Rex Hudler Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 My date is the day Frank shows up. I hope he kicks Ozzie's ass! Steff, you should be careful about keeping your feelings about Ozzie bottled up like that? I know you are hinting at something here, but why don't you just tell us how you really feel? Keeping things inside isn't healthy. ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Steff, you should be careful about keeping your feelings about Ozzie bottled up like that? I know you are hinting at something here, but why don't you just tell us how you really feel? Keeping things inside isn't healthy. ;-) Oh no... No way. My lips are sealed other than to say that I don't see anything positive coming from Ozzie flapping his gums to the media about s*** that should NOT be in the public.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 This is a bunch of crap. If anyone here actually saw the press conference you would know he didnt call Frank out. The media took this and ran with it. The media asked Ozzie a question about Frank. Ozzie simply answered it honestly. I didn't hear him say anything wrong about Frank, nor did I hear him call Frank out. The media blew it way out of proportion. Bunch of horses*** if you ask me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 His plan should have been to address Frank personally and not via a media outlet. C'mon Yas.. how would YOU respond to being called out in front of your co-workers and hometown media. ESPECIALLY when the little f'er hadn't even talked to him. Guillen and Cora both are going to make this orginization look even MORE foolish. You can cash that one... Steff is exactly right on this issue. There is a thing called "leadership" involved here when you become the "manager". Maybe Ozzie does need to talk to Frank and tell him a thing or three, but you do it in private. I think Ozzie made a big foolish blunder becasue he was so excited to be picked as the manager. I hope that Frank doesn't kick the Spring Jaws behind, but you never know. I don't want Guillen and Cora thinking they are the "Second Coming" to Sox baseball. It takes a team all on the same page and working together to win. You don't piss off your super star on day one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 This is a bunch of crap. If anyone here actually saw the press conference you would know he didnt call Frank out. The media took this and ran with it. The media asked Ozzie a question about Frank. Ozzie simply answered it honestly. I didn't hear him say anything wrong about Frank, nor did I hear him call Frank out. The media blew it way out of proportion. Bunch of horses*** if you ask me. Yea.. no one here saw it... OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 This is a bunch of crap. If anyone here actually saw the press conference you would know he didnt call Frank out. The media took this and ran with it. The media asked Ozzie a question about Frank. Ozzie simply answered it honestly. I didn't hear him say anything wrong about Frank, nor did I hear him call Frank out. The media blew it way out of proportion. Bunch of horses*** if you ask me. I tend to agree with the southsideirish. Every year we 'wince' at Frank's reactions to someone or something. Every year it is like 'who dissed Frank this time'. He brings these confrontations on himself. All Oz expressed is that he needs the whole team on the same page. Why should he not express concerns about a non-aligned attitude when Frank's own agenda always seems to take precedence. Imagine if Frank took the opportunity created by Ozzie's statements to express a team attitude and came back at Oz with a 'don't worry about me - I'll be there' response. Everyone would come up smelling like roses. Lot's of players would see the value in such an attitude. Not Frank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 I tend to agree with the southsideirish. Every year we 'wince' at Frank's reactions to someone or something. Every year it is like 'who dissed Frank this time'. He brings these confrontations on himself. All Oz expressed is that he needs the whole team on the same page. Why should he not express concerns about a non-aligned attitude when Frank's own agenda always seems to take precedence. Imagine if Frank took the opportunity created by Ozzie's statements to express a team attitude and came back at Oz with a 'don't worry about me - I'll be there' response. Everyone would come up smelling like roses. Lot's of players would see the value in such an attitude. Not Frank. Don't you mean every year there's issue with what the MEDIA reports happened regarding Frank..? "Sources say... ", "an un-named source..", bla, bla, bla... And would you mind sharing what Frank's agenda is exactly.. I can imagine many here would like those details.. The point is that Ozzie didn't have to say ANYONE'S name specifically. Not Frank, not Maggs, not anyone. Yet he chose to. He lit the fire. And he wont get any water from me.. and many other Sox fans.. to cool it when it gets to hot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Don't you mean every year there's issue with what the MEDIA reports happened regarding Frank..? "Sources say... ", "an un-named source..", bla, bla, bla... And would you mind sharing what Frank's agenda is exactly.. I can imagine many here would like those details.. The point is that Ozzie didn't have to say ANYONE'S name specifically. Not Frank, not Maggs, not anyone. Yet he chose to. He lit the fire. And he wont get any water from me.. and many other Sox fans.. to cool it when it gets to hot. To me it is telling that the MEDIA finds Frank and no-one else for these controversies. The reason is not just that Frank is a great ballplayer. He paints himself into a corner. It is his own doing. He can't seem to find it within himself to respond in a positive fashion. And the MEDIA knows it. Certainly the MEDIA, in the name of stirring up a story, tends to bait Frank. If he ever responded in an 'anti-Frank' way (concocting a positive spin), Sox fans would be shocked to say the least. As to Frank's agenda - from day one of his arrival, he has been obsessed with his own stats and place in history. Most people would have the common sense to keep such feelings to themselves. Not Frank. Hence the perception that the agenda is Frank first, then the team. I don't even really believe Frank is so selfish. But his own actions over the year's have fostered this belief. And it is not just the stats. I too hated to hear him 'swinging for the fences' last year. And Ozzie did not bring up Frank's name. The MEDIA did. They created the fire with the question. I see no reason why the manager could not answer straight from the hip. He expects everyone on board, including the player brought up by the MEDIA. The MEDIA would never bring up Magglio's name in such a fashion. Frank should look in the mirror for the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 To me it is telling that the MEDIA finds Frank and no-one else for these controversies. The reason is not just that Frank is a great ballplayer. He paints himself into a corner. It is his own doing. He can't seem to find it within himself to respond in a positive fashion. And the MEDIA knows it. Certainly the MEDIA, in the name of stirring up a story, tends to bait Frank. If he ever responded in an 'anti-Frank' way (concocting a positive spin), Sox fans would be shocked to say the least. As to Frank's agenda - from day one of his arrival, he has been obsessed with his own stats and place in history. Most people would have the common sense to keep such feelings to themselves. Not Frank. Hence the perception that the agenda is Frank first, then the team. I don't even really believe Frank is so selfish. But his own actions over the year's have fostered this belief. And it is not just the stats. I too hated to hear him 'swinging for the fences' last year. And Ozzie did not bring up Frank's name. The MEDIA did. They created the fire with the question. I see no reason why the manager could not answer straight from the hip. He expects everyone on board, including the player brought up by the MEDIA. The MEDIA would never bring up Magglio's name in such a fashion. Frank should look in the mirror for the answer. so basically whay you are saying is frank needs to watch bull durham and memorize the crash davis one liners he teaches nick laloosh?? at least frank is honest..you one can take that from him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 so basically whay you are saying is frank needs to watch bull durham and memorize the crash davis one liners he teaches nick laloosh?? at least frank is honest..you one can take that from him I have to admit being more than a little fuzzy on Crash Davis's one liners. But if they tow the company line, then 'yes'. When my manager asks me to jump, I ask 'how high', once in the air. And I do not question Frank's honesty. Just his diminished 'one for all and all for one' attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Fact is.. most folks don't know anything about Frank other than what's reported. And since Frank doesn't give the media the time of day in regards to the BS, it's not cleared up. IMO.. and a bit more.. perception is reality, and in this case, that percieved reality is wrong. And yes.. the media brought up Frank's name in Ozzie's press conference.. that's what they do.. CAUSE CONTROVERSY.. far be it from Ozzie to have a sliver of a brain functioning in that lop sided melon of his to keep his MOUTH SHUT, and keep focused on why he was there. To announce his new job.. now about how he's going to deal with his players BEHIND CLOSED DOORS. I'm done. Agree to disagree I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Fact is.. most folks don't know anything about Frank other than what's reported. And since Frank doesn't give the media the time of day in regards to the BS, it's not cleared up. IMO.. and a bit more.. perception is reality, and in this case, that percieved reality is wrong. And yes.. the media brought up Frank's name in Ozzie's press conference.. that's what they do.. CAUSE CONTROVERSY.. far be it from Ozzie to have a sliver of a brain functioning in that lop sided melon of his to keep his MOUTH SHUT, and keep focused on why he was there. To announce his new job.. now about how he's going to deal with his players BEHIND CLOSED DOORS. I'm done. Agree to disagree I guess. If I was forced into betting, I would put money down on the 'perceived reality' of Frank as being wrong too. I do not think he is as bad as he is painted. I do think, however, that he is greatly responsible for the his own perceived image. Should be an interesting year between these 2 strong willed individuals. I have no doubt Oz will do everything he can to instill a winning attitude in the Sox. Hopefully Oz will show that he knows what he is doing and Frank will climb on board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan562004 Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 I know this may be a silly post, but I will actually defend Frank from the perception that's out there. Frank lives (or lived) in the Oak Brook area for awhile and he would go out and about the area, ie Oakbrook mall, clubs, out to dinner, and since I have worked in some of the places he has frequented I have had an occassion to run into him a few times (mostly at Oakbrook movie theatre). In these times he was nothing but cordial and nice. People would walk up to him (he's difficult to miss, his size is basically overwhelming) and he would sign autographs and always have a smile. I know these may be isolated incidents, but it has always left a positive impression with me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Fact is.. most folks don't know anything about Frank other than what's reported. And since Frank doesn't give the media the time of day in regards to the BS, it's not cleared up. IMO.. and a bit more.. perception is reality, and in this case, that percieved reality is wrong. And yes.. the media brought up Frank's name in Ozzie's press conference.. that's what they do.. CAUSE CONTROVERSY.. far be it from Ozzie to have a sliver of a brain functioning in that lop sided melon of his to keep his MOUTH SHUT, and keep focused on why he was there. To announce his new job.. now about how he's going to deal with his players BEHIND CLOSED DOORS. I'm done. Agree to disagree I guess. You are right Steff. Most folks do only have input on stuff like this from the media. That is part of the reason I value your input here at Soxtalk so much. It was also the reason I had the twist on the Ozzie thing that I did. Maybe, just maybe, Ozzie had a plan in mind, based on his personal knowledge of Frank. I know Frank is basically a nice guy, from what I've heard. But, at times, he sure comes across like he doesn't have the interests of the team ahead of his own interests. Whether that is true, or not, I haven't a clue. But that is the PERCEPTION that is out there, and SOME of it has to be merited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 I dunno, I think Ottawa creep has a point: how f***ing assinine was it for Frank to actually come out and ANNOUNCE he no longer cares about singles, driving the ball to opposite field, cutting on his swing with RISP, etc......He actually out-Shammied Shamy Sosa in the egomania and gall respect in that HR comment quoted in Nuke's sig.....Media will be media but Frank should KNOW BETTER than to say something as selfish and idiotic. Makes you wonder if he was the victim of the media in the past or not.... As far as Frank being a nice guy while sipping on martinies with some friends, I am sure he is....but give me a break-- this is a high-pressure, high-stakes world of pro sports we're talking about. Hell, I am pretty nice, too, but if you catch me at the wrong time in the wrong place, I can be a real asshole-- and I am not going to blame the media, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 That announcement by Frank was what I had in mind when I was talking about the perception and some of it having merit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be Good Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Does anyone get ESPN 1000 that lives outside of Illionis? I heard of people who do, I wish I got it here in NY. It comes in terrible here if it even comes in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Does anyone get ESPN 1000 that lives outside of Illionis? I heard of people who do, I wish I got it here in NY. It comes in terrible here if it even comes in. Depending on a lack of Sun spot activity, it comes in quite clear at night here in Ottawa. Ususally you have to wait until 9:00 PM EST. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Frank is now in a Catch22...he needs to keep his mouth shut, and just play, but if he does that, the media pegs him as a jackass for not talking to the media. I wish the media could just leave Hurt alone and let him play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 I dunno, I think Ottawa creep has a point: how f***ing assinine was it for Frank to actually come out and ANNOUNCE he no longer cares about singles, driving the ball to opposite field, cutting on his swing with RISP, etc......He actually out-Shammied Shamy Sosa in the egomania and gall respect in that HR comment quoted in Nuke's sig.....Media will be media but Frank should KNOW BETTER than to say something as selfish and idiotic. Makes you wonder if he was the victim of the media in the past or not.... As far as Frank being a nice guy while sipping on martinies with some friends, I am sure he is....but give me a break-- this is a high-pressure, high-stakes world of pro sports we're talking about. Hell, I am pretty nice, too, but if you catch me at the wrong time in the wrong place, I can be a real asshole-- and I am not going to blame the media, either. Absolutely valid argument Brando.. IMO, Frank is ignorant to the way his "innocent' comments will be percieved. He's quiet and he's a jag like Albert was percieved.. he talks and it's ripped apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Does anyone get ESPN 1000 that lives outside of Illionis? I heard of people who do, I wish I got it here in NY. It comes in terrible here if it even comes in. Here in western Kentucky I can get WMVP and WSCR at night. Sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Don't you mean every year there's issue with what the MEDIA reports happened regarding Frank..? "Sources say... ", "an un-named source..", bla, bla, bla... And would you mind sharing what Frank's agenda is exactly.. I can imagine many here would like those details.. The point is that Ozzie didn't have to say ANYONE'S name specifically. Not Frank, not Maggs, not anyone. Yet he chose to. He lit the fire. And he wont get any water from me.. and many other Sox fans.. to cool it when it gets to hot. I am thinking you really didn't see or hear the press conference. If you recall, Ozzie was asked a question specifically about Frank and his attitude. Ozzie didn't bring up his name. The reporter did. Ozzie simply answered the question honestly. Did he have to? No. But that is how Ozzie is and I respect his honesty. He didn't call anyone out. This was all overblown by the media and is a bunch of crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Fact is.. most folks don't know anything about Frank other than what's reported. And since Frank doesn't give the media the time of day in regards to the BS, it's not cleared up. IMO.. and a bit more.. perception is reality, and in this case, that percieved reality is wrong. And yes.. the media brought up Frank's name in Ozzie's press conference.. that's what they do.. CAUSE CONTROVERSY.. far be it from Ozzie to have a sliver of a brain functioning in that lop sided melon of his to keep his MOUTH SHUT, and keep focused on why he was there. To announce his new job.. now about how he's going to deal with his players BEHIND CLOSED DOORS. I'm done. Agree to disagree I guess. So you are on Frank's side about being honest, but not on Ozzie's side when it comes to being honest. Frank should have a sliver of a brain when he says most of the stupid s*** that comes out of his mouth as well. To me you are arguing Frank can be this way, but Ozzie can't. I don't understand your argument. Actually I think you are a little biased towards Frank and can't see both sides. That's right Steff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Does anyone get ESPN 1000 that lives outside of Illionis? I heard of people who do, I wish I got it here in NY. It comes in terrible here if it even comes in. I get the awesome Detroit stuff. Damn Michigan professional sports suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 So you are on Frank's side about being honest, but not on Ozzie's side when it comes to being honest. Frank should have a sliver of a brain when he says most of the stupid s*** that comes out of his mouth as well. To me you are arguing Frank can be this way, but Ozzie can't. I don't understand your argument. Actually I think you are a little biased towards Frank and can't see both sides. That's right Steff. Ozzie had no right/reason to call Frank out like he did. Ozzie was never 1/10th of the player Frank is right now. Ozzie didn't always keep his head in the game, often threw the ball to the wrong base, was a bad baserunner. He is in NO position to have criticized Hurt. Ozzie is the pot calling the kettle black! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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