ChiSoxFanMike Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 4:46 PM, Chicago White Sox said: There is some value in not losing 121 games again. Not a ton where we should be making bad long-term decisions, but enough to hand a starting to guys unworthy of an opportunity IMO. Expand Truthfully I don’t really care how many games they lose this year as long as these younger players show some type of progress. At least there is a potential benefit to losing now unlike last year. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:11 PM, ChiSoxFanMike said: If they trade with the Mets, they might as well take Baty as a change of scenery type. Nothing to lose. Expand We'll take every team's change of scenery 3B who can't play 3B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 4:12 PM, Dick Allen said: At lease when they lose this year, they have a chance to be rewarded. Expand Back to cheering for losses! (not that that wasn't happening last year but that was more to embarrass the org) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 The problem is, if guys like Sosa and Vargas and Baldwin and Fletcher, are so bad they can't beat out one year veteran deals. whether they lose 121 games or 118 won't matter much, because the loss total is going to start with a 1 for years. Where is the development? Where is the eye for talent if these guys can't play? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:18 PM, Dick Allen said: The problem is, if guys like Sosa and Vargas and Baldwin and Fletcher, are so bad they can't beat out one year veteran deals. whether they lose 121 games or 118 won't matter much, because the loss total is going to start with a 1 for years. Where is the development? Where is the eye for talent if these guys can't play? Expand And this is the real answer as to why they aren't playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Thought this was interesting https://dkpittsburghsports.com/team/pirates/feed?page=0&content=pirates-right-field-trade-move-addition-column-mlb-dk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:18 PM, Dick Allen said: The problem is, if guys like Sosa and Vargas and Baldwin and Fletcher, are so bad they can't beat out one year veteran deals. whether they lose 121 games or 118 won't matter much, because the loss total is going to start with a 1 for years. Where is the development? Where is the eye for talent if these guys can't play? Expand And that’s the biggest concern I have with Getz so far. It seems everyone they acquire sees their value tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:16 PM, Bob Sacamano said: We'll take every team's change of scenery 3B who can't play 3B. Expand The Sox need help everywhere. If the Mets are basically giving Baty away, they might as well take him. Could give him a shot at 3B and move Vargas to 1B. Or move Baty to 1B. Just need to accumulate talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:21 PM, fathom said: And that’s the biggest concern I have with Getz so far. It seems everyone they acquire sees their value tank. Expand Yes, how is anyone supposed to think he's going to get some uber prospect for the guys he signed this year, when he can't get crap for most of what he's traded away? We have seen why there should have been a GM search. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:20 PM, fathom said: Thought this was interesting https://dkpittsburghsports.com/team/pirates/feed?page=0&content=pirates-right-field-trade-move-addition-column-mlb-dk Expand Saw that as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:21 PM, fathom said: And that’s the biggest concern I have with Getz so far. It seems everyone they acquire sees their value tank. Expand I've seen enough videos from a trainer on Twitter to know that Zavala will have a 1.000 OPS this year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:23 PM, ChiSoxFanMike said: The Sox need help everywhere. If the Mets are basically giving Baty away, they might as well take him. Could give him a shot at 3B and move Vargas to 1B. Or move Baty to 1B. Just need to accumulate talent. Expand I don't really agree this, they need "help" but they have a logjam of "maybe tolerable guys who need playing time" at 2b and 3b, along with a randomly thrown in veteran. They are already moving one 3b/2b most likely to DH/1b, and they have a guy at 1b they kept this year for reasons. There's no at bats for Baty on the White Sox right now - if there are, they come at the expense of Vargas, or Sosa, or Meidroth, or later in the season Ramos. I don't know that any of those guys are good, but I know you can't play them all enough to find out. The end result is that someone must get cut. There is also, for reasons I still don't understand, a veteran 3b/2b signed this year in Rojas who will somehow need at bats. It's like acquiring a pitcher who spent last year at AAA. Even with injuries, they don't have room for the guy on the big league roster right now, so making the logjam bigger just denies guys the big league time they might need to develop. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 4:47 PM, southsider2k5 said: That this is a team coming off of a 121 loss season and that it is more important to evaluate the players you have right now than to waste time on "flip" candidates who have no actual value like we did last year. Expand Sosa and Vargas need to play as much as possible this year. If they still suck, then move on after 2025. Baldwin should be the utility player heading into the season. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted February 12 Author Share Posted February 12 (edited) On 2/12/2025 at 5:23 PM, ChiSoxFanMike said: The Sox need help everywhere. If the Mets are basically giving Baty away, they might as well take him. Could give him a shot at 3B and move Vargas to 1B. Or move Baty to 1B. Just need to accumulate talent. Expand A big part of the offensive problem last year was when 3 starters went down, they were quickly into AAA utility infielders OPSing .500. At least if they create a logjam, they can rotate until they find somebody who will stick. Edited February 12 by WestEddy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:20 PM, fathom said: Thought this was interesting https://dkpittsburghsports.com/team/pirates/feed?page=0&content=pirates-right-field-trade-move-addition-column-mlb-dk Expand Send me Konnor Griffin and call it a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:35 PM, DirtySox said: Send me Konnor Griffin and call it a day. Expand They’d probably have to move Cruz back into the IF to make it work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:29 PM, Balta1701 said: I don't really agree this, they need "help" but they have a logjam of "maybe tolerable guys who need playing time" at 2b and 3b, along with a randomly thrown in veteran. They are already moving one 3b/2b most likely to DH/1b, and they have a guy at 1b they kept this year for reasons. There's no at bats for Baty on the White Sox right now - if there are, they come at the expense of Vargas, or Sosa, or Meidroth, or later in the season Ramos. I don't know that any of those guys are good, but I know you can't play them all enough to find out. The end result is that someone must get cut. There is also, for reasons I still don't understand, a veteran 3b/2b signed this year in Rojas who will somehow need at bats. It's like acquiring a pitcher who spent last year at AAA. Even with injuries, they don't have room for the guy on the big league roster right now, so making the logjam bigger just denies guys the big league time they might need to develop. Expand Fair points. I’d say Vargas and Sosa are the starters at 3B and 2B on Opening Day because they are out of options. Colson maybe at SS if he has a good spring. Vaughn at 1B. Maybe they can rotate at DH some. There is a logjam to an extent, but hopefully there will be enough at-bats to go around to evaluate all these guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBooneLoganEra Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:32 PM, fathom said: Sosa and Vargas need to play as much as possible this year. If they still suck, then move on after 2025. Baldwin should be the utility player heading into the season. Expand I hear you. But personally I'd be happy to never see Vargas play again. I've seen enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 5:42 PM, ChiSoxFanMike said: Fair points. I’d say Vargas and Sosa are the starters at 3B and 2B on Opening Day because they are out of options. Colson maybe at SS if he has a good spring. Vaughn at 1B. Maybe they can rotate at DH some. There is a logjam to an extent, but hopefully there will be enough at-bats to go around to evaluate all these guys. Expand I don’t buy that there are when you count Meidroth, who I want up early in the year also - a guy with a .400 OBP at AAA last year won’t learn much by repeating the level. The only way I see it being no problem is if the veteran, Rojas, gets glued to the bench. The next time the White Sox sign a field general veteran and bench him for rookies will probably be the first. I’m guessing he gets his 500 PAs, which maybe leaves the others with 300-400? And that’s before Baty or someone like that and maybe Ramos, if healthy. In terms of Montgomery, I outlined this in another thread - I hate calling Montgomery up even if he has a good spring. His problems last year were possibly a back injury, hitting fastballs, and maybe another personal issue. In spring training he won’t be playing full games everyday, and he will be against pitchers who are ramping up and who aren’t yet using their best fastballs. This is a setup where he could absolutely look good in the spring and have it be a mirage. Send him to AAA, let him show me that last year was a fluke while playing everyday, and he can come up mid May. If, for example, he starts playing everyday and his back flares up again, clearly this will be a longer term problem that needs figured out, and he will be accumulating service time if he comes up and then winds up on the IL. Gimme 6 solid weeks at AAA and no complaints if he’s called up, but coming off last season he needs to prove to me that last season is a mirage. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalChiSox Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 (edited) On 2/12/2025 at 5:20 PM, fathom said: Thought this was interesting https://dkpittsburghsports.com/team/pirates/feed?page=0&content=pirates-right-field-trade-move-addition-column-mlb-dk Expand I doubt that's a reference to Robert because he said pitching is going the other way and right now we are looking for bats. Edited February 12 by SoCalChiSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 6:17 PM, SoCalChiSox said: I doubt that's a reference to Robert because he said pitching is going the other way and right now we are looking for bats. Expand Yeah they also currently have an OF projection of Reynolds in LF, Cruz in CF, and Pham in RF. Not that Pham should stop any team from trading for Robert but they gave him $4M so doubt the Pirates would replace him with someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 6:38 PM, Bob Sacamano said: Yeah they also currently have an OF projection of Reynolds in LF, Cruz in CF, and Pham in RF. Not that Pham should stop any team from trading for Robert but they gave him $4M so doubt the Pirates would replace him with someone else. Expand Speaking of Pham, if we hadn't been so insistent on giving him at-bats last year (and ultimately make him a throw-in), Fletcher/Colas/DeLoach could have gotten playing time and we'd have gotten a better assessment of them. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 6:46 PM, Quin said: Speaking of Pham, if we hadn't been so insistent on giving him at-bats last year (and ultimately make him a throw-in), Fletcher/Colas/DeLoach could have gotten playing time and we'd have gotten a better assessment of them. Expand And we got zero for him. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 2:33 PM, southsider2k5 said: They are rebuilding, but are also trying to not be the most embarassing team in MLB history again. They are trying to have a foot into both worlds. The absolutely blew it again last year, and don't want that mess again. Expand Except they are a worse team on paper than last year while operating in almost exactly the same dumb manner. 121 is difficult to replicate, but I struggle to see how any of these vets alters that trajectory. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 On 2/12/2025 at 6:57 PM, Tnetennba said: Except they are a worse team on paper than last year while operating in almost exactly the same dumb manner. 121 is difficult to replicate, but I struggle to see how any of these vets alters that trajectory. Expand Today we are paying for a complete lack of player development ever since the last time we had a top ranked farm system. Ordinarily, most teams can back fill a roster that will lose 110 games without needing help from the outside to get up to that few of wins. The Sox don't have that right now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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