southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 The quote about Frank supposedly not running the bases is not calling him out? Did the reporter ask Ozzie if Frank ran hard? If you go to my earlier posts, this was the one comment I remember from said press conference that really pissed me off. Most of the team didn't run the bases, in fact Ozzie didn't run the bases all the time when he played. The article didn't tell me what I saw and heard, it only confirmed it. Its amazing how people think Ozzie was a big part of Florida's success. Evidently they don't remember he was also around when they sucked. I think the White Sox can still be successful this season, but I think it will be in spite of Guillen, not because of him. Show me this exact quote because I must have missed something. I believe he said every player should play hard and run the bases hard including Frank. I believe Frank is known for taking drills off. When he wouldn't run the shuttle drill a couple years ago that was a huge thing. It is like pointing out your best player and saying everyone has to do these things including your best player. No one gets a play off not even your best player. Like saying everyone has to make a tackle including Brian Urlacher. Everyone has to give it their all including Brian Urlacher. I really believe he is being either misquoted or misunderstood. Whoever doesn't like Ozzie is going to hear what they want to hear and the way they want to hear it. It can be taken a couple different ways. I believe that is why I hear it one way and you hear it another. I also don't ebleive Ozzie's English skills may come into play with this. Just give the guy a break and see what he can do with this team. We already knew what the last guy could do. Hopefully Ozzie can do more with less. I want to see my team win and Ozzie will play a big part of that. Hopefully Frank will too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Rex, Neither you or I are big "die-hard" fans of Frank Thomas, but even WE can see that Kenny ended up with his foot in his mouth and should have just kept his trap shut. I am not being a Frank Thomas apologist at all - my main point is that Kenny should have just "let sleeping dogs lie." If Frank hasn't said or done anything related to the Sox for months now, then why the hell did Kenny open his yap and even remotely try to stir the pot? It's not only ridiculous and stupid - but complete unprovoked. Maybe Kenny should spend less time on the radio airwaves, and spend more time on the phone trying to acquire another pitcher worth a s***. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 I don't think that's true. I think he has tried to see the other side, he just doesn't agree with it. And he feels pretty strongly about his opinion. Nothing wrong with that. Thank you Jim. I have tried to see the other side. I really don't agree with it. I think a lot is to do about nothing. The media blew it way out of proportion. Then it takes on a whole new life when people get into an uproar about it. That is all the media wants. If there is a controversey then they did their job. They reap the benefits. That is why this is a story. This is why it is news worthy. People say they don't care, but then when a question is asked and answered everyone gets on one side or another. Do you see why the media would want that? Do you see why it IS news worthy. Radio shows want people to listen and call in. Who was one of the first people to call in to the Afternoon Thunder? You guessed it, Steff. Why did she call in? To defend Frank. That is what they want. This is an issue that people take one side or the other. It is an issue that hits the fans and the media loves it! But it's not news worthy right? OK fine. Ratings! People listen! People call in! I really doubt that Frank even watched or listened to the press conference. He may just be going by what people are telling him or maybe he just doesn't care about anythign that is going on. Maybe he isn't paying attention to anything and just wants to keep himself focused and motivated. In fact I hope that is exactly what he is doing because he is awesome when he is focused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Rex, Neither you or I are big "die-hard" fans of Frank Thomas, but even WE can see that Kenny ended up with his foot in his mouth and should have just kept his trap shut. I am not being a Frank Thomas apologist at all - my main point is that Kenny should have just "let sleeping dogs lie." If Frank hasn't said or done anything related to the Sox for months now, then why the hell did Kenny open his yap and even remotely try to stir the pot? It's not only ridiculous and stupid - but complete unprovoked. Maybe Kenny should spend less time on the radio airwaves, and spend more time on the phone trying to acquire another pitcher worth a s***. Past time I think you may be missing something here. I have mentioned this before. Maybe Kenny wants this to get out to Frank. Maybe he wants Frank to demand a trade. We all know Kenny has wanted him out the past couple years. Maybe I am wrong, but don't you think this could be the case? As far as Kenny spending less time on the airwaves I think you would be in the minority there. Just from listening to it, it seemed like people couldn't wait to hear what Kenny had to say. It seemed like people were waiting for him to come on. I agree we need more pitching, but 10 minutes out of his day on his drive home won't stop him from doing his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Frank hasn't said s*** for 3 months now - he's just living his life, and he should. This is HIS time, not the Sox time. I don't agree with this at all. Frank gets paid a yearly salary. It is not just HIS time. Isn't that why everyone is pissed off at the baby bulls? For not staying in shape? I am not saying Frank isn't dedicated. I know he is and I know he comes in in shape. What I am saying is it is not just HIS time. He has a job to do. It is not a part time position. I believe if you are getting paid millions of dollars to play a game then you dedicate yourself to that game. That is if you have any pride what so ever in what you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Past time I think you may be missing something here. I have mentioned this before. Maybe Kenny wants this to get out to Frank. Maybe he wants Frank to demand a trade. We all know Kenny has wanted him out the past couple years. Maybe I am wrong, but don't you think this could be the case? I was just going to make the comment that KW's comments seem to be either really stupid or intentional, one or the other. My thought is this..... IF he is doing as you say, I think that is a very gutless thing to do. I am not a Frank backer as Past alluded to, and I have heard things for 7 or 8 years now that Frank is moody and a pain in the ass. His teammates get along with him, yet they tolerate his selfishness and moodiness. I have heard those things so many times, from so many people (including some who have spent time in the clubhouse living with it) that I am inclined to believe it is true. However, Frank has performed on the field for the Sox in a big way through the year. Regardless if it truly would be better for the Sox and Frank to part ways, I don't think KW has given Frank the respect he deserves. Frank has a contract and KW needs to honor and respect that contract. If he doesn't like it, then he needs to look for other alternatives in a private way. If they are not there, then he should shut up and deal with the full length of the contract. Respect is an area where I feel KW is weak as a GM. Whether his goading at Frank is intentional or stupidity, either way it is disrespectful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 However, Frank has performed on the field for the Sox in a big way through the year. Regardless if it truly would be better for the Sox and Frank to part ways, I don't think KW has given Frank the respect he deserves. Frank has a contract and KW needs to honor and respect that contract. If he doesn't like it, then he needs to look for other alternatives in a private way. If they are not there, then he should shut up and deal with the full length of the contract. Respect is an area where I feel KW is weak as a GM. Whether his goading at Frank is intentional or stupidity, either way it is disrespectful. Respect is a two way street. Behind closed doors I am not sure what goes on. Possibly respect was not given to Kenny by Frank either. Maybe Kenny feels not returning his phone calls is a lack of respect enough for him to do what he is doing. Either way we can obviously see that neither one really respects each other on a personal basis. On the field, as a player, I am sure Kenny respects what he has done. As a person I don't believe either one respects each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 You are probably right........ but the level of respect you treat your players, especially in the media will directly affect y our ability to do your job. Disrespecting any player in public is seen by the rest of the players on your team as well as players on other teams. Personal laundry should not be aired in public. That is not good business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Personal laundry should not be aired in public. That is not good business. Agreed, but once things reach a certain level where do you go? Sometimes there is only so much you can do. If this is his only way to reach Frank, through the media, then he may have tried to do that. I just want this team I love to do well. I hope Ozzie is the manager of the year, Kenny the GM of the year, and Frank MVP. If that is what it takes for my team to win then please let it come true. That is all I really care about. I don't know why a lot of us even want to take sides on our own team. As far as I can see both are wrong for what they are doing. Lets just get this team together, get it settled, and get everyone going in the same direction. hopefully that direction is forward and not backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Agreed, but once things reach a certain level where do you go? Sometimes there is only so much you can do. If this is his only way to reach Frank, through the media, then he may have tried to do that. Why would he need to reach Frank? Why would it be so important to do so than to basically call him out in the media? C'mon southside, there is no excuse here. KW should have shut up on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Why would he need to reach Frank? Why would it be so important to do so than to basically call him out in the media? C'mon southside, there is no excuse here. KW should have shut up on this one. Well considering we just hired a new manager I believe he would like to talk to Frank about it. Frank has the most tenure with the White Sox on this team, that alone makes him a leader in the clubhouse. Whether he likes it or not that is the way it is. Just because of that I think there is a lot that Kenny would have to talk to him about. I believe he would like to talk to Frank on where he would fit in. Maybe more playing time at first base. See how he would feel about certain situations. Possibly the direction of the team and to see if Frank is on board with that. A lot has happened since the year ended, and Frank hasn't talked to anyone in the organization about it. Kenny is still Frank's boss. If you or I didn't call our boss back in 6 months we would be fired. Not only is that respect, but that is just the way the world works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Well considering we just hired a new manager I believe he would like to talk to Frank about it. I belive he would like to talk to Frank on where he would fit in. Maybe more playing time at first base. See how he would feel about certain situations. A lot has happened since the year ended, and Frank hasn't atlked to anyone in the organization about it. Kenny is still Frank's boss. If you or I didn't call our boss back in 6 months we would be fired. Not only is that respect, but that is just the way the world works. Still, their dirty laundry doens't need to be aired out in public. Period Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Still, their dirty laundry doens't need to be aired out in public. Period If he won't return your calls how else do you get through to him? It shouldn't have gone this far. Frank is partially to blame for that though. All he had to do was return some calls. If he did then there would be nothing to air out publicly. He is not the innocent guy we are making him out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Irish, I have to disagree with one of your points. Frank is a member of the White Sox. They are paying him to one simple thing - hit the baseball. That's it. Unless you know something I don't, he's not being paid to be a "White Sox Spokesperson" or a "White Sox Ambassador." In other words, his "loyalty" and "duty" for the Sox occurs during the season. Is he not entitled to an offseason? Is he not entitled to his life outside of the Sox? Yes he is. If Frank chooses to leave the team after the season and just live his life in PRIVACY, without saying or doing anything related to baseball, that's his business. Not your business. Not my business. And not Kenny Williams' business either. Once again, unless he's being paid to be an official spokesperson or ambassador, then he can do whatever he damn well pleases in the offseason with no judgment against him being valid. If he doesn't want to talk to the GM or the manager, and if he doesn't want to come to SoxFest, that's his prerogative. They aren't paying him to do anything BUT HIT A BASEBALL DURING THE SEASON. Frank doesn't owe you, me, or Kenny one damn thing. And unless he's contractually obligated to do anything outside the season, then he has done nothing wrong. He wants to enjoy his offseason living in obscurity and anonymity. That's his prerogative and his choice. And no one can question that. Believe or not, but professional athletes DO have a life outside of their team's seasons. Yes, outside of their 6-month seasons, they do have a life of their own. Frank wants to do what he wants in his personal time, and I don't fault him for a minute, if he's happy and content with what he chooses to do. Kenny should just shut up and leave people alone. Before that dips*** criticizes ANYONE, he should look in the mirror at that ugly face he sees, and then judge THAT person first and foremost, because Kenny has yet to prove one damn thing in this league. His first criticism should be upon HIMSELF, and not upon a player that hasn't made a peep in the offseason - a player that has proven himself. When Kenny actually accomplishes something worth a s*** in this league, THEN, and only THEN, can he criticize or open up his big yap. Otherwise, Kenny should shut the f*** up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Irish, I have to disagree with one of your points. Frank is a member of the White Sox. They are paying him to one simple thing - hit the baseball. That's it. Unless you know something I don't, he's not being paid to be a "White Sox Spokesperson" or a "White Sox Ambassador." In other words, his "loyalty" and "duty" for the Sox occurs during the season. Is he not entitled to an offseason? Is he not entitled to his life outside of the Sox? Yes he is. If Frank chooses to leave the team after the season and just live his life in PRIVACY, without saying or doing anything related to baseball, that's his business. Not your business. Not my business. And not Kenny Williams' business either. Once again, unless he's being paid to be an official spokesperson or ambassador, then he can do whatever he damn well pleases in the offseason with no judgment against him being valid. If he doesn't want to talk to the GM or the manager, and if he doesn't want to come to SoxFest, that's his prerogative. They aren't paying him to do anything BUT HIT A BASEBALL DURING THE SEASON. Frank doesn't owe you, me, or Kenny one damn thing. And unless he's contractually obligated to do anything outside the season, then he has done nothing wrong. He wants to enjoy his offseason living in obscurity and anonymity. That's his prerogative and his choice. And no one can question that. Believe or not, but professional athletes DO have a life outside of their team's seasons. Yes, outside of their 6-month seasons, they do have a life of their own. Frank wants to do what he wants in his personal time, and I don't fault him for a minute, if he's happy and content with what he chooses to do. Kenny should just shut up and leave people alone. Before that dips*** criticizes ANYONE, he should look in the mirror at that ugly face he sees, and then judge THAT person first and foremost, because Kenny has yet to prove one damn thing in this league. His first criticism should be upon HIMSELF, and not upon a player that hasn't made a peep in the offseason - a player that has proven himself. When Kenny actually accomplishes something worth a s*** in this league, THEN, and only THEN, can he criticize or open up his big yap. Otherwise, Kenny should shut the f*** up. Oh, I think you misunderstood what I meant. I don't want him to come forward and speak to the media. I would like him to pick up the phone and call his employeer back. That is what I meant by doing his job. YOu are right he owes me or the fans nothing. He doesnt have to be a team spokes person. I could care less what he does with his personal life. That is not my business nor do I want it to be. That is not what I mean. He still has a job that pays him millions. He owes it to his teammates and the organization to be dedicated to his "job" for the entire year. Unless he wants to be like Sammy the Sosa and start working out after December with his steroids. I believe Frank has also helped get it to this point. If he called Kenny and Ozzie back then Kenny would have had nothing to criticize while opening up his big yap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Irish, I think Kenny will always have something to say about something. He has finally realized where he is and what he is. He's a GM who has a short leash to deal with, a GM who has restrictions thrown in his face. He's bitter, angry, frustrated, and pissed. And he should be. However, he should take his frustrations out in another manner. Hit a pillow, hit a punching bag, go into a secluded area and scream, etc. Starting trouble with a player who already has thin skin is NOT - I repeat, NOT, a healthy way to deal with his troubles. Especially when said player has purposely remained quiet and secluded. I still think the best alternative is a steel cage match with Ozzie, Kenny, and Frank. Whoever crawls out is the one we deem the "correct one." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Irish, I think Kenny will always have something to say about something. He has finally realized where he is and what he is. He's a GM who has a short leash to deal with, a GM who has restrictions thrown in his face. He's bitter, angry, frustrated, and pissed. And he should be. However, he should take his frustrations out in another manner. Hit a pillow, hit a punching bag, go into a secluded area and scream, etc. Starting trouble with a player who already has thin skin is NOT - I repeat, NOT, a healthy way to deal with his troubles. Especially when said player has purposely remained quiet and secluded. I still think the best alternative is a steel cage match with Ozzie, Kenny, and Frank. Whoever crawls out is the one we deem the "correct one." I agree with you, especially with this type of person it is not a good idea. I know your final quote is just to be funny, but I really am not taking sides. I think every single person in this could have prevented it. No one is more at fault than the next. I want my favorite team to win. In order to win we need all of these guys working together. To pit people against each other and for our fans to take sides on people that are on our own TEAM seems kind of ridiculous to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 26, 2004 Author Share Posted January 26, 2004 :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 The way I see it, Ozzie, Frank and Kenny are all in the wrong on this one. Ozzie and Kenny are wrong because they've been flapping their yaps. Frank is wrong for not returning the multiple calls that were made, possibly in an attempt to smooth things over. I would suggest to Ozzie and Kenny that from this point till Spring Training that the subject of Frank Thomas should be off limits with the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 The way I see it, Ozzie, Frank and Kenny are all in the wrong on this one. Ozzie and Kenny are wrong because they've been flapping their yaps. Frank is wrong for not returning the multiple calls that were made, possibly in an attempt to smooth things over. I would suggest to Ozzie and Kenny that from this point till Spring Training that the subject of Frank Thomas should be off limits with the media. I couldn't agree with you more!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 26, 2004 Author Share Posted January 26, 2004 It appears we have a new wind sock gang.. :headshake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 It appears we have a new wind sock gang.. :headshake Actually we might have windsock. Interesting research popping up here. I'll have to forward this one up for further review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted January 26, 2004 Author Share Posted January 26, 2004 Actually we might have windsock. Interesting research popping up here. I'll have to forward this one up for further review. Now THAT would NOT surprise me one bit... Didn't I PM you about this the other day..?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 Now THAT would NOT surprise me one bit... Didn't I PM you about this the other day..?? Two different IP's. I had only checked the one that was being used that day. I had no idea there was a second one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 It appears we have a new wind sock gang.. :headshake Why because someone else does agree with your point of view. Oh how dare they! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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