greasywheels121 Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 There's a news conference on ESPN News.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 I've always liked Drew. Its a good deal if the Braves don't give up much, because there are a lot of health risks in getting JD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 13, 2003 Author Share Posted December 13, 2003 The Braves made out pretty well on this. They just traded away Marquis and King.....This trade can only help, not hurt them.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Good trade for both teams. STL needed pitching and they got some. ATL needed an OF'er to replace Sheff, and they got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 13, 2003 Author Share Posted December 13, 2003 Braves add bat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 According to rotoworld.com the Braves also gave up Wainwright. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 According to rotoworld.com the Braves also gave up Wainwright. I heard Jason Marquis name on the radio. If they gave up Marquis and Wainwright then I think St. Louis did a hell of a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDsDirtySox Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Cardinals traded Eli Marrero too. wow this is a big deal in my eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDsDirtySox Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Cardinals Trade: of JD Drew of Eli Marrero Braves Trade: p Jason Marquis p Adam Waingwright p Ray King This is a huge deal for both clubs. ATL adds drew in right, and Eli can pla OF or a little C. STL gets Marquis a young decent arm with ML experience, King an experienced reliever, and Waingwright, The Braves Top Pitching Prospect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hex Rudler Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Braves get rid of one Boros client (Maddox) and get another (Drew). Drew hould do well there if his wheels are okay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Godfather Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Even better news though is that it takes away another trade partner for the Dodgers. Raising our chances of pulling off the Kong for Perez deal. Surprised nobody has thought of it from that aspect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 The nice thing for Atlanta is that they get Drew AND the guy who replaces him every time he gets injured!!! If St. Louis can grab Maddux now, their rotation is much stronger. Never a big fan of Ray "Burger" King, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 The question is was that a Maggs deal? We can probably do little better than Marquis as a starter, but do we get a steady reliever and a #1 pitching prospect to boot? Either answer, we can scratch Atlanta of the list for Maggs suitors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Drew is not even in the same league as Maggs. Drew compares at best to Konerko and Lee, hes had slightly better obp, avg, and ops, but Drew has been injury prone and probably is less valuable then Lee right now. Maggs is way more valuable, if we trade him we will get major league talent. SB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 What I think upnorth is saying is that basically the Cards made a salary dump for young pitching and were able to get a top pitching prospect and pretty good one as well as a quality left handed reliever. Compare that to Magglio, who is a superior player to Drew, although slated to make a bit more, but you should expect that they could do a similar type of deal getting more talent. Although I prefer a Maggs for Soriano swap if at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Drew is not even in the same league as Maggs. Drew compares at best to Konerko and Lee, hes had slightly better obp, avg, and ops, but Drew has been injury prone and probably is less valuable then Lee right now. Maggs is way more valuable, if we trade him we will get major league talent. SB Don't bet on it, if Maggs was such the hot commodity he'd be the talk of the winter meetings, which he's not. That $14 mil in his walk yr turns off most everyone, we may have to settle for Garcia or Washburn\Ortiz straight up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Not sure why this would make a Kong\Perez trade any more likely, as like the Juan E trade would make it any less. IMO y'all holding out for that deal to go down are having as big a pipe dream as me holding out for a Maddux signing. But hey nothing wrong toking on a pipe from time to time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbaho-WG Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Pretty even for both teams, with St. Louis taking the edge for obtaining Wainwright. Marquis seems like a AAAA player and his K/IP have gone way down since he first came up with the Braves. King is a good lefty reliever, and Marrero should be an ultra utility player, and maybe the starting catcher if Jonny Estrada doesn't pan out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 From what I have read every team has inquired about Maggs, just the asking price has been to high. Rumors have ranged from Maggs for Nomar, to Maggs for Gibbons, etc, but it has been all speculation. The White Sox seem to have the money to not have to dump players, and therefore if they are trading it is most likely going to be for talent in return. If no one wants Maggs then we keep him, trade him at the all-star break, or keep try and resign and get 1st round draft pick. Maggs: 162 615 101 189 40 2 30 114 54 70 14 6 .307 .365 .527 .892 Drew: 162 515 96 145 23 5 26 76 74 112 16 5 .282 .377 .498 .875 Lee: 162 610 96 173 35 2 27 101 45 92 12 5 .284 .334 .480 .814 These are based on 5 year averages. Not once has Drew even gotten more than 75 rbi. The trade of Drew is based on what Atlanta hopes he could produce if he played 162 games, he would be better than Lee but worse than Maggs. The problem is Drew has never played a full season, never had over 450 abs, and only once has posted a batting average over 300. Maggs will command alot more than Drew, eventhough Maggs makes more, just because Maggs is a proven and is could be an MVP candidate. Drew is just potential. SB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 my fear is that it removes the Cardinals from the Jeff Weaver sweepstakes, meaning the Dodgers will try to dump him on the White Sox. Beware!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 What I think upnorth is saying is that basically the Cards made a salary dump for young pitching and were able to get a top pitching prospect and pretty good one as well as a quality left handed reliever. Compare that to Magglio, who is a superior player to Drew, although slated to make a bit more, but you should expect that they could do a similar type of deal getting more talent. Although I prefer a Maggs for Soriano swap if at all possible. Right CSF, with that trade you could've gotten your 5th starter plus with King in the pen you could then easily non-tender Schoney which along with Maggs salary frees up about $13 mil of payroll. That gives you $8-10 mil to either go after Maddux, or Garcia plus another BP arm\OFer. On top of that you get a young stud for late '04 or '05. The question I had is was that offered to KW for Maggs and did he turn it down holding out for more? I would also probably prefer Maggs for Soriano but while that would clear about the same amount of payroll, you'd still probably turn around and trade him for more pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hex Rudler Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 If we are trading Maggs, the best move would be to trade him in July. Not only could we get more in terms of top quality prospects, but there is always the slight chance that we will be in the playoff hunt, in which case we would not want to trade him at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Don't bet on it, if Maggs was such the hot commodity he'd be the talk of the winter meetings, which he's not. That $14 mil in his walk yr turns off most everyone, we may have to settle for Garcia or Washburn\Ortiz straight up. A trade that might be interesting would be Maggs to Seattle for Garcia, either Winn/Guillen, and a prospect. I think that is a relatively fair deal for both sides and addresses both teams weaknesses by trading from their strengths. The M's do this trade because they get a big bat in the middle of the order and do it while only adding 3-4M to their payroll. They can afford to lose Garcia since they have an ace in the waiting, Soriano, ready to take his spot in the rotation. They can also afford to give up either Winn or Guillen, and it would help balance the salaries. They still might have enough money to stay in the Tejada sweepstakes as well. The Sox do this trade because it gives them a solid starting pitcher who has shown the ability to be a front of the rotation starter. They also get a CF/2B that can leadoff for them. They cut about 3-4M off the payroll, and they also get a good prospect. I think it could work, and reports say that the Sox have really looked hard at Garcia over the past week. Another possibility is Baltimore. A trade of Maggs for Gibbons and 1 of the following Hairston/Mora/Roberts would also be interesting. This would only become a possibility if Baltimore loses out on the Guerrero sweepstakes. The Sox would get Gibbons, who I think is prime for a breakout year after looking at his minor league numbers, to replace Maggs and give them a lefty bat, and they get a 2B who can leadoff(my guess is they would be most willing to give up Hairston). The key is that the Sox would save about 10-12M, which is one of the reasons why Baltimore might not be willing to do the trade, and with that money the Sox can go and get Ponson for about 7M/yr and still save 3-5M. Another possibility is Anaheim. A trade of Maggs for Washburn and MAYBE Kennedy would be nice. Washburn straight up would give the Sox a good starter and about 10M to address the other weaknesses(2B, replacement for Maggs, RP), and getting Kennedy as part of the deal would address one of those weaknesses while still giving the Sox around 7M to address the other two problems. Unfortunately, I think the Sox have little choice but to deal Maggs. A mid-small payroll team can't afford to have over 20% of the total payroll taken by one player. Maggs would probably also net the Sox something decent in return, the more salary they take on to balance the more they get talent wise. There are a couple of possibilities above that would help the Sox. Lets hope KW takes his time, evaluates his situation, and makes a few smart moves(hopefully one of the above is one of them). In regards to the Atlanta-St Loius trade. I was thinking about how the Sox could have probably gotten a similar package from the Braves for Lee, I doubt the Braves would take almost all of Maggs salary on by offering a similar package. Lee and Drew are very similar. I would have loved to see the Sox get their hands on Wainwright, because from what I have seen/heard about him, he has a chance to be a true ace in the future. Oh well, I guess we will have to wait impatiently for the Sox to make a move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 If we are trading Maggs, the best move would be to trade him in July. Not only could we get more in terms of top quality prospects, but there is always the slight chance that we will be in the playoff hunt, in which case we would not want to trade him at all. I don't understand why you think they would get more if they waited. Why would a team give up more for a player when they are going to only have him for 1/3rd of the season opposed to a full year? If you look at the history of trade deadline deals, than you will notice that they don't net more trade value. Furthermore, there was a very interesting article on ESPN that showed that very few of the prospects traded at the deadline ever amount to anything(that could probably be said about most trades involving prospects though). So why not trade Maggs for a package of Garcia, Winn/Guillen, and maybe a prospect? That will probably be a better deal then any offer the Sox will get come the trade deadline, and it helps the Sox fill a couple of holes while saving some money. Furthermore, I calculated the payroll as of right now(adding in the likely amount that players would get for arbitration) and came up with a current payroll of roughly 63-65M. Thats about 5-7M over the likely payroll for 2004, so the fact remains that the Sox might not have the option of keeping Maggs until the trade deadline next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 In regards to the Atlanta-St Loius trade. I was thinking about how the Sox could have probably gotten a similar package from the Braves for Lee, I doubt the Braves would take almost all of Maggs salary on by offering a similar package. Interesting, then you believe the deal was never offered to KW? I'm under the same impression as this deal would've worked for the Sox at so many levels that it woulda been impossible for KW to dismiss it so quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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