DonkeyKongerko Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 From http://news.indiainfo.com/2004/01/05/0501outsource.html 'Shift of 6 million jobs to India cannot be stopped' Monday, January 5 2004 18:35 Hrs (IST) New York: India is likely to benefit from the exodus of high tech jobs from North America as over 6 million jobs are expected to shift overseas in a decade. "In the next decade, as many as six million jobs might be sent to India and other nations by US Companies in search of lower costs and a tech-savvy, English-speaking workforce," Goldman Sachs Group Inc said in a recent report. "The shift of North American technology jobs to low-wage countries like India cannot be stopped because not only are Indian Companies a third of the cost, but they actually are better," said Pradeep Sood, president of Indo-Canada Chamber of Commerce. Indian workers earn as little as one-tenth of their North American counterparts, and India produces 67 per cent more engineers and computer scientists each year than the US, said Sood, suggesting that India should take full advantage of its low salaries and skilled work force. A number of multinational corporations like Microsoft, Intel, Accenture Ltd and GM Motors have already started taking advantage of cheaper costs in India. Microsoft, which employs 250 workers in India, is on track to double its workforce to 500 by 2005. Intel, the global chip giant, has invested $ 20 million in an Indian customer service centre of Satyam Computer Services Ltd, one of the biggest software makers in the country. Intel employs about 1,000 people in India and has its largest non-US chip design centre in Bangalore. Accenture Ltd, which manages business computer systems for clients including AT&T company, plans to double its workforce in India to as many as 10,000 by the end of this year. General Motors Corporation, the world's well-known auto-maker, plans to hire 100 researchers in Bangalore to develop lightweight material and conduct crash tests, according to economic experts in Toronto. PTI I am currently a Computer Science major at the University of Illinois. An alarming trend in the industry is the massive outsourcing of jobs to foreigners, primarily Indians. As someone who will be entering this field as a prospective employee in another year or so, it worries me how quickly these jobs are being snatched up. In the beginning, American companies like Hewlett Packard and Intel actually brought Indians to this country to educate them on H1B visas. Now Indians are being employed in call centers and other factories overseas taking countless jobs away from American employees. These people in India work for a fraction of the salary of Americans and usually have earned Masters degrees in two or three years. Morally, I am torn between calling for government restrictions to outsourcing and allowing this to continue unhindered. As a costcutting move, this makes sense for all the corporations but where do we draw a line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 tarriffs...if companies go overseas for cheaper labors tax their goods coming back into the states making it less advantagous..we still are the number one consumers of crap in the world...lets make it work for something im sure india would then tax our good going into their country but in the long run who is gonna win on that deal??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 "The shift of North American technology jobs to low-wage countries like India cannot be stopped because not only are Indian Companies a third of the cost, but they actually are better," said Pradeep Sood, president of Indo-Canada Chamber of Commerce. "and India is actually better", says India. k, thx India isn't producing better tech workers, but they're producing adequate ones who can work for 1/4 the cost. Only the Jesuses and Pavels of Computer Science can compete with that. WE ARE THE f***ED Of course, by f***ing over the people who buy the most tech products to begin with, maybe they'll hurt themselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 In the beginning, American companies like Hewlett Packard and Intel actually brought Indians to this country to educate them on H1B visas. Well we don't want foreigners here. It's a global economy and US companies are everywhere. How many countries do not have a McDonalds? Outsourcing has been a 25 year trend. We just do not notice it until it effects us. How many people will complain about this, then download some tunes, borrow a friends software program instead of paying MicroSoft $400? If you want to protect US jobs, start paying for your software. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 tarriffs...if companies go overseas for cheaper labors tax their goods coming back into the states making it less advantagous..we still are the number one consumers of crap in the world...lets make it work for something im sure india would then tax our good going into their country but in the long run who is gonna win on that deal??? Everyone write their congressmen that products are too cheap and we want price hikes via tariffs. I do not want to spend $400 for this software program, slap a tariff and jack it up to $500. Companies are free to set up shop in the US and compete. Write a better program. Deliver something the consumer wants. And if India slaps a tariff on our products who cares about the American worker who's company is trying to sell into that coountry? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 This is what it boils down to. Either Americans have to accept cheaper wages, or they have to be willing to pay more for American goods. If they don't companies HAVE to go outside of the US borders to stay profitable. If the government passes ways against this we are still paying more, because then we are paying whatever it takes to enforce these laws in taxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Manufacturing jobs (which include process engineering, manufacturing engineering, some design and some electrical engineering) are rapidly moving to Mexico and China. My last job moved their manufacturing plant to Mexico and the company I am currently with recently moved their manufacturning to Mexico. My last job has been (and still are) talking about moving some of their manufacturing from Mexico to China. If I knew then what I know now, I would have become an electrician rather than an electrical engineer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 This is what it boils down to. Either Americans have to accept cheaper wages, or they have to be willing to pay more for American goods. If they don't companies HAVE to go outside of the US borders to stay profitable. If the government passes ways against this we are still paying more, because then we are paying whatever it takes to enforce these laws in taxes. Maybe it's also time for CEOs and higher management to reduce their salaries as well. I don't disagree with your statement though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be Good Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Yes something needs to be done, because its hurting our economy and will only get worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Manufacturing jobs (which include process engineering, manufacturing engineering, some design and some electrical engineering) are rapidly moving to Mexico and China. My last job moved their manufacturing plant to Mexico and the company I am currently with recently moved their manufacturning to Mexico. My last job has been (and still are) talking about moving some of their manufacturing from Mexico to China. If I knew then what I know now, I would have become an electrician rather than an electrical engineer. The Maquillas (Twin Plant US_Mexico operations) are hurting. China has become both a boom to US companies who are supplying goods, services, manufacturing know how and equipment, and a major problem as plants leave Mexico for China. Half our US companies salivate at a 1,000,000,000 Chinese buying Big Macs, Coke, Nike, etc. the other half life in fear of the cheap imports. Half the US can't wait for giant HDTVs for $1,000 the other half bemoan looking for a new job because the Zeniths of the world are gone. I followed some manufacuring down here to the border. This is a unique micro-economic climate. The cliche is when the US catches a cold, Mexico catches pneumonia. The US is a service and intellectual property economy. Manufacturing is rapidly going away which is a problem in a few areas. National security is threatened when we do not have enough Tool and Die Workers or Machinists to build war machines. This isn't anything new. Look at textiles. From the northeast, to the cotton belt, to Mexico, to El Salvador, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Yes something needs to be done, because its hurting our economy and will only get worse. Actually our economy has been sheding low skill and lower paying jobs and replacing them with higher skills and higher paying jobs. And it is a natural process in a free economy. How many of you continued to buy vinyl records because people would be out of work who manufacture them? Pity the buggy whip manufacturer before him. Just try and get a damn hat properly cleaned and blocked. Is the milkman still deliverying to your neighborhood? Don't forget to tip the coal and icemen when they deliver. By-the-way the milkman is your IT tech. The vinyl record guy is a network admin. The coal man is the import-export clerk at Federal Express. And companies outsource not just overseas, they also outsource locally. Vertically intergrrated companies are a thing of the past. Flat organizational charts and a manufacturing flow that brings raw materials just in time and gets the product out the door in the shortest amount of time is in. I've watched vacuums being assembled from raw materials that were at 7 different plants hours before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 We ALL probably should take a pretty large paycut. This is sort of what I was alluding to in my windbag of an answer to the economic situation with third world countries (why we insist everyone has a democracy (which is BS, we really only need a capitalistic ("free-market") country, not a democracy - HUGE difference)). We pay too much for goods, we all want more money so we can buy what is so expensive, and before you know it, we have this ramp up in prices (even though we have no inflation, that's BS too.) It costs more to buy gas, eat beef, buy a car, then it did a year ago. BUT THERE's NO INFLATION my ass. This is where economists have it all wrong. (zing, ss2k). Anyway, CEO's to the receptionists of lower managers (who make about $27-33k a year) all should probably make less then they do, but everything is hiked up pretty high compared to the rest of the world because the fat cats at the top have to keep making their killings - and yes, it does "trickle-down" to where everyone makes more. The theory works, but it's very disproportional, which is why most average folks have a problem with it. Note: the views expressed are not necessarily what I think, but for discussion points only. There are some things I agree with and some I don't with what I said above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubleM23 Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Bah.... 130 years ago, people were complaining that machines and industrialization would be the death of the American economy. Hopefully all this does is wake people up a little bit, because this nation is badly in need of some economic revision anyway. Somehow, I think the good ol' USA will pull throw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Everyone write their congressmen that products are too cheap and we want price hikes via tariffs. I do not want to spend $400 for this software program, slap a tariff and jack it up to $500. Companies are free to set up shop in the US and compete. Write a better program. Deliver something the consumer wants. And if India slaps a tariff on our products who cares about the American worker who's company is trying to sell into that coountry? believe me they wouldnt be there for long before other countries would make some concessions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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