Goddbye Robbie Alomar

[DBAHO]

Looks like Willie's gonna play 2B unless we sign sum1 else.

frustrated Roberto Alomar all but said farewell to the White Sox on Friday.

 

After hearing the Sox had lowered their latest offer $1 million, the 12-time All-Star took it as a sign that he no longer is wanted on the South Side.

 

"I want to stay in Chicago," Alomar said from his hotel room in Tokyo, where he is vacationing. "I love the team and the fans. My brother [sandy Jr.] is there and I'd love to get my 3,000th hit there. But you want to play where they give you the respect you're looking for."

 

All along, sources said Alomar sought a two-year deal worth $6 million, a seemingly reasonable sum for a 35-year-old future Hall of Famer who was paid $8 million last season.

 

But early Friday, the Sox's best offer was $1 million plus $2 million deferred (over an unspecified period) without interest, lowering the actual value to perhaps $2.5 million.

 

Later in the day, Sox general manager Ken Williams told Alomar's agent, Jaime Torres, that the Sox were lowering their offer to $1 million plus $1 million deferred for 2004.

 

"It's important to understand that an offer is only an offer until you reject it," Williams said. "Then it's off the table. If a player wants to revisit it after one week, two weeks or a month, circumstances can change dramatically—sometimes it's in your favor, sometimes not.

 

"Just because they don't understand that, it's not my problem. I have some other things going on. There are other possibilities out there."

 

Williams' reduced offer to Alomar could be a sign the general manager thinks he still has a chance to sign ace right-hander Bartolo Colon, despite Anaheim's reported four-year, $48 million offer.

 

"I don't want this to come down as I'm trying to get Robbie on the cheap or that I'm disrespecting him," Williams said. "It's truly a case where that's all we can offer because I'm trying to put this team together in its entirety.

 

"If I didn't respect Robbie Alomar, I wouldn't have called him in Puerto Rico [in October] to ask his opinion on some of the managerial candidates."

 

There's another issue.

 

Both Williams and Alomar said they informally agreed to a one-year, $3 million extension during a discussion on Aug. 30.

 

The Sox were in Detroit that day and Alomar had to miss the game because he had the flu. Williams was also under the weather, and when he went to the clubhouse to get some medicine, he began discussing with Alomar ways that Hall of Fame athletes have extended their careers.

 

"We talked about Rickey Henderson and Jerry Rice; it was a very casual conversation," Williams said. "He expressed a desire to want to stay [with the Sox]. I'm a straightforward person: I said, 'Let's play the year out. This is not the time to talk about it.' I told him I wouldn't be able to match what he was making ($8 million).

 

"He said, 'Well, it's not going to take that. What about half ($4 million)?'

 

"Then he threw out another number ($3 million) and said, 'Yeah, I'm serious. Call Jaime. Get it done.'

 

"I did [call him] and it didn't [get done]—end of story."

 

Alomar recalled it differently, saying it was Williams who pushed the one-year, $3 million proposal.

 

"He said: 'What do you think about that?'" Alomar recalled. "I said, 'Let me talk to my agent.' I let my agent take care of my business, that's what you pay your agent for."

 

Alomar said it was "unprofessional" of Williams to try to pin him down on a contract extension while he was sick and his agent was not present.

 

Said Torres: "It doesn't make sense for a player of Robbie's caliber and experience to agree to something without consulting with his attorney. I've represented Robbie for 12 years. He always runs stuff by me."

 

When Torres and Williams spoke late in the season, Torres said the $3 million offer came with a hitch—$2 million would be deferred without interest.

 

As for Williams' unorthodox strategy of discussing the contract extension with Alomar, Torres said: "Hopefully he won't be successful doing that with any of my clients."

 

Williams defended that practice, acknowledging he discussed a two-year extension with Tom Gordon, who later signed with the Yankees.

 

"In couple of rare instances, I have done that," Williams said. "I have done that and I have immediately followed it with a phone call to the agent to let him know about the conversation.

 

"But it has never been initiated from this angle. You'd be surprised by all the things players say: 'Hey, Kenny, I need this or I need that. When are you going to call my agent?' Half the time they're joking around.

 

"But I love the communication with the players. They're our employees. And, hey, if we don't have the right to talk to our employees, what [rights] do we have?"

 

Williams also has the right to cut ties with Alomar and hand the second-base job to the talented but unproven Willie Harris, who started just seven games at second base last season.

 

"Willie's going to be a player, man," Williams said. "I know sometimes fans and people want a guarantee. We heard that when we brought up the kid with the funny name (Magglio Ordonez) and put him in right field.

 

"They said, 'C'mon, that's not a big-league name!' And now it's a chant [at the ballpark] and I'm criminal No. 1 if I trade the guy."

 

Alomar, meanwhile, is ready to move on to his seventh team—and fourth in the last three years.

 

"I'm the one who always talked about Ozzie [Guillen] and wanting to play for him," Alomar said. "But sometimes things are not meant to be."

 

Torres said five teams have inquired about signing Alomar, including the Yankees and Cardinals.

 

Said Alomar of the Sox: "Hopefully both of us made the right choice."

[The Critic]

"I want to stay in Chicago," Alomar said. "But you want to play where they give you the respect you're looking for."

I think some people need to be taught that money is spelled M-O-N-E-Y, not R-E-S-P-E-C-T.

I see a lot of athletes confuse these two words, and I really get the impression that their teachers didn't work hard enough with them.

 

I kind of understand why he said that, but I'm just tired of players overusing and misusuing the word respect. He was with the team for half a year - the Sox can make any type of offer they choose. They don't owe Alomar anything, and he shouldn't think they do. He's been on a lot of teams in his career, he SHOULD know how the process works by now.

[Texsox]

Williams said. "I know sometimes fans and people want a guarantee. We heard that when we brought up the kid with the funny name (Magglio Ordonez) and put him in right field.

 

"They said, 'C'mon, that's not a big-league name!' And now it's a chant [at the ballpark] and I'm criminal No. 1 if I trade the guy."

 

 

_______________

 

Yes, KW you are public enemy #1 if you trade Maggs. I'm glad you understand that.

[JDsDirtySox]

Williams said. "I know sometimes fans and people want a guarantee. We heard that when we brought up the kid with the funny name (Magglio Ordonez) and put him in right field.

 

"They said, 'C'mon, that's not a big-league name!' And now it's a chant [at the ballpark] and I'm criminal No. 1 if I trade the guy."

 

 

_______________

 

Yes, KW you are public enemy #1 if you trade Maggs. I'm glad you understand that.

I like this from Kenny. This shows me he understands the importance to Maggs on this team and the importance of Maggs to the fans.

 

Maybe this means Maggs stays (and hopefully gets resigned)

[southsider2k5]

Almost makes me feel bad for Kenny. He knows he has to put this team together, and make it competitve, to basically keep his job, IMO, with no real payroll. Pretty s***ty if you ask me.

I guess I read this completely different than everyone else because to me it sounded like Ol Kenny was running the scam on Robbie, just like he has on so many of our other players. KW is a conartist plain and simple.

[Texsox]

At some point he's probably budgeting by position and may only have 2 mil for a 2nd baseman. Grab the money while it's there.

[spataro51]

your right tony, i feel sorry for kenny also. It isn't his fault he has to put a competitive team out there with such a limited amount he can spend. The problem is Jerry needs to sell this fricken team to some one that will spend some money to get us where we need to be. Kenny williams is the right man for the gm he knows how to get players here and the only prob is he has little or no money to work with. Kenny will be creative like he always has. I believe that kenny lowered his offer to alomar yesterday because I think colon will be here. Lets hope!

[cwsox]

I guess I read this completely different than everyone else because to me it sounded like Ol Kenny was running the scam on Robbie, just like he has on so many of our other players.  KW is a conartist plain and simple.

not sure I'd call KW a con artist but I ;ean towards your view more than the other direction

 

I am really curious why there was agreement with Robbie and the deal wasn't done.

[quickman]

Well, I think this sucks. Your basically 1 million a part on a decent defensive second baseman who wants to play in chicago.It is implied in the article that a one year deal could be worked out. What is this deferred bulls***. I wouldn't work for defferred money in my job. Also Harris Blows. He will never hit over 240. Williams thinks this guy is something special. He sucks. If he is the leadoff hitter we are in serious trouble. Alomar brings respect to the lineup. Pitchers still worry about him even though he has tailed off. In addition everyone stated how great Valentin played short because of the Robbie presence. Well what does the Harris presence do for you. Nothing. Will valentin be as good defensively as last year. Nope.Therefore this ripple effect could cost them games both offensively and defensively. That certainly doesn't bode well for a pitching staff. This is all over 1 million dollars and defferred money. If I were Colon I would be looking at this carefully. I would check and see who would be playing behind me. Lets see:

 

Valentin

Harris

Crede- not bad but still learning.

Who knows who is at first.

 

Alomar solidifies that infield defensively. He wants to work for guillen and he and colon get along. Again all over 1 million dollarsand defferred bulls***. I have defended the Sox org for along time. It is bothersome that both were so close on a one year deal. Both have differnet stories. Terrific communication that is. Now I truly believe this is a cheap, cheap way to do business. I think the Sox management should look at themselves in the mirror and say why would quickman spend another 10,000 this year? To watch Harris? valentin? Rowand? Garland, Konerko? Uribe? Quit complaining about attendance management. You need to appeal to me, not the other way around.

[southsider2k5]

I totally understand how you could read the article differernt. If you dont like a guy, you will just make the article into he is conartist, or if you like him, that he is strapt for cash, and cant do much at the moment. I do the same thing all the time if there is someone I dont like. But I do support Kenny(most of the time) and I think its more the problem with JR.

Well I tend to have that interpretation using history as a guide. Many players have told that exact story as Robbie just did. And it keeps happening. Offers disappear, agreements never get agreed to, good faith turns into outright hate.

[SnB]

I would have liked to see robbie back, but you can't blame KW for wanting to spend much on him, we're already strapped for cash as it is. We could definitely use that money elsewhere.

[Soxfest]

Kw gets tight with money on RA which is fine, but gives JV 5 mil like nothing, he talks out of both sides his mouth.

[winninguglyin83]

excellent point.

 

the difference?

 

the Sox had Harris ready to play 2b, but nobody at SS until they acquired Uribe.

 

In the end, I'm still waiting to see who KW gets to be the team's two other starting pitchers.

 

that's what will determine the success of the 2004 team.

[Molto]

the difference is there was only one way to keep Valentin $5 mil or nothing. I personally would have told Valentin to go stratch, but imagine being in a situation where you have absolutely NO second option. They let Valentin fly and they are stuck with NO SS. Usually when teams do that they have one in the minors or a bench player or a second baseman who can fill in. The Sox would've put themselves in a position to get areally expensive guy which they couldn't afford or go and grab two sub-part guys and let them battle it out which would likely end in criticism anyway.

 

Another thing, Miguel Tejada and Kaz Matsui are being sought out by a few teams (5-6) teams combined. Problem is they are only two people, so there will be a couple teams who may be looking for a shortstop. Valentin at $5 mil may be too much, but perhaps it could get us something in return. You have to flexible in what you do. You don't want to put yourself in a position where you have no other option and are desperate.

 

The thing KW did wrong was never addressing the position last season. He stuck with Valentin and Graffanino (both FAs) and never pulled off a deal prior to that for a young shortstop that could play in AAA for the time being and give us an option were Valentin to pull the whole "respect" bulls***.

[Spiff]

Ugh Willie Harris. Also known as Julio Ramirez II.

[Jim Fainter]

Three facts about Robbie:

 

1. Willie Harris is a better player

2. Willie costs less

3. The trade with the Mets (Robbie for Ring) was terrible

 

Robbie has been going downhill for 2 years, and the slide won't stop in 2004, unless he retires.

[Bighurt52235]

Three facts about Robbie:

 

1.  Willie Harris is a better player

2.  Willie costs less

3.  The trade with the Mets (Robbie for Ring) was terrible

 

Robbie has been going downhill for 2 years, and the slide won't stop in 2004, unless he retires.

I don't know how you can say Willie Harris is better. What has he shown you?

 

 

I'd love for Robbie to come back, I enjoyed him alot.

[quickman]

That is a really good point. Good call on that one. And quickman, I dont think KW see's anything special in Harris. I think he see's other holes on this team that needs to be filled, and knows we are going to have to be weak in some, based on the s*** payroll, and decieded 2b is going to be one of ppostions that will be weak.

"Willie's going to be a player, man," Williams said. "I know sometimes fans and people want a guarantee. We heard that when we brought up the kid with the funny name (Magglio Ordonez) and put him in right field.

 

Well, All I can say is he must be very high on this 200 hitter or else he was smokin crack when he made this statement.

 

Willie Harris cannot hit and has not proven anything. If he was that good then we would not have needed to go get alomar last year. Willie Harris is not castillo. Guillen thinks he can help Harris become a better bunter. So what. He is not going to bunt on every at bat. Sooner or later he needs to hit and field. Right now this team has a legit chance to win the division. Willie Harris is not getting you there. We are in trouble if this guy is the guy of the future. We have nobody in the minors worth a s*** that can play second. This is the same dilemna we had when we kicked Ventura out. We didn't have a third baseman for years. Same is happening here. We kicked Durham out then Alomar.Its a bad move for a million dollars.

[Jim Fainter]

Uh, speed, lot's of it. The mother f***er hit close to .400 in AAA. Had a bad month with the Sox, started playing very well in the 2-3 weeks before the Alomar/Mets rip-off, played well again in the last 1-2 weeks of the season. The kid can play. Lot's of teams would love to have him, but you would rather have Robbie at second, because you enjoyed him a lot. That's a pretty impressive analysis you made. You enjoyed him a lot, whatever that means.

 

Offensively, Robbie is weak, can't run, he has decreased range, and is just going to get worse. All he can do is turn the double play.

[Bighurt52235]

Uh, speed, lot's of it.  The mother f***er hit close to .400 in AAA.  Had a bad month with the Sox, started playing very well in the 2-3 weeks before the Alomar/Mets rip-off, played well again in the last 1-2 weeks of the season.  The kid can play.  Lot's of teams would love to have him, but you would rather have Robbie at second, because you enjoyed him a lot.  That's a pretty impressive analysis you made.  You enjoyed him a lot, whatever that means.

 

Offensively, Robbie is weak, can't run, he has decreased range, and is just going to get worse.  All he can do is turn the double play.

Robbie is much better defensively. Willie's speed is great, but you need to get on base to use it.

 

 

 

I was just pointing out that I enjoyed watching him play for us. That is all. It doen't mean anything more than that.

[quickman]

Robbie is much better defensively.  Willie's speed is great, but you need to get on base to use it. 

 

 

 

    I was just pointing out that I enjoyed watching him play for us.  That is all.  It doen't mean anything more than that.

Actually I enjoyed watching him play too.

[FUCKREINSDORF]

I guess I read this completely different than everyone else because to me it sounded like Ol Kenny was running the scam on Robbie, just like he has on so many of our other players.  KW is a conartist plain and simple.

Let's get one thing straight;the con artist is NOT Lenny Billiams.It's my name sake,the man who gives good business people bad names;

REINSDORF!!!

 

Roberto Alomar is not the Roberto Alomar of 1992-93,just as "the big hurt" is not the same player he was in 1992-93.Both of them were deadly hitters at that time.If you were the opposition and the game was on the line,you wanted nothing to do with either of them.Alomar beat the Sox at SkyDome so many times,I lost track.

Having said that,I,like many other posters,feel Alomar's so called R-E-S-P-E-C-T translates into M-O-N-E-Y.

And he won't get that here.Not as long as the Cheap Chairman continues to think a $60,000,000.00 payroll is reality.

I feel Alomar is over rated at this point anyway.Not that i'm enamored with Willie Harris,but there are other options out there.

 

At least I know why my $20.00 weekend season tickets now cost $25.00 (30 for the sCrUBS series):

It's All About The Benjies!!!

[quickman]

Uh, speed, lot's of it.  The mother f***er hit close to .400 in AAA.  Had a bad month with the Sox, started playing very well in the 2-3 weeks before the Alomar/Mets rip-off, played well again in the last 1-2 weeks of the season.  The kid can play.  Lot's of teams would love to have him, but you would rather have Robbie at second, because you enjoyed him a lot.  That's a pretty impressive analysis you made.  You enjoyed him a lot, whatever that means.

 

Offensively, Robbie is weak, can't run, he has decreased range, and is just going to get worse.  All he can do is turn the double play.

I am not picking a fight because we will just disagree on this but which other teams would like to have him? Can we get a decent pitcher for him? I really don't think anyone is calling KW and saying I really want little Willie Harris unless they need someone to pinch run.

 

Disclaimer: I hope you are right for the Whotesox sake. I hope he is great. I just don't think he is much more than a fill in.

[forkit]

I love Robbie. I'd like to have him back at the right price. But this rings of Robbie's agent being told by Robbie that he had agreed verbally to a one year agreement and then the agent told him to back off--he could get him more.

 

I think when all the available players are out there--today or tomorrow--Robbie's gonna wish he had taken the $3 mill and been happy. Remember his statement about, "This isn't about money. I'm basically set for money now. I want to play somewhere that likes me, where we can win..."

 

And of course, in the end it was about money. His ego and his agent just had to try to squeeze for more. He might even have gotten more if he would have just waited quietly until KW makes a mjor move or two. But instead he had to head to the newspapers and get his word out about "respect."

 

This is a declining salary market, especially for aging vets.

 

I like Robbie. I wish he had thought about it before opening his mouth.

 

Forkit!

[Chisoxfn]

Good Riddance Robbie. He was over-rated in his stint here and KW's offer was more then fair. Two mill is about exactly what I felt he was worth, although they probalby should of just given him 2 mill up front, screw deferring it. Its just gonna mean next year and years down the road they are paying it and JR will use that deferred money as an excuse for why he can't spend it then.

 

I'd much rather have someone with a future like Willie Harris then watch Alomar be mediocre.