LowerCaseRepublican Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Not to say much, but people act as if this happenned only in Florida. These stories could of been pulled up all over the place. The entire thing was bogus in my book. My grandpa, god bless him, was constantly pestered by Democrats in the leisure world he worked at. He said he knew people who would basically be forced to vote democrat at other senior citizens areas. I don't know how true it is, but these type of games have been going on for so long, don't even act as if its all republicans doing this and like I said earlier I don't buy into the crap that there was this huge conspiracy to let Bush win and that they were closing the polls early and that the ballots were really screwed up. If someone was dumb enough to screw up their ballot, thats there problem. I voted with the same butterfly ballot and never had a problem with it. What happened in Florida wasn't so much chads but more the removal of over 57,700 legal voters from the voter rolls. According to DBT Choicepoint [the company commissioned by Katherine Harris...who oddly enough had a conflict of interest being a local Bush organizer for the state and also holding her job in the government] and e-mails/calls from Harris said that they should not make sure that they have illegal people. There were people on the banned from voting list for things such as: FELONY COMMITTED ON JAN. 6, 2007. Choicepoint was also ordered by Harris to add people to the list with similar last names, first names, birthdays, social security numbers etc. without any fact that they were actually a felon. Choicepoint is covering their own ass in this since they are getting sued because the list, when read is 95% wrong. 95%!!! I'm not even counting the voters that were felons and got their voting rights back after serving their time [iL is such a state that does that] and Jeb Bush blocking their right to vote saying they had to get permission from him [which they do not have to do...and courts have told Jeb on 3 different occassions that he is violating peoples civil liberties] Bush wins by less than 600 votes...let's add in 60,000+ Democrats and whammo...we got Gore winning the Florida electoral votes and taking the Presidency. And oddly enough, it was the BBC, the news our our ally that broke that story and damn near every international media source ran with it after Choicepoint started speaking out and the memos started coming up from Katherine Harris and people got their hands on the banned list of voters that were legal [and the legal voters coming out showing their records were clean] I'm not gonna say that the Dems are lily white in voting but this mass removal is just sickening and the antithesis to democracy. And oh yeah, when Harris's #1 aide was asked about the 57,700+ voters removed...his response was to run into his office, live during a BBC interview, lock the door and not come out. Seems like somebody has just a little bit to hide. See IlliniBob, that's why others...Greens, Libertarians, Democrats and a lot of Republicans I know are angry about Florida that there was mass voter fraud. Cuz a lot of Republicans I talk to [got some friends in the Republicans/Libertarians since we work a lot against the drug war together] are very worried about voter fraud cuz it could have been their candidate getting screwed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 I agree that voter fraud is a major concern. But I think it pretty much washes out because I think both sides commit it so badly. The problem is, almost everyone involved is so bias and these people let their bias intervene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 apu...you need to check murder laws in texas..first..the governor can not commute a sentence..he can only delay it 30 days and request a review from a review board(i forget the name)..also , texas does not have life w/o parole option to juries...so any convicted murderer that doesnt get the death penalty stands a good chance of returning to the streets someday...a major reason why so many are on death row there maybe you should use your energies to go after the texas legislature instead??..b Baggs, there is the advisory board over which the governor holds a LOT of sway into what decision. It's a scary thing when the advisory board doesn't even meet, they simply phone in their decision. He technically could act independently of the decision made by the advisory board as well by simply rejecting their finding if the guy was innocent [or vice versa] I mean, look at the case of Henry Lee Lucas to see how much sway the governor has over the advising board and what they decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 I agree that voter fraud is a major concern. But I think it pretty much washes out because I think both sides commit it so badly. The problem is, almost everyone involved is so bias and these people let their bias intervene. But the Florida situation was as systematic as it was insidious, invloving the Governor/Brother and his immediate underlings in issues that were obviously conflicts of interest. I defy you or anyone to find another voter fraud case involving people at the top level of elected government that disenfranchised this number of legitimate voters. As Apu pointed out, Jeb has a history of going to teh State Supreme court and being repeatedly told he is violating citizens personal rights with his actions. The (persistent vegetative) Terri Schiavo story is the recent one to make national news. Not making national headlines is Jeb's trying to rewrite local history at the polls relative to an education bill. Florida voters approved a reduced class size amendment last year, and Jeb has busy trying to convince the courts to throw it out because our 'yes' vote must have meant 'no', he knows what the voters want more than the voters do, etc. As an aside, Jeb has also taken a cue from Big Bro in screwing the environment by yanking $1 billion in state funds promised for Everglades restoration over the next 30 years. It's part of $8 billion the state HAS to commit or it will likely lose the $40 billion in federal money the restoration will rquire. At the same time, Jeb is taking a powder and letting Big Sugar derail the first $1 billion project to get the restoration going. Everyone come see what's left of the Everglades (what's left of it) now, while you can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 That isn't unheard of either. Andrew Jackson won the popular vote in 1824, I believe, yet John Quincy Adams was elected president. I don't understand the bitterness about Bush's victory. Even after the Florida recount was completed after the fact, it was found thatBush won. Besides, how is it Bush's fault that these alleged Gore voters were too stupid to figure out a butterfly ballot. The same type of ballot used in Chicago and Illinois for years. Its very simple really. The left, in 2000, saw their last best chance to control America slip away with the demise of Gore and they are bitter. They are bitter because their man lost the election, bitter because more and more people reject their ideology every day, bitter because their current field of "candidates" worries about being seen as too liberal and bitter because all their infighting this primary season is going to make it that much easier for Bush to win again this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Voters in black precincts (sp?) reported they were being turned away from the polls LONG BEFORE the voting was done, and before any of teh other stuff came to light. Several black precincts also opened late and closed early for 'unknown reasons'. At the same time, outside of Florida, a bunch of incorrectly submitted or late-receipt military absentee ballats were allowed in the count. Finally, the Florida recount WAS NEVER completed before the Supreme Court came in to hand the keys to Baby George. Two newspapers spent private funds to pay for the recount to be completed, and even that was blocked successfully for a time. Florida was an inside job, Jeb's present to his big brother. The night of the election when the already celebrating George was on TV and saw closing returns giving Florida to Gore, he gave his really confused Curious George look and then ran out to call Jeb because he knew Florida was a done deal. You are so worried about black people being shut out of the vote, what about the media plastering it all over TV 3 and 4 hours before the polls closed that Gore had won the state. In a race as close as that why would you call the race that early? It was pointed out , by CNN of all people, that doing that kept a lot of folks in republican districts home. Why stop and vote on the way home from work if the election is already decided? You are so worried about Military ballots that were submitted late or not filled out correctly and counted but at the same time you cry and complain about gore votes that were lost due to the ballots not being punched right and you yell conspiracy theory when Pat Buchannan gets a bunch of votes that you think should have gone to Gore when some doofus punches the wrong place in the ballot. Please. You are a hypocrite. Why dont you get over what happened 3+ years ago and focus your attention on your lost cause of beating a much stronger Bush this time around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Its very simple really. The left, in 2000, saw their last best chance to control America slip away with the demise of Gore and they are bitter. They are bitter because their man lost the election, bitter because more and more people reject their ideology every day, bitter because their current field of "candidates" worries about being seen as too liberal and bitter because all their infighting this primary season is going to make it that much easier for Bush to win again this year. The biggest reason for them to be bitter was because Gore was essentially the encumbent and the economy at that point was still considered good (Although the recession had already begun). The fact that Bush won (if people want to argue this go ahead...I've said my case and am done) was essentially a slap in the face that despite the prosperity over the past 8 years that a, Gore wasn't a good enough candidate and b, the overwhole goals and views of the democratic party aren't very good. In fact, in my opinion, a lot of them are ridiculous in terms of business, taxes, and social services. I am not ripping democrats, soley many democratic politicians. It should be known I have nothing against Joseph Lieberman. In my book, he is the best candidate out there to represent the democratic party and I thought it was a travesty the way Gore treated him when he endorsed Dean. Lieberman stayed out of the race, saying if Gore runs, then I won't run. Then Gore makes a statement endorsing Dean and doesn't even have the courtsey to call Lieberman before the endorsing. Thats classless. All I can say is 4 more years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Um...go Moseley Braun?!?!? Jas, get on AIM if you have time.....I've got some hot gossip about Nuke.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 How about the LA times getting completely torn apart during the governor recall election. They were busted for making fraudelent polls that showed Davis numbers climbing in the hope that it would get more democrats on board to hold of the recall...which won by a landslide. What a freaking joke. You also got CNN. People call FoxNews conservative and it is a conservative stations, but it also has liberals on there. The only difference is, it doesn't spin off all this political garbage in their news reports. They definately get political in the shows, but shows are able to dissect the news anyway they want, the news reports shouldn't be bias and CNN and especially the LA times have shown great bias towards the democrats. In general, the media typically is more bias towards democrats. I know I've called the LA times on more then one ocassion and talked to their editor calling them out for some of their crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 I was surprised at how political Tom Harkin got today at the banquet I was at.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Lieberman stayed out of the race, saying if Gore runs, then I won't run. Then Gore makes a statement endorsing Dean and doesn't even have the courtsey to call Lieberman before the endorsing. Thats classless. All I can say is 4 more years It seems to me that the entire Democratic field is running on a HATE BUSH platform. They offer nothing in the way of alternatives to how things are being done presently, cant seem to stay on message (unless they are taking cheapshots at Bush or one another ) and waffle and backtrack when someone calls them on something they said (Dean is looking like a joke because of this). Running on a platform of "The other guy sucks so elect me" might be good for riling up the black vote (they cant even say hispanics are a lock anymore because Bush is getting a lot stronger among them) and the APU wing of the party but thats about it really. No way they win an election by sitting there like APU does and spewing forth hate speech against Bush for 9 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniBob72 Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 It goes sooo much deeper than that in Florida, and you either know that or you don't care to know it. That's pretty presumptuous (sp?) and insulting. How about choice C, I just didn't know. While I like to consider myself well-informed, I never heard all those things. The facts making the rounds on national media was a bunch of doofuses couldn't figure out a standard butterfly ballot, then Gore wanted a recount but only in the heavily Democratic counties, then lawsuits were filed, etc. I'm not going to defend voter fraud, but it does happen all the time. Believe me, I'm from Chicago! I actually had a precinct captain pick me up from work and drive me to the polling station on the condition I vote democratic. The democratic machine in Chicago is the most corrupt organization imaginable. JFK had Illinois gift-wrapped for him by Old Man Daley. It all needs to be cleaned up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 It seems to me that the entire Democratic field is running on a HATE BUSH platform. They offer nothing in the way of alternatives to how things are being done presently, cant seem to stay on message (unless they are taking cheapshots at Bush or one another ) and waffle and backtrack when someone calls them on something they said (Dean is looking like a joke because of this). Running on a platform of "The other guy sucks so elect me" might be good for riling up the black vote (they cant even say hispanics are a lock anymore because Bush is getting a lot stronger among them) and the APU wing of the party but thats about it really. No way they win an election by sitting there like APU does and spewing forth hate speech against Bush for 9 months. My theory is, let them hate, because it further alienates the voters. I know a lot of democrats that are absolutely disgusted by the way the party is handling things. Thats not to say they are turning republican, but I could see them doing it, in a few more years. And nuke, you hit it right on the money, they really don't have any alternatives. Their views constantly stay the same, while the republican party is molding their views much more to the current society (with exception to religion...well at least with certain candidates). But I do find it hillarious how much bickering goes on inside the democratic party. Speaking of Dean, I don't know who is worse, Dean or Clark. Clark was essentially laughd out of the military. I know that isn't considered very public, but I've heard some generals interviewed and the US military basically thinks of him as a blowhard and they basically ignore whatever he says. I'm not in on the meetings so I don't know, but I think both are jokes of candidates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 But I do find it hillarious how much bickering goes on inside the democratic party. Speaking of Dean, I don't know who is worse, Dean or Clark. Clark was essentially laughd out of the military. I know that isn't considered very public, but I've heard some generals interviewed and the US military basically thinks of him as a blowhard and they basically ignore whatever he says. I'm not in on the meetings so I don't know, but I think both are jokes of candidates. Clark ran his mouth so much to his peers and superiors that they got sick of him and forced him out. He wont even beat Dean let alone Bush with his attack ads. As for Dean, he is a joke. He says something, then 5 minutes later has to issue a clarification, then the next day he denies he ever said it or whines that he was quoted out of context. He stands for nothing other than hating Bush. BTW, if he thinks his fellow Democrats are giving him a hard time just wait till the Republicans get a hold of him. HAH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 That's pretty presumptuous (sp?) and insulting. How about choice C, I just didn't know. While I like to consider myself well-informed, I never hear... The statement was not intended to be personal or any kind of attack, i apologize if it came off that way. It was directed at a general "you" -- an audience of people who, bless 'em, think the current Administration is ok or cares the least bit about the average American. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Any1 see Kucinich on Letterman this week. If he keeps his face like that 90% of the time I'd vote for him too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 If they didn't have some idea/inclination that something was about to happen, then our 'intelligence' agencies were/are worthless. They weren't worthless, just the victims of 8 years of criminal neglect by the Clinton Administration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Yes, and we have such a beacon in our AWOL, cocaine addicted boozehound who, according to friends and bartenders, liked to get drunk, strip naked and dance when he was in the Texas Air National Guard. He is the biggest f*** up in the history of f*** ups. He's never done a thing right without f***ing it up. He got into private school because of his family name, not because of his personal abilities. The same way he got into Harvard and Yale. It's the same way that his score of almost "too dumb to fly" [if he scored one point lower on the exam, that would have been his status] and there are a lot of testimonials that there were a few hundred thousand people ahead of him in the wait list with higher scores but somehow W got in so he would never have to serve in country. Then after that, he ran every oil company he had into the ground...Arbusto, Hearken, etc. A little bit of questionable and possible insider trading saved him though and gave him money to get a share in the Texas Rangers. And hey, using the governor's "eminent domain" to get land for the new baseball stadium because he and the other investors didn't want to pay adequate price for said land? Yeah, just a bit illegal as a court has found and is making the investors pay the people back for that. And after that the team wallows in the basement of the division. Yet again, W f***s it up. When he became governor, in his race, he actually lied quite a lot in his campaign quite blatantly and was quite overtly in the pocket of various lobbies [i.e. oil and energy] Even his status as an evangelical Christian was a f*** up when Pat Robertson went on national TV and called him a "man without mercy" when W executed Karla Faye Tucker. And let's not forget his execution of the mentally retarded. That's real Christian. Hell, he f***ed up in 2000 when he didn't even win the election with the most votes. [And hey, Florida would have been won if Katherine Harris didn't remove 57,000+ LEGAL voters from the voter rolls that were almost all Democrats plus the questionable absentee ballots that were cast after Election Day and multiples for certain people being sent in and all counted for Bush] It just boggles my mind that anybody actually can't see through him and see the corporate arm up his ass making him their puppet for everything they want to do. Like Bill Hicks said about Reagan and how everybody revered him as St. Ronald of Reagan despite being a bloodthirsty terrorist supporting sickening evil man: "How far up your ass does his dick have to be to make you realize he's f***ing you?" /flame on! P.S. Bones_r and other Dems on this board: Is it just me or do the Dems need to have Clark on board as either getting the nod or becoming VP in order to get the more moderate voter? I mean, who are people going to want to protect them...a 4 star general with 34 years of training in national security or a coked up oil boy from Texas? Holy crap!!! Me and Apu FINALLY agree on something! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 My theory is, let them hate, because it further alienates the voters. I know a lot of democrats that are absolutely disgusted by the way the party is handling things. Thats not to say they are turning republican, but I could see them doing it, in a few more years. And nuke, you hit it right on the money, they really don't have any alternatives. Their views constantly stay the same, while the republican party is molding their views much more to the current society (with exception to religion...well at least with certain candidates). But I do find it hillarious how much bickering goes on inside the democratic party. Speaking of Dean, I don't know who is worse, Dean or Clark. Clark was essentially laughd out of the military. I know that isn't considered very public, but I've heard some generals interviewed and the US military basically thinks of him as a blowhard and they basically ignore whatever he says. I'm not in on the meetings so I don't know, but I think both are jokes of candidates. Don't misinterpret hate for justifiable outrage. They actually do have quite a few alternatives...if any person actually takes the time to read their positions on their specific campaign web pages. There is actually a lot of bickering among Republicans as well. Many traditional Republicans, not neo-cons, were and are actually against the PATRIOT Act and are looking for a full repeal. [i.e. Ron Paul, one of the few Republicans I agree with on certain issues] Take also the infighting going on about gay rights and the amendment saying "Marriage = one man + one woman". There are a lot of different conservatives fighting over that in their party. Every political party has infighting to an extent, it's not just something of the Democrats. A lot of their answers are essentially cleaning up Bush's messes in the environment, the destruction of civil liberties, etc. And Republicans are moving towards today's issues? Is that why Bush and Co. say there is no "global warming"? Or that we need to repeal the clean air laws? Oh I know, giving cops the ability to have subpoena power [a fun new aspect of PATRIOT II that they want to pass] Or using millions to create tactical nukes? Or bunker busting nukes? We haven't learned from the problems of depleted uranium? [read the work of weapons expert Doug Rokke on the subject] Please, I don't mind a little Dean bashing but for f***'s sake at least admit the shortfalls of your own candidate and don't act like his farts don't stink. The Republicans, and especially Bush and Rove have lots of skeletons in their closets and their policies are quite lacking and very poor and short sighted. Hell, I hate Dean cuz he supports NAFTA amongst other things and I agree...he can be quite the no-neck having waffler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Holy crap!!! Me and Apu FINALLY agree on something! Holy s***! I just got floored reading that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 They weren't worthless, just the victims of 8 years of criminal neglect by the Clinton Administration. Let's not forget Operation Ignore of Bush having a task force that never met, never read intelligence reports etc. But yeah, that had nothing to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Don't misinterpret hate for justifiable outrage. They actually do have quite a few alternatives...if any person actually takes the time to read their positions on their specific campaign web pages. There is actually a lot of bickering among Republicans as well. Many traditional Republicans, not neo-cons, were and are actually against the PATRIOT Act and are looking for a full repeal. [i.e. Ron Paul, one of the few Republicans I agree with on certain issues] Take also the infighting going on about gay rights and the amendment saying "Marriage = one man + one woman". There are a lot of different conservatives fighting over that in their party. Every political party has infighting to an extent, it's not just something of the Democrats. A lot of their answers are essentially cleaning up Bush's messes in the environment, the destruction of civil liberties, etc. And Republicans are moving towards today's issues? Is that why Bush and Co. say there is no "global warming"? Or that we need to repeal the clean air laws? Oh I know, giving cops the ability to have subpoena power [a fun new aspect of PATRIOT II that they want to pass] Or using millions to create tactical nukes? Or bunker busting nukes? We haven't learned from the problems of depleted uranium? [read the work of weapons expert Doug Rokke on the subject] Please, I don't mind a little Dean bashing but for f***'s sake at least admit the shortfalls of your own candidate and don't act like his farts don't stink. The Republicans, and especially Bush and Rove have lots of skeletons in their closets and their policies are quite lacking and very poor and short sighted. Hell, I hate Dean cuz he supports NAFTA amongst other things and I agree...he can be quite the no-neck having waffler. There are some issues with Bush among Republicans but you never hear about it because its not that big a deal. Contrary to your assertions I do not agree with every last little thing Bush has done or wants to do. I think the Mars mission if its for real is a total waste of money & the immigration deal he's talking about stinks to high heaven The Democrats, on the other hand, look like they have a full blown war going on inside their party the way this primary campaign is going. Dean is going to need a lot more than a few "clarifying statements" if he expects to get anywhere and Clark is coming off like a blow hard with an attitude problem. Nobody else except for Gephardt and Kerry are really relevant and they are nothing but a couple of democratic hacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Let's not forget Operation Ignore of Bush having a task force that never met, never read intelligence reports etc. But yeah, that had nothing to do with it. How can you compare a single proposal that didnt get off the ground to 8 years of funding cuts & onerous rules. But why should you care. You think the CIA and FBI are evil organizations to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Please. You are a hypocrite. Why dont you get over what happened 3+ years ago and focus your attention on your lost cause of beating a much stronger Bush this time around. I reread my post, Nuke, and was hard-pressed to find the hypocrasy (Nor did I make any comments about Buchannan or the dangling chads - in that issue I agree people are stupid and that's that). There is no hypocrasy when I bristle at many thousands of legitimate voters being systematically and knowingly excluded from teh voter rolls, while at the same time, late-filed and incorrectly filed absentee ballots were allowed. Gore and Bush both wanted those ballots in, even though Gore knew the overseas military vote woudlk swing for Bush, so there was no duplicity there in trying to keep those incorectly cast votes out. The same cannot be said about what happened in Florida. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 I reread my post, Nuke, and was hard-pressed to find the hypocrasy (Nor did I make any comments about Buchannan or the dangling chads - in that issue I agree people are stupid and that's that). There is no hypocrasy when I bristle at many thousands of legitimate voters being systematically and knowingly excluded from teh voter rolls, while at the same time, late-filed and incorrectly filed absentee ballots were allowed. Gore and Bush both wanted those ballots in, even though Gore knew the overseas military vote woudlk swing for Bush, so there was no duplicity there in trying to keep those incorectly cast votes out. The same cannot be said about what happened in Florida. Well since you decided to selectively quote me I'll just add in something you missed, or ignored. You are so worried about black people being shut out of the vote, what about the media plastering it all over TV 3 and 4 hours before the polls closed that Gore had won the state. In a race as close as that why would you call the race that early? It was pointed out , by CNN of all people, that doing that kept a lot of folks in republican districts home. Why stop and vote on the way home from work if the election is already decided? Dont tell me that there wasn't funny business on both sides of the issue here. Like Gore wanting a recount, but only in a handful of heavily Democratic counties instead of statewide. That wont be a problem this time around because Bush is going to win big in '04. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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