Chisoxfn Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 This would be dependient on him promising to decline the arbitration. They were considering doing this for Roberto Alomar, but no don't consider it a possibility because the two sides have come apart. Like I've said all along, I think Williams wouldn't mind moving Magglio and Carlos Lee to free up room for pitching as well as bring a leadoff guy and another pitcher or two and some prospects in return and more importantly payroll relief which will allow him to bring in some patchwork guys..ie Carl Everett, Juan Gonzalez, Brian Daubach, whomever and then he has money to add relievers, get pitchers, and take advantage of picking up someone elses salary dump for a change. I wouldn't be shocked to see Jose, Magglio, Carlos, Paulie, and Koch all gone. I know it seems far fetched, but I just think Kenny has this idea in his head to put together a stellar pitching staff, and then mix his youngsters with some scrappy vets that can still play and go with that as his lineup. I think after the dissapointment of last season, he's decided to go a whole new way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 If the Sox offered Everett arbitration, he would probably get about $8 million or thereabouts. Is he worth that? I don't know, since I'm not an agent. However, this is a "depressed market" according to ESPN, Sporting News, Sports Illustrated, etc., so who knows. I would love to have him back, but I'm not holding my breath one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 7, 2003 Author Share Posted December 7, 2003 If the Sox offered Everett arbitration, he would probably get about $8 million or thereabouts. Is he worth that? I don't know, since I'm not an agent. However, this is a "depressed market" according to ESPN, Sporting News, Sports Illustrated, etc., so who knows. I would love to have him back, but I'm not holding my breath one way or another. Supposedly, they would offer it, with him promising to decline it. Seems risky, but it was what they were planning to do with Roberto, until the brad press came out yesterday and today. Seems like a good idea. I wonder if that happens a lot, my guess is it does. This way the Sox still have time to negotiate and Everett can go other places. The problem is, Everett now has suitors worrying about losing a draft pick since he's a type A free agent or at least I think he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I really liked what he brought to the clubhouse. He was a great teammate, a great spokesperson for the team, and a decent player. His intangibles are great, but clubs don't pay for that stuff, they pay for "numbers." So, his 10 HR, 37 RBI's, and intangibles in 2 months as a Sox player mean nothing to the powers that be, I guess. The problem is not just that we have very little money to spend - it's that we spend our little money very POORLY. 8 million to Konerko is the biggest joke since "Why did the chicken cross the road?" And neither is funny or even remotely amusing. Kenny f*cked that up, much as he has done on MANY levels of many things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 7, 2003 Author Share Posted December 7, 2003 I really liked what he brought to the clubhouse. He was a great teammate, a great spokesperson for the team, and a decent player. His intangibles are great, but clubs don't pay for that stuff, they pay for "numbers." So, his 10 HR, 37 RBI's, and intangibles in 2 months as a Sox player mean nothing to the powers that be, I guess. The problem is not just that we have very little money to spend - it's that we spend our little money very POORLY. 8 million to Konerko is the biggest joke since "Why did the chicken cross the road?" And neither is funny or even remotely amusing. Kenny f*cked that up, much as he has done on MANY levels of many things. I couldn't agree more. This team has mismanaged their money, but so has pretty much every team in the majors over the past 10 years or so. The amounts of money the owners/gm's kept giving was ridiculous and it drove the market up and up and up. Now its finally coming down and the good teams will be the ones that unload their salaries on other teams (If you can, dump them on the Yanks and BoSox) and then go out and spend their money in this downturn market on players just as capable for less money. A team can win with a 60 mill payroll...I firmly believe that, but it can't make many mistakes and it definately can't have big bucks tied up to such few players, especially when the one guy that could of won the Cy Young...didn't even make that much. Fact is you can't be spending the money the Sox are on offense, they need to be makinga trasnisition and spending it on pitching. I think Kenny sees things this way and that will happen, although a lot of the blame for the crappy salaries goes to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 We need Carl back. The core of what we have been doing (Frank, Kong, Mags, CLee, and Jose) has not worked. Go in a new direction. We need Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 7, 2003 Author Share Posted December 7, 2003 One other thing a team with a smaller payroll can't do, is they can't get attached to players. Sometimes you have to make moves for financial reasons and by doing so you may already have depth in that area with another guy that can step in or can pick up another guy that can do an admireable job and improve another area as well. Beane doesn't get attached. I am not the biggest Beane guy and I don't worship the ground he walks on, but one thing he's not afraid to do is move guys. He realizes its a business and its a game and he can't keep a guy just because he's a fan favorite. Sure it will piss off the fans, but whne the team wins because of the trade, they will quickly forget, imo. As long as their is logic behind the moves...now if its trading Vazquez for Nick Johnson cause your just too cheap to give him the money and you are hosed because MLB is running you, then thats another story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 3rd largest city in the United States - 24th lowest payroll. Can anyone else see a flaw with this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 Here's the article Jason was talkin bout. Also says KW's gonna offa Sully arbitration. While some teams will be wrestling with difficult decisions Sunday, the White Sox should have easy choices on baseball's arbitration deadline. They surely will offer arbitration to Bartolo Colon, whom they would welcome back either for one year or on a mutliyear deal. If Colon signs with another team, as expected, the Sox would receive a top draft pick from the team that signs him plus a "sandwich" pick between the first and second rounds. The Sox already are slated to get two extra picks because the Yankees agreed to terms with Tom Gordon on a reported two-year deal. The Sox also figure to offer arbitration to reliever Scott Sullivan, who posted a 3.77 ERA in 15 games on the South Side after an Aug. 21 trade from the Reds. Sources say Sox general manager Ken Williams has been negotiating with Sullivan's agent, John Courtright, on a multiyear contract. The 33-year-old Sullivan, who could step into the role Gordon vacates, made $2.8 million last season. Sullivan is a Type B free agent, so if the Sox offer arbitration and he signs elsewhere, Chicago would receive only one draft pick as compensation. Like Colon, Gordon and Carl Everett, Roberto Alomar is a Type A free agent. Before the Sox lowered their one-year offer to him Friday—from $3 million (including $2 million deferred without interest) to $2 million (including $1 million deferred without interest)—the sides had discussed another alternative. If the Sox offered Alomar arbitration and he promised to decline it, the sides could continue negotiating until Jan. 8. Barring a last-minute reconciliation, however, that no longer appears possible. Alomar said Friday that "you want to be play where they give you the respect you're looking for." That scenario, however, could unfold with Everett. Williams would love to find a way to re-sign the 32-year-old center fielder, who hit .301 in 73 games with the Sox last season and brings an intensity the teams needs. But the Sox can't afford to arbitrate with Everett, who was paid $9.15 million last season. An extra month would give Everett time to test the market, but he would be less attractive to other teams because they would have to surrender a draft pick to sign him. Tony Graffanino, the last of the Sox's free agents, is expected to sign a two-year deal with either Boston or Tampa Bay. The Cubs also are interested in him. He's an unrated free agent, meaning even if the Sox offer arbitration and he goes elsewhere, they would get nothing in return. Because of the 11 p.m. Sunday arbitration deadline, the Sox won't announce their decisions until Monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I can almost hear the negotiations now ...... Kenny - "Well, Scott, we want you back. That's why I want to offer you this lucrative offer. I'll pay you 3 million a year. However, I can only offer you a $20 dollar bill for next season. I'll defer all the other money to you until you're 160 years old. After all, we're poor and can't afford but the table scraps of free agents." Scott - "Are you really this stupid, or are you just high on crack?" Kenny - "I don't use crack. I smoke skunkweed, since it's the cheapest. I love the cheapest of everything." Scott - "That's why you want to sign Dave Steib again, isn't it? Kenny - "Oh, I'm sorry, I'm eating 15 White Castles right now and don't know why I'm so hungry." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I really liked what he brought to the clubhouse. He was a great teammate, a great spokesperson for the team, and a decent player. His intangibles are great, but clubs don't pay for that stuff, they pay for "numbers." So, his 10 HR, 37 RBI's, and intangibles in 2 months as a Sox player mean nothing to the powers that be, I guess. The problem is not just that we have very little money to spend - it's that we spend our little money very POORLY. 8 million to Konerko is the biggest joke since "Why did the chicken cross the road?" And neither is funny or even remotely amusing. Kenny f*cked that up, much as he has done on MANY levels of many things. Past, I don't get you sometimes..... You liked Carl and his intangibles and think he may be worth $8 mil or so, yet think Konerko, who in my mind anyway, has equally as good of intangibles, sucks and doesn't deserve half of his money. Well while Everett was with the Sox last year, Konerko outplayed him, or at the least was equal to him. Neither is stellar on defense and both are said to be hard workers and have a solid effect on the clubhouse..... Yet, Konerko hit .280 with 15 HR and 48 RBI while Everett hit .301 with 10 and 41 RBI. Sounds like to me they were practically the same player. So if giving $8 million to Konerko is a joke, then it must be the same to give it to Everett? Personally, I like Konerko to have a better season this year than Carl. Write it down, it will happen. Carl is a .280 18 HR 65 RBI guy in most seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I agree with you Rex. Konerko will outperform Everett this season barring injury. Book it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I agree with you Rex. Konerko will outperform Everett this season barring injury. Book it. In what Double Plays? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 In what Double Plays? How about OPS? I think that would be a fair measure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 How about OPS? I think that would be a fair measure. No I agree I tink Konerko will outperform Everett only because Everett's skills r startin to decline a little as he's what 32, 33 years old now? I think Konerko will have a 2002 type of year, but if he gets traded to the Dodgers, his numbers will decrease as that ain't a hitter's park like US Cell is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 No I agree I tink Konerko will outperform Everett only because Everett's skills r startin to decline a little as he's what 32, 33 years old now? I think Konerko will have a 2002 type of year, but if he gets traded to the Dodgers, his numbers will decrease as that ain't a hitter's park like US Cell is. Everett isn't "starting to decline". To "start to decline" you have to have maintained a certain level and Everett has never done that. He has had three good seasons (including 2003) and a bunch of mediocre ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Fainter Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 I remember one post game interview when he loudly announced that he "doesn't need Viagra." Even Hawk didn't know what to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 Everett isn't "starting to decline". To "start to decline" you have to have maintained a certain level and Everett has never done that. He has had three good seasons (including 2003) and a bunch of mediocre ones. Thank you, finally someone got it right: 1. Everett is a mediocre baserunner. 2. Everett is a BAD defensive CF, and unlike an infield position where an error often results in an infield single, in out three a misjudged flyball can easily result in a triple or even inside-the-parker. 3. Only average #4-5 hitter. Yes, he had a torridfirst 6 weeks of the season in 2003. Yes, he was good in that one season with Boston 3 years ago. But the Everett I saw in our uniform was a solid if unspectacular GUESS hitter- throw him agood curve or a change, and he'll miss it by a foot. At 3-4 Mill, Evrett would be welcome to play LF on my team. At Alomst 10 Mill? No.thank.you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubleM23 Posted December 7, 2003 Share Posted December 7, 2003 Hopefully they do so all the babies that whined about Webster and Rupe will shut up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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