southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4239739/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Ugh you mo-fo... I was just about to post this. I find it very interesting that Disney is so far in debt... with all the success in the movie business alone the past 5 years. Makes no sense.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 Ugh you mo-fo... I was just about to post this. I find it very interesting that Disney is so far in debt... with all the success in the movie business alone the past 5 years. Makes no sense.. Disney's management is a mess. There are two factions really in-fighting and the company is lost right now. There is a group of Disneys and their is a group behind Eisner, and they are too busy fighting each other to get much done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pale Hose Jon Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 They have 54 billion laying around. How bout you spend that money on getting some decent channels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Disney's management is a mess. There are two factions really in-fighting and the company is lost right now. There is a group of Disneys and their is a group behind Eisner, and they are too busy fighting each other to get much done. Eisner is sucking the creative life out of the company right now. Between closing the Orlando animation studio and not being able to get things squared aqay with Steve Jobs and Pixar, they lost 2/3 of their animation muscle in a less than 2 week period. I don't like the idea of a ComCast takeover, but Eisner needs to go. If he was voted out several years ago, then Jeff Katzenburger (sp?) would pprobably not have initiated the first creative brain drain that gave rise to Dreamworks SKG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 Eisner is sucking the creative life out of the company right now. Between closing the Orlando animation studio and not being able to get things squared aqay with Steve Jobs and Pixar, they lost 2/3 of their animation muscle in a less than 2 week period. I don't like the idea of a ComCast takeover, but Eisner needs to go. Roy Disney thinks the exact samething. It would be an interesting vertical pairing though. Much along the line of what AOL-TimeWarner failed at. It would be interesting to see if they could pull this off, or if they are just as mismatched as AOL-TimeWarner were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 I don't like the idea of a ComCast takeover, but Eisner needs to go. I thought he was supposed to step down last year or something like that...I guess either I imagined it or it never happened for whatever reason... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyKongerko Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Disney has had some pretty s***ty movies lately like Pearl Harbor. Finding Nemo was good but Pixar and Disney have cut ties and now Disney is banking on the ABC Network. I think Comcast would help Disney out alot but this would also launch them near the top of media company standings. This is a pretty huge merger from a monopoly standpoint. Either way, someone besides Michael Eisner should be running Disney after his latest scandals about denying members to board meetings. Also, the last Disney family member has left the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 I thought he was supposed to step down last year or something like that...I guess either I imagined it or it never happened for whatever reason... Roy tried to force the issue last year, and several years earlier as well the first time Roy left the board. This time around it centered around Disney's stupid mandatory retirement age which meant Roy had to go based on his age. I think the pairing is somewhat better than AOL/Time-Warner, because you have at least two bricks and mortar institutions and not a bunch of virtual assets like AOL. I just think that Disney/ABC/ESPN/GoNetwork has already spread itself out as an entertainment juggernaut to the detriment of its core animation/family film and theme park operations. There used to be a day when competition actually spurred companies to make a better in-house product. Now it's easier just to buy up all competing interests so there is no competition and no reason to put out a quality product. Walt himself was no saint, despite the corporate spin to the contrary. He was a bear to work for, was a puritanical father with some freaky mother issues, and was not all that generous an employer. But he was completely involved in every animated feature right up until Cinderella (when Disneyland took up more of his time), and then again in the features of the 60s right up until he died during production of Jungle Book. His role as a central visionary is what allowed almost impossible film projects to get done. Glenn Keane may have been the closest thing to filling those shoes, but as a Directing animator he had enough other duties that allowed him to work on only every second or third film. Plus I don't think he was nearly as agile and fluid in jumping styles as Walt was. I had high hopess for Chris Sanders from the Florida group to really become a visionary for the animation studios, but I don't know how he is going to gel with the Burbank group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 FSJ, out of curiousity are you a DIS shareholder? If you don't mind answering that is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Pearl Harbor, which costs $135 million to make, made Box Office Total: $197,761,540 VHS Rentals Total: $31,920,000 And that doesn't include DVD and VHS sales. Sounds like it did OK to me.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 FSJ, out of curiousity are you a DIS shareholder? If you don't mind answering that is... I was, but I am not any more. My folks are still shareholders, and the $5 billion over-valuation of the Disney stock by CoCast will probably look pretty appealing to them, but I think a merger would only make it harder to concentrate on core missions. Despite the immensity of the WDW property here, until a few years ago I thought Disney still had a pretty good conservation ethic. The property was primarily already citrus grove, and they did not take out much environmentally super-valuable land as they built. I think they have lost some of that stewardship perspective and profit now outweighs all other decisions. I have tried to stay "green" with what few investments I have. Disney is very progressive on things like health care for partners of gay employees, and they should be applauded for that. They are the unofficial hosts of a "Gay Days" celebration weekend (much to the consternation of the Florida Fire and Brimstone bunch) that I usually bring my family out in support of. But they used 9-11 as an excuse to cut workers just like other industries, when their financial hardships were largely preexisting and not at all linked to slowing tourism. And they have cut a lot of corners for the sake of the bottom line and it shows now. I shell out for season park passes for my family every year (the money that would probably go for Sox season tix if I was up there), and even though we still go, there is just a lot less commitment to quality all around now - not that it ever was as great as the company would have you believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 I find it very interesting that Disney is so far in debt... with all the success in the movie business alone the past 5 years. Makes no sense.. Success in movie business is a funny concept. You would think that if a flick cost 50 mill to make and 20 to promote and ends up pulling in just a little over 100 Mill in BO, that's a nice 30 Mill gain, isn't? Wrong. To be truly profitable, it has to gross 200 Mill or more-- there's an actual 3:1 ratio applied. One of the reasons why My Big Fat Greek Wedding was much more profitable than Minority Report. Etc. Of course the DVD/rental circuit helps alot....but you'd be surprised (or not) how much the target revenue has to be. I guess the whole industry is in its bloat period or the Disney management is just incompetent or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Disney's management is a mess. There are two factions really in-fighting and the company is lost right now. There is a group of Disneys and their is a group behind Eisner, and they are too busy fighting each other to get much done. Roy Disney doesn't want Eisner in any more. So there is an attempt to get him kicked out and as SS2K4 said, it's turning into a real ugly power struggle. Disney also recently stopped all hand drawn animation and closed down one of their major studios that was devoted to that. They've seen the success of Pixar with computer animation so Disney wants to devote to that. Disney doesn't seem to realize that Pixar's movies are good not because of computer animation but because their stories are so much better. But alas, they're devoting their efforts to computer animation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Pearl Harbor, which costs $135 million to make, made Box Office Total: $197,761,540 VHS Rentals Total: $31,920,000 And that doesn't include DVD and VHS sales. Sounds like it did OK to me.. The actual cost of producing, pimping and distributing PH was significanty higher than 130 Mill. But it did break even, thanks to NABO, WBO, rentals, cable and sales. There was no (serious) after-tax money to be made for the studio when the dust cleared around 2001. Michael Bay is no longer their golden pony for that very reason. 3:1 ratio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Roy Disney doesn't want Eisner in any more. So there is an attempt to get him kicked out and as SS2K4 said, it's turning into a real ugly power struggle. Disney also recently stopped all hand drawn animation and closed down one of their major studios that was devoted to that. They've seen the success of Pixar with computer animation so Disney wants to devote to that. Disney doesn't seem to realize that Pixar's movies are good not because of computer animation but because their stories are so much better. But alas, they're devoting their efforts to computer animation. Wow. I seriously hope you are incorrect in the statement that the Burbank is completely giving up on trad animation. I know they have been moving towerd mor digital process for several years. But the character animation, at least the keyframes, have always been hand drawn. The studio went to Xerox-transfering the pencil sketches to cells way back in the 60s - you can see the difference in the softer, rougher lines on Dalmations and Jungle Book compared to the films that came before and used hand-inking from pencil sketches. They have slowly been doing more color inking with digital processes, actually starting back around Lion King and relying less and less on manual cell painting. Digital in-betweening has been the most recent move, and it means that maybe only 4-6 of the 24 frames per second in an animated feature is actually hand drawn these days. But if they do away with hand-drawn keyframes they will have lost sight of the forest for the trees. As the last survivors of the "9 Old Men," The A-Team of Disney's Golden Era of animation, Ollie Johnston and Frank Thomas (no, not THAT Frank Thomas) have got to be livid. They need to give Roy a call and help Eisner out the door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Wow. I seriously hope you are incorrect in the statement that the Burbank is completely giving up on trad animation. I know they have been moving towerd mor digital process for several years. But the character animation, at least the keyframes, have always been hand drawn. The studio went to Xerox-transfering the pencil sketches to cells way back in the 60s - you can see the difference in the softer, rougher lines on Dalmations and Jungle Book compared to the films that came before and used hand-inking from pencil sketches. They have slowly been doing more color inking with digital processes, actually starting back around Lion King and relying less and less on manual cell painting. Digital in-betweening has been the most recent move, and it means that maybe only 4-6 of the 24 frames per second in an animated feature is actually hand drawn these days. But if they do away with hand-drawn keyframes they will have lost sight of the forest for the trees. As the last survivors of the "9 Old Men," The A-Team of Disney's Golden Era of animation, Ollie Johnston and Frank Thomas (no, not THAT Frank Thomas) have got to be livid. They need to give Roy a call and help Eisner out the door. I talked to one of my friends who is really hardcore into Disney, owns stock and everything and he said that they are killing traditional animation in favor of computer generated animation simply because they see the bottom line dollar figure that Pixar is making more money. My friend and I were pissed too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan420 Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Please comcast please bring back my child hood show of Gummy Bears. i havent seen it in years, but once in awhile i look for it and it is never on. Best cartoon out there hands down!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Please comcast please bring back my child hood show of Gummy Bears. i havent seen it in years Have you ever been decieved by your childhood memories? First time for everything, I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan420 Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Have you ever been decieved by your childhood memories? First time for everything, I guess. nah im still 19 years young. its sort of like tale spin. i love those old cartoons. they are quality cartoons unlike the extremly old ones and most of the newer ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Unrelated story has Disney back in the headlines, the first castmember death at Magic Kingdom in almost exactly 5 years. The last castmember to die in an accident fell from the (now gone) Skyway to Tomorrowland ride. Today, it was a castmember dressed as Pluto in a Disney parade run over by a float... The story: Costumed Disney worker killed By Sean Mussenden | Sentinel Staff Writer Posted February 11, 2004, 5:11 PM EST A Disney worker was killed during a parade at the Magic Kingdom this afternoon, rescue officials said. The worker, a costumed character taking part in an afternoon parade, was killed about 3:15 p.m., said Bo Jones, assistant chief of the Reedy Creek Fire Department. "It was a costumed character, but I don't know which one," Jones said. Jones was unable to confirm reports that the worker was killed after being hit by a float. Though unaware of the cause, Jones said the accident occurred in a backstage area, out of sight of guests. Jones said the Orange County Sheriff's Office was looking into the death. Disney officials did not immediately return calls for comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Unrelated story has Disney back in the headlines, the first castmember death at Magic Kingdom in almost exactly 5 years. The last castmember to die in an accident fell from the (now gone) Skyway to Tomorrowland ride. Today, it was a castmember dressed as Pluto in a Disney parade run over by a float... The story: Costumed Disney worker killed By Sean Mussenden | Sentinel Staff Writer Posted February 11, 2004, 5:11 PM EST A Disney worker was killed during a parade at the Magic Kingdom this afternoon, rescue officials said. The worker, a costumed character taking part in an afternoon parade, was killed about 3:15 p.m., said Bo Jones, assistant chief of the Reedy Creek Fire Department. "It was a costumed character, but I don't know which one," Jones said. Jones was unable to confirm reports that the worker was killed after being hit by a float. Though unaware of the cause, Jones said the accident occurred in a backstage area, out of sight of guests. Jones said the Orange County Sheriff's Office was looking into the death. Disney officials did not immediately return calls for comment. my guess is it was Dopey... he seems like he'd fall in front of a float moving at 2.5 MPH and get killed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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