game isn't going to make it entertaining for would-be fans who think the game is too slow. They can just watch cricket, there's plenty of hitting in that sport and consequently 'bowling', the other side of the ball, is pretty boring; there isn't as much depth as with baseball pitching. Pitchers hitting is also just fun to watch, kind of like comic relief, and there's an extra dimension of strategy when he is expected to hit. A pitcher hitting a home run is far more memorable than a DH hitting one. Bartolo Colon hitting a home run is an awesome moment for the sport, Eloy Jimenez grounding out to the shortstop 90% of the time is...not.

I thought the system was fine when the AL had the DH and the NL did not. Standardization is boring and the relative lack of it in baseball is another aspect of the sport which makes it more interesting than, say, basketball or hockey. Watch how in 20 years every ballpark is going to have the exact same dimensions and feature a dome and I blame Ron Blomberg for it.