hogan873 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I know it's way too early to actually foresee how many games each SP will win, but in order for the Sox to do well this year, the pitchers are going to have to step up. Our offense is pretty good...we will score some runs. It's keeping the other team from scoring more that's key. So, figuring a trigger is not pulled and we do not acquire another SP, how do we think each pitcher will do...win-wise at least? Better yet, how many games do they need to win? Here's my thought: Loaiza - 16 Buehrle - 18 Garland - 15 (he really needs to show he can pitch this year) Schoeneweis - 13 Person (my guess as the #5) - 11 Will this happen? I don't know. It sure would be nice to see those double digit wins for each pitcher, but it may be wishful thinking. In reality, I do see Loaiza and Buehrle winning upper teens each. As far as Garland, he shows flashes of being a great pitcher. He needs to do that all year! The #4 and #5 slots are a crap shoot...like every other year. Let's hope for the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buerhle-18 Loiaza-18 Garland-16 Shoenweis-12 Rauch(my guess for #5)-11 Total-75 wins combined, probably just wishful thinking on my behalf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Burly - 14 Lohizor - 16 Garland - 19 Wise - 9 5 Spot Jobbers Combined - 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be Good Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buerhle-19 Loiaza-14 Garland-17 Shoenweis-14 Rauch-10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quade36 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 The big question is Garland. Will he be what we all assumed he would one day be? He can easily be a 16 game winner, or could have another 12-12 year. Only time will tell. The Sox also have a bunch of young pitchers, lefties none the less, they should give a shot to. Everyone new Josh Fogg would be good, but he never good a legitimate opportunity with the Sox. Now he is doing extremely well for being on a horrible team. Diaz, Stewart(though he is injured) Rauch, Cotts. If they trade for Miller or Jackson, this is their future. I don't know why they are putting so much emphasis on Shoenweis, you might as well start two of these young kids. Just think, the Sox could actually have a starting 5 that can have 4 lefties. Thats unheard of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purdue129 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 MB: 19 Loaiza: 16 Garland: 17 Shoenweis: 12 Group of 5th starters: 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buerhle 18 Loiaza 12 Garland 16 Scho 8 Cotts 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 buehrle 15 loaiza 15 garland 11 4th spot 8 5th spot 7 bullpen 19 total 75 we really need a 4th and 5th starter or we will implode this year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Rector Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Loaiza: 20-25 Garland: 15-20 Schoeneweiss: 15-17 5th Starter: 12-15 As for Buehrle, consider this: Buehrle's stats for 2001, 2002 and 2003 (in order): ERA: 3.29, 3.58, 4.14 WHIP: 1.07, 1.24, 1.35 K/BB: 2.63, 2.20, 1.95 K/9IP: 5.12, 5.05, 4.65 BAA: .230, .260, .278 Buehrle is in a continual state of decline. He is obviously getting worn down. The Sox really should either put him in the bullpen or trade him while its still possible to get maximum trade value for him. If the team has Buehrle as a starter in 2004, then here's my prediction for him: Buehrle: 12-15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Oh, and BTW hogan, welcome to Soxtalk!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle 18-20 Loaiza 17-19 Garland 14-16 Shoey (or Perez )12-15 Grilli (or Cotts) 10-12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Man, some of you guys sure are generous to Schoney who's previous season high is 10 wins and may not even make the rotation. Unless Cotts or Rauch steps up big time, 65 wins max out of the rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyKongerko Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle - 18 Loaiza - 16 Garland - 13 Schoeneweis - 11 Porzio's Whorzios (#5) - 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle - 18 Loaiza - 16 Garland - 13 Schoeneweis - 11 Porzio's Whorzios (#5) - 8 Porzio's Whorzios (#5) - 8 ?????? You do know Porzio is gone right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 ?????? You do know Porzio is gone right? i think thats his point...the 5th spot will be held down by a bunch of here today gone tommorow types...we are gonna whore the position out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I'll go one further and post my guesses for W-L and ERA MB 20-10, 3.45 EL 17-12, 3.52 JG 15-9, 3.56 SS 10-10, 4.03 NC 9-14, 4.53 71-55 out of the starters, which is OK by me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle is in a continual state of decline. He is obviously getting worn down. The Sox really should either put him in the bullpen or trade him while its still possible to get maximum trade value for him. If the team has Buehrle as a starter in 2004, then here's my prediction for him: Buehrle: 12-15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 C. Rector, I think I am as big of a Schoe supporter as there is on these boards, but to say hell win 15-17 and Buerhle will win 12-15 is negligent when you look at the statistics that you point of for Buerhle. Schoe has never had a statistically better year than Buerhle, but yet you all of a sudden have him coming in to win 15 games where as Buerhle will undoubtedly regress (according to your logic). Season TM G GS CG SHO IP H R ER HR BB SO W L SV HLD BLSV ERA 2000 Ana 27 27 1 1 170.0 183 112 103 21 67 78 7 10 0 0 -- 5.45 2001 Ana 32 32 1 0 205.1 227 122 116 21 77 104 10 11 0 0 -- 5.08 2001 CWS 32 32 4 2 221.1 188 89 81 24 48 126 16 8 0 0 -- 3.29 2002 CWS 34 34 5 2 239.0 236 102 95 25 61 134 19 12 0 0 -- 3.58 2003 CWS 35 35 2 0 230.1 250 124 106 22 61 119 14 14 0 0 -- 4.14 Buerhle in more IP gave up only 2 more ER's last year than Schoe did in his best year. I like Schoe's potential and his arm, but I think Buerhle will out perform him next year, and there is really nothing to suggest Buerhle is not the better pitcher from past performances. SB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Rector Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 C. Rector, I think I am as big of a Schoe supporter as there is on these boards, but to say hell win 15-17 and Buerhle will win 12-15 is negligent when you look at the statistics that you point of for Buerhle. Schoe has never had a statistically better year than Buerhle, but yet you all of a sudden have him coming in to win 15 games where as Buerhle will undoubtedly regress (according to your logic). Season TM G GS CG SHO IP H R ER HR BB SO W L SV HLD BLSV ERA 2000 Ana 27 27 1 1 170.0 183 112 103 21 67 78 7 10 0 0 -- 5.45 2001 Ana 32 32 1 0 205.1 227 122 116 21 77 104 10 11 0 0 -- 5.08 2001 CWS 32 32 4 2 221.1 188 89 81 24 48 126 16 8 0 0 -- 3.29 2002 CWS 34 34 5 2 239.0 236 102 95 25 61 134 19 12 0 0 -- 3.58 2003 CWS 35 35 2 0 230.1 250 124 106 22 61 119 14 14 0 0 -- 4.14 Buerhle in more IP gave up only 2 more ER's last year than Schoe did in his best year. I like Schoe's potential and his arm, but I think Buerhle will out perform him next year, and there is really nothing to suggest Buerhle is not the better pitcher from past performances. SB Buehrle's liable to have an ERA of 4.50 or worse. Schoenweiss is adding the cutter to his repertoire. His ERA should be lower than 4.50. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle's liable to have an ERA of 4.50 or worse. Schoenweiss is adding the cutter to his repertoire. His ERA should be lower than 4.50. Learn to spell before trying to get any credibility around here with your opinions. The word liable is not used in the context in which you've used it. And perhaps spelling the player names correct would help as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan562004 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 MB- 16 EL- 12 JG- 18 SS- 10 Rauch- 15 I think Rauch has a chance to have a really good season... He pitched strong down the stretch in the minors last year which could be a good sign that he's healthy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnB Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Buehrle - 17 Loaiza - 15 Garland - 12 Show - 12 Whoever? 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I think we are being very generous to Schoenenweis too. If we think he can win 12 games this season we may all need counseling. My best guesstimate is 8-10 wins tops and he may not even make the starting rotation. Person is a medical experiment in progress and healthy may only win 6-8 games. What we need is Greg Maddux in the rotation and pray that one or more of our rookies comes through. Maybe my pessimism will be rewarded with a surprise effort by the above two end starters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 MB - 17-11 EL - 16-10 JG - 15-11 -- He just gets more wins becuase the manager has more faith in him. SS - 8-10 -- Doesn't finish the season as starter. Rauch -- 11-11 equals 67wins Last years starters = 63 wins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Learn to spell before trying to get any credibility around here with your opinions. The word liable is not used in the context in which you've used it. And perhaps spelling the player names correct would help as well. Grammar is not that big of a deal if you understand what he is trying to say, and I do, and I think everyone else does. Take off the rose-colored glasses. C.Rector has brought up a good point in that Buehrle's numbers do seem to be getting slightly worse year in and year out. Teams are starting to see him better and are hitting him harder. There was a reason he started out 2-10 last year. I like Buehrle as much as you and as much as everyone else on here, and I hope he has a great year and he wins 22 or 23 games and the Cy Young, but plain and simply, we do not know if he will. Will he rebound and have a great year, or will he continue this decline? The common rule of thumb is that if a player has about the same thing 3 years in a row that is what you will see most of the time. This would be Buehrle's 3rd year of declining if he does once again decline. If KW traded Buehrle and got max value out of him at either the deadline or in the offseason(assuming Buehrle did once again get worse statistically), it would be a wise move. He is going to be earning more and more money each year and would be a burden to have. Not quite the same as Konerko, who may put up .230 20 70 or .300 30 110, but either way, is overpaid by a lot and is a b**** to have no matter what stats he puts up, but maybe more similar to say Mark Grudzielanek from last year when he was paid something like $6 mill, when he was undoubtedly not worth all $6 mill, but maybe more around $2-3 mill. As for my predictions, I'll say Esteban gets 16, Mark 15, Garland 13, Show 11 and our #5 starter(s) 7....I believe it's a total of 62 combined wins from our rotation. I hope that is proved wrong and they win about 75-80. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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