YASNY Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 I can't see KW trading both Maggs and Thomas. I'd rather see this deal go through, but I'd bet on the Thomas to LA deal happening instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sox-r-us Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Thomas will not play 1st base for 162 games....no way the Dodgers go for that I would love to do this deal to close out pitching rotation, but the same thought haunts me everytime we talk about dealing someone on O for pitching.....our biggest problem until we got Alomar and Everett was on O We just could not freaking hit.......no way is Borchard or Reed ready to produce yet ..... I would have loved to do this deal and then got Juan Gonzalez, but with the guy off the market, we do not have a way of replacing the O anymore.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 If we had to throw in an Arnie Munoz would you still do this deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 ESPN is probably just quoting the Seattle Times article. They were quoting the Trib and Sun-Times during the whole a-rod/nomar/manny/maggs ordeal. I could be wrong, but it looks like the Seattle Times is the only source. Guys on a sidenote, all ESPN Insider is, is a compliation of all of the newsreports out there. All they do it take all of the news about something, but it in one place, and call it Insider. All of their info comes from somewhere else. You could do the same thing with a google search and some free time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 The fact this is coming out of Seattle makes it more reliable. If KW is awake the next two weeks could be huge. This trade would be nice. What keeps Seattle (huge pitchers park) out of the Maddux race? We could garcia for the salary pick-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Would you still do a Kong for Perez trade too? That would give us a rotation of: Buehrle Loaiza Garcia Perez Garland And a bullpen of: Koch Marte Soriano Takatsu Wunsch Schoney Politte Wright Obviously one or two of the guys in the BP would need to be traded, how about Wright, Ginter, and Joe B. for Carlos Pena? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 I forgot about Cliff. Our bullpen has some promise to it. Soriano would start here and probably cost us Cotts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDsDirtySox Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 I would rather resign Maggs. Garcia needs to prove he wasn't a flash in the pan. Winn isn't that special, and Soriano is a great prospect ... but I would rather have Edwin Jackson from the Dodgers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Bartman's my idol Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Count me in on this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzietheairedale Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 I would love to do this deal to close out pitching rotation, but the same thought haunts me everytime we talk about dealing someone on O for pitching.....our biggest problem until we got Alomar and Everett was on O We just could not freaking hit.......no way is Borchard or Reed ready to produce yet ..... I would have loved to do this deal and then got Juan Gonzalez, but with the guy off the market, we do not have a way of replacing the O anymore.... I agree. Somehow I'm still concerned about our offense more than our pitching right now. I have to admit I was surprised last year that we couldn't hit the ball, but still see the same problems this year. Rowand and Harris are big big ifs right now. Konerko - who knows? Thomas could falter again. Crede is unproven. Maggs may be the only sure thing. I think if we trade Maggs this year for only pitching, it's a White Flag trade for this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wong & Owens Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Cmon people-- Not even a week after KW said in front of the SoxFest crowd, and tons of local media folks, that Maggs and Carlos weren't going anywhere, do you seriously think there's even a speck of truth in this? Why would he say that if there were even a snowball's chance that a trade would go through for either of them? He didn't say anything specifically regarding Frank or Paulie, did he? The Dodgers deal or possibly an Anaheim deal are the only two that I would think have any merit at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Cmon people-- Not even a week after KW said in front of the SoxFest crowd, and tons of local media folks, that Maggs and Carlos weren't going anywhere, do you seriously think there's even a speck of truth in this? Why would he say that if there were even a snowball's chance that a trade would go through for either of them? He didn't say anything specifically regarding Frank or Paulie, did he? The Dodgers deal or possibly an Anaheim deal are the only two that I would think have any merit at this point. The reason this can come about is the Mariners lost $10 in salary and it opens them up to do some things. Imagine what would happen if all of a sudden Konerko walked into the White Sox front office and said, "I quit, rip up my contrct and save teh $8M for this year." This along with Maddux to the Dodgers (sale finalized) make the landscape very different then what it was a week ago. I think the Mariner deal may have to include Koch with us paying half his salary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wong & Owens Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 The reason this can come about is the Mariners lost $10 in salary and it opens them up to do some things. Imagine what would happen if all of a sudden Konerko walked into the White Sox front office and said, "I quit, rip up my contrct and save teh $8M for this year." This along with Maddux to the Dodgers (sale finalized) make the landscape very different then what it was a week ago. I think the Mariner deal may have to include Koch with us paying half his salary. You're missing my point. I never claimed that this wasn't doable(sorry Steff) on the Seattle end, although I see no reason why they would want Koch, as they signed Guardado in the offseason. My point was that it makes no sense for KW to come out and say point blank that Carlos and Maggs aren't going anywhere, if a week later he was to trade one of them away. That Sasaki defection happened over a week ago, so KW can't even use that as an excuse to go back on what he said. KW could have easily have answered the question regarding trades with a simple, cliched--"we have to listen to offers from anyone, and if we feel they would improve our club, then it's our job to make those deals. blah, blah" Instead, he puts it on the line and says that they are not going anywhere. I don't see any reason for him to say that, unless they're really not going to be moved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottawa_sox Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 You're missing my point. I never claimed that this wasn't doable(sorry Steff) on the Seattle end, although I see no reason why they would want Koch, as they signed Guardado in the offseason. My point was that it makes no sense for KW to come out and say point blank that Carlos and Maggs aren't going anywhere, if a week later he was to trade one of them away. That Sasaki defection happened over a week ago, so KW can't even use that as an excuse to go back on what he said. KW could have easily have answered the question regarding trades with a simple, cliched--"we have to listen to offers from anyone, and if we feel they would improve our club, then it's our job to make those deals. blah, blah" Instead, he puts it on the line and says that they are not going anywhere. I don't see any reason for him to say that, unless they're really not going to be moved. Could just be posturing. Anyone who seriously wants Maggs may get the feeling that they will have to come around to the SOX needs and wants to make it happen. If nobody takes the bait - nothing lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 I forgot about Cliff. Our bullpen has some promise to it. Soriano would start here and probably cost us Cotts. Then no deal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Rowand and Harris are big big ifs right now. Konerko - who knows? Thomas could falter again. Crede is unproven. Maggs may be the only sure thing. I think if we trade Maggs this year for only pitching, it's a White Flag trade for this year. Thomas is pretty consistant, CLee is aswell. Mags is not the only sure thing on this team. Look at Manos too, he seems consistant. We have quite a few players who are good, and I find it hard to believe that Mags is the only one who is going to have a great season. BTW, Randy Winn is a heck of a player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Then no deal! Sorry but I really have no faith in Cotts learning how to throw strikes. Control and plate discipline can not be taught, hence trading Cotts and Borchard would not be a bad thing. Trading Honel and Reed would. If Cotts threw strikes in the minors we would have something to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Sorry but I really have no faith in Cotts learning how to throw strikes. Control and plate discipline can not be taught, hence trading Cotts and Borchard would not be a bad thing. Trading Honel and Reed would. If Cotts threw strikes in the minors we would have something to work with. I was just being facetious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Sorry but I really have no faith in Cotts learning how to throw strikes. Control and plate discipline can not be taught, hence trading Cotts and Borchard would not be a bad thing. Trading Honel and Reed would. If Cotts threw strikes in the minors we would have something to work with. He did throw strikes in the minors. When he came up to the bigs, they changed his style on pitching. That's why he was so screwed up mentally. Sure he did walk a lot of batters and the minors, but he had alot of strikeouts as well. He's going to be a hellofa pitcher one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 The casual fan might not be happy with the deal, just becasue of Maggs fan appel, but the deal would be great for us. That's the biggest thing. If maggs (or even frank) was traded, do you think the average sox fan would not like this because their favorite player is gone? They wouldn't even come to the games anymore (hell might not root for the sox eigher;)) let alone like the management. It'll be different if the sox maybe won the division, but that certain fan would still have that bad taste in their mouth from maggs/frank on a different team (let alone maybe facing him in the playoffs ) Even though I believe they should just deal with it, it is common. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Will they dislike it any less in July with the team out of contention? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Will they dislike it any less in July with the team out of contention? Can you say "Chicago Riot on the Southside.." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 He did throw strikes in the minors. When he came up to the bigs, they changed his style on pitching. That's why he was so screwed up mentally. Sure he did walk a lot of batters and the minors, but he had alot of strikeouts as well. He's going to be a hellofa pitcher one day. That is not true. He had a high walk ratio in the minors as well. However, you can teach control. Randy Johnson was terrible early in his career because of lack of control. You mostly have to improve on your footwork and arm angle to improve control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Will they dislike it any less in July with the team out of contention? Alrighty then.. since the '04 season is over perhaps we should just start talking about '05..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Alrighty then.. since the '04 season is over perhaps we should just start talking about '05..? I know you are joking, but with all the pessimists around here it seems that we already are giving up on this year and talking about the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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