Best front office in pro sports

[WhiteSox2023]

18 minutes ago, PaleAleSox said:

Oh no I pointed something out in regards to their current front office that wasn't even a dig. What a stupid thing to do. 

Correction noted.  The White Sox are literally the old western trading post / whore house saloon for both LA and Boston.

Edited Wednesday at 12:47 AM by WhiteSox2023

[caulfield12]

11 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Correction noted.  The White Sox are literally the old western trading post / whore house saloon for both LA and Boston.

Getz as Andrew Tate?

[Balta1701]

9 hours ago, nrockway said:

That #1 front office on that list traded James Harden entering his prime on a reasonable contract and couldn't win a championship with two future Hall of Famers also in their prime. In other words, lol, Presti is the most overrated GM in the NBA

I'd just like to make sure of something - is your entire argument against him that "He ran into the Golden State Warriors"?

For reference, the guy who built the Warriors, Bob Myers, retired over a year ago. And yes, he spent 10 years as the best exec in the league. No, Presti should not have been ranked above him, but he retired. 

[Lip Man 1]

The Dodgers front office and ownership runs rings around the incompetent, dysfunctional and inept Sox ownership/front office from top to bottom in all departments on and off the field.

They may not be the "best" in the four major professional U.S. sports but they are damn close to it and a front office that most Sox fans would kill to have (to say nothing of 12 straight playoff appearances)

It is literally absurd to think otherwise. 

[caulfield12]

To be updated when Sasaski signs in the next couple of weeks.

If you took the vote again today, the Mets would suddenly appear with the combo of Stearns and Cohen's financial largesse.

[PaleAleSox]

8 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

The Dodgers front office and ownership runs rings around the incompetent, dysfunctional and inept Sox ownership/front office from top to bottom in all departments on and off the field.

They may not be the "best" in the four major professional U.S. sports but they are damn close to it and a front office that most Sox fans would kill to have (to say nothing of 12 straight playoff appearances)

It is literally absurd to think otherwise. 

Who here is arguing they wouldn't want the Dodgers front office (more importantly, resources)? 

[Texsox]

The team wins and loses based on the players. If we're going to call Jerry the worst owner because he's got crappy players today we also have to acknowledge the teams he owned also managed to put together some championship rosters . . .

Decades ago. 

Whatever luck, skill, talent he had as a sports team owner has gone away. I do think twenty years after retirement his legacy will look better than today. Immediacy always moves subjective votes like best and worst more than time.

At least to me he clearly needs to step away from day to day operations. Somewhere in the shareholders there must be a competent business leader to take on the Chairperson role. 

 

 

[Timmy U]

1 hour ago, Texsox said:

The team wins and loses based on the players. If we're going to call Jerry the worst owner because he's got crappy players today we also have to acknowledge the teams he owned also managed to put together some championship rosters . . .

Decades ago. 

Whatever luck, skill, talent he had as a sports team owner has gone away. I do think twenty years after retirement his legacy will look better than today. Immediacy always moves subjective votes like best and worst more than time.

At least to me he clearly needs to step away from day to day operations. Somewhere in the shareholders there must be a competent business leader to take on the Chairperson role. 

 

 

You don't need one of the partners to run the joint. You could hire a team president who speaks for the club at the mlb level (like Kevin Warren) and then either Reinsdorf or another owner is a level up. Now, it is possible that LaRussa is the de facto President right now, but he is not qualified for that role. I would love Mellody Hobson to step up and run the team, but she is very busy running a hedge fund and promoting her book. I doubt she wants to run the Sox. But it would guarantee the best Star Wars night in all of baseball.

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, Texsox said:

The team wins and loses based on the players. If we're going to call Jerry the worst owner because he's got crappy players today we also have to acknowledge the teams he owned also managed to put together some championship rosters . . .

Decades ago. 

Whatever luck, skill, talent he had as a sports team owner has gone away. I do think twenty years after retirement his legacy will look better than today. Immediacy always moves subjective votes like best and worst more than time.

At least to me he clearly needs to step away from day to day operations. Somewhere in the shareholders there must be a competent business leader to take on the Chairperson role. 

 

 

1. “Baseball strategies were better in the 1990s” is a plan that might have worked in 2005. Coming out of the Steroid Era, only the start of the Moneyball era of GMs getting smarter, well before the Strikeout era we are in now. It is now well out of date.

2. Kenny Williams wasn’t the best GM in the sport, but he was pretty good. Aggressive strategy, employed some good people. It worked pretty well for years, until personality conflicts worked their way in. That may be a message about his later years, guys who he trusted when they had success became full of themselves and has no leadership from the owner.

3. I think we all know the Jerry Krause story. The Pippen trade was brilliance. Bringing in Phil was brilliance. Grant, Rodman. Some of the historically best moves ever in basketball. Dismantling the team so he could get more credit for rebuilding it was unchecked arrogance, and again Reinsdorf let it fester.

4. Jerry Reinsdorf bought a franchise that already had Michael Jordan. His story is very, very different without that one key detail.

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, Texsox said:

The team wins and loses based on the players. If we're going to call Jerry the worst owner because he's got crappy players today we also have to acknowledge the teams he owned also managed to put together some championship rosters . . .

Decades ago. 

Whatever luck, skill, talent he had as a sports team owner has gone away. I do think twenty years after retirement his legacy will look better than today. Immediacy always moves subjective votes like best and worst more than time.

At least to me he clearly needs to step away from day to day operations. Somewhere in the shareholders there must be a competent business leader to take on the Chairperson role. 

 

 

Most of the other shareholders (aka Board of Directors) are around JR's age and probably have no desire to get that involved, even if they could.

Remember it is in JR's contract that he runs the team... period, end of discussion. The other board members can offer advice but literally have no say in any decisions.

One example is some were telling JR to sell after 2005 when the going was good, JR refused. JR also twice refused Andrew Berlin's advances in 2008. 

JR does what he wants, when he wants without fear of blowback and that will remain the case until his passing.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

They had six top 10 picks and two 11's.  Truly extraodinary how much they fucked it up.  

[Thad Bosley]

2 hours ago, Texsox said:

The team wins and loses based on the players. If we're going to call Jerry the worst owner because he's got crappy players today we also have to acknowledge the teams he owned also managed to put together some championship rosters . . .

Decades ago. 

Whatever luck, skill, talent he had as a sports team owner has gone away. I do think twenty years after retirement his legacy will look better than today. Immediacy always moves subjective votes like best and worst more than time.

At least to me he clearly needs to step away from day to day operations. Somewhere in the shareholders there must be a competent business leader to take on the Chairperson role. 

 

 

Which part of his four decades of what now looks like one, long list of one franchise-crippling decision after another will somehow look better somewhere down the road?  

Absent the one hit wonder that was the 2005 championship season, what could any of us possibly later point towards and re-assess as “that wasn’t as bad as we thought back then”?  Do you have an example of what you think that could be?

I can skim his entire reign of terror starting all the way back in 1981 clear through today and there is nothing to my eye that the simple passage of time will change my view as to the absolute disaster this guy has been as owner since day one.  

[Texsox]

15 minutes ago, Thad Bosley said:

Which part of his four decades of what now looks like one, long list of one franchise-crippling decision after another will somehow look better somewhere down the road?  

Absent the one hit wonder that was the 2005 championship season, what could any of us possibly later point towards and re-assess as “that wasn’t as bad as we thought back then”?  Do you have an example of what you think that could be?

I can skim his entire reign of terror starting all the way back in 1981 clear through today and there is nothing to my eye that the simple passage of time will change my view as to the absolute disaster this guy has been as owner since day one.  

The six Bulls championships. The team put together great rosters to compliment Jordan.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

They had six top 10 picks and two 11's.  Truly extraodinary how much they fucked it up.  

This misses Rodon (2014 the cutoff), Anderson and Tatis...but yuck.

The crazy thing is almost every one of those picks made it to the majors.  Just with limited MLB impacts.

Top 10-12 is who's who of elite front offices.  Red Sox and Yankees well off the pace.

Edited Wednesday at 07:15 PM by caulfield12

[Balta1701]

6 hours ago, Texsox said:

The six Bulls championships. The team put together great rosters to compliment Jordan.

Where would they have been had Reinsdorf not bought a team that already had the greatest player in NBA history?

[nrockway]

On 12/31/2024 at 5:27 PM, caulfield12 said:

But this feels like dinging the Patriots under Belichick and Craft for their politics massage trips or Brady being overlooked by everyone.

The Chiefs are right up there...generational QB who signed a below value/flexible contract to accommodate more talent on the roster is 75% of it.

The Dodgers with their deferrals and marketing to Asia and monetizing Ohtani/their brand globally are transforming how the entire sport does business.

A Taipei investment company paid $4.5 million for that 50/50 Ohtani HR ball just to put it on display for customers.  How many fans of the Dodgers on that island will result?  

I’m not super impressed by “clever” people who find loopholes and make a mockery of whatever system they’re involved in; in this case, professional sports. The MLB’s biggest fault IMO is how laissez-unfaire the financial system is, the deferrals just shines another light on how dumb and unregulated it is. 

Friedman seemed to do better work in Tampa Bay and they’re also in great shape after he left. That’s a good organization. They mention the Lightning too, an organization that made Yzerman look like a genius; now he looks like a fool being in charge of a historically excellent team. The organizations themselves are solid irrespective of the boss. I don’t think that’s true of the Dodgers as of late, they win because all the good players want to play there and LAD has an unlimited budget. 
 

None of this is to say the White Sox are competent or any Chicago team, I just question the methodology of the article. One time we used an analytic hierarchy process model to turn “professional” opinion into something quantifiable and the results were pretty good. New Dork Times should know how to conduct a survey, those con artists at the Athletic told me their publication was gonna be intellectual, what happened. 

[Texsox]

35 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Where would they have been had Reinsdorf not bought a team that already had the greatest player in NBA history?

Perhaps the same as the Angels with Trout and Ohtani?? Whatever you think is fair in your assessment. I'm not going to change your opinion, nor do I want to. I don't give owners much credit, so it really doesn't mean much to me. But if you believe an owner makes a difference isn't it fair to consider the players the Bulls put around Jordan for the championship runs *and* the crap he put on the field and court the past couple of years? To me it seems fair to call the 21st century a fail as Bulls owner but the 1990s as a spectacular win. It did take six years to build a supporting cast, including a second HoF guy, that would win a championship. Isn't six years enough time to be evaluated as an owner?

Pippen was the only guy that was there for the full championship run.  Jordan and Paxon were the only players on the roster in 1986 when JR bought the team that were on the 1991 roster when they won their first of six championships. Again, if you don't want to give him any credit, that's your choice. I think in career highlights as owner that will be a strong positive. 

Overall he isn't the worst owner in Chicago sports. In my lifetime I will give that honor to Dollar Bill Wirt$. I'm not even certain he's much worse than the Halas heirs or any of the Cub owners. 

 

[FloydBannister1983]

11 hours ago, Texsox said:

Perhaps the same as the Angels with Trout and Ohtani?? Whatever you think is fair in your assessment. I'm not going to change your opinion, nor do I want to. I don't give owners much credit, so it really doesn't mean much to me. But if you believe an owner makes a difference isn't it fair to consider the players the Bulls put around Jordan for the championship runs *and* the crap he put on the field and court the past couple of years? To me it seems fair to call the 21st century a fail as Bulls owner but the 1990s as a spectacular win. It did take six years to build a supporting cast, including a second HoF guy, that would win a championship. Isn't six years enough time to be evaluated as an owner?

Pippen was the only guy that was there for the full championship run.  Jordan and Paxon were the only players on the roster in 1986 when JR bought the team that were on the 1991 roster when they won their first of six championships. Again, if you don't want to give him any credit, that's your choice. I think in career highlights as owner that will be a strong positive. 

Overall he isn't the worst owner in Chicago sports. In my lifetime I will give that honor to Dollar Bill Wirt$. I'm not even certain he's much worse than the Halas heirs or any of the Cub owners. 

 

Reinsdorf intentionally dismantled the Jordan Bulls.  That alone discredits any one of those six championships he inherited.

Yes, he is worse than Halas and the Cub owners.  Not just for the dismantling but for his taxpayer funded stadium as well.  He’s a crappy owner and a grifter.

[Texsox]

He inherited two players that went on to win a championship five years later. There were a lot of drafts and a few trades that made that possible. 

The Hawks won nothing with $Bill as owner. He wouldn't even televise sold out home playoff games. 

I believe currently only 25 MLB teams play in publicly funded stadiums. And somewhere around 30 NFL teams. The rest are private. 

If owning a stadium was a wise financial decision everyone would be fighting to own it. The smartest business plan as a team owner is a free or very low cost stadium lease where you own the land surrounding it. If JR sells I want a smart business person as team owner who would also push for a publicly funded stadium. 

The Yankees have a publicly funded stadium. Arguably the most financially successful US sports team over the past 100 years. 

I also accept that it's reasonable as a tax payer to object to the proposal. But as a team fan it's the best formula. 

[Snopek]

21 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

They had six top 10 picks and two 11's.  Truly extraodinary how much they fucked it up.  

 

Lol'ing at the thought of Getz spinning this into a bullet point for his resume for the GM position:

• Directed efforts to supplement organization with over 20 WAR from players with no previous MLB experience

 

[77 Hitmen]

On 12/30/2024 at 9:09 PM, southsider2k5 said:

In the 4 major sports, 78 teams received votes.  The White Sox received 0 votes.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6007317/2024/12/30/nba-nhl-nfl-mlb-front-office-rankings?source=user-shared-article

.....and may God have mercy on our souls.