Mel Gibson

[Soxy]

Was that a shot at me?

 

My apologies, I meant no misogyny by using "himself."  "Itself" probably would have been better.

Oh, no way, not a shot at you, not a shot at anyone. I would say that less than 10% of people actually use non-gendered language to describe God, so no worries. It just always makes my day when people don't. And it doesn't bother me when people use it--but it always gives me a warm fuzzy when inclusionary language is used.

[Steff]

The irony in the statement "you got it right" from someone who was not there and is taking the words of the side they choose to believe as gospel (no pun intended...)

 

 

That's all. Climb back on your bibles..

[Queen Prawn]

The irony in the statement "you got it right" from someone who was not there and is taking the words of the side they choose to believe as gospel (no pun intended...)

-> Steff

[baggio202]

Wait, so god creates all of mankind in his own image, then he decides that some of us are going straight to hell? 

 

Well, needless to say, I wouldn't give that theory an ounce of credit.  However, if it is true, god can go f*** himself.

one thing that non believers like about the pre-destination christians is since they believe a person's fate is already sealed , they dont believe in evangalizing....so they dont have to worry about one trying to convert them

[IlliniBob72]

OK, I finally decided to put in the time and read this thread and found a few things interesting.

 

1. The movie and Gibson are being bashed for being anti-Semitic, but at the same time I haven't read anything that says anything is made up or veers from the Bible story. If the movie follows the Bible, maybe the problem isn't that the movie is anti-Semitic but that the Bible is. While that may indeed be the case, many Christians believe every word of the Bible is true. That may seem insane to some and faith to others. I realize that some poetic license was taken in the writing of the Gospels to demonstrate that Jesus was the Messiah, but many many people read it literally.

 

2. There was talk about how surprising it is that many people believe the Bible is true. Again, it's a thing called faith. I don't believe Noah lived to be 890 years old, but people believe it because the Bible tells them so. People have faith in an invisible being that has no beginning and no end, is everywhere and knows everything, so why is believing that Moses parted the Red Sea so outlandish?

 

3. I believe I read a book by Crassan entitled "Is the Bible True?". I think it was him. It was a good book but I had one problem with it. It went into detail trying to explain events described and stories and tried to debunk some of them. But one major factor was dismissed...THIS WAS THE SON OF GOD!!!! You can't tell me that Jesus did not cure the man of blindness because of this or that because being the Son of God the rules didn't apply to him. I kept saying this to myself as I read the book, "But this was Jesus!".

 

4. Has Judas gotten a bum rap? The idea of seeing the future also makes me wonder about this. Judas was told by Jesus that he would betray him...did Judas have a choice then? The idea that people can see the future, does that mean there is an element of predestination? Kind of like "Minority Report".

[BrandoFan]

Wait, so god creates all of mankind in his own image, then he decides that some of us are going straight to hell?

 

Yeah, I know.... :headshake

 

Well, needless to say, I wouldn't give that theory an ounce of credit. However, if it is true, god can go f*** himself.

 

Part of me is like that, too. f*** him/her/it if that's indeed the case.

 

But another part of me is scared s***less (to say nothing of blood-curdling sadness that it was all for naught) that God is indeed vengeaful, shallow, vain, stupid, unpunctual, ruthless, impatient, apathetic and all the other patently human epithets that could be inferred from many Bible teachings/events, the Church rhetoric and of course the human experience itself.

[Queen Prawn]

But another part of me is scared s***less that God is indeed vengeaful, shallow, vain, stupid, unpunctual, ruthless, impatient, apathetic and all the other patently human epithets that could be inferred from many Bible teachings/events, the Church rhetoric and of course human experience itself.

If God is like this, we are all screwed!

[BrandoFan]

If God is like this, we are all screwed! 

Then I'll see you in Hell, F14 you sexy lil' playful thing, ya.

 

[Queen Prawn]

Then I'll see you in Hell, F14 you sexy lil' playful thing, ya.

 

LOL!

 

Brian said he'd hold the door/gate for me so you can meet him too!

[Wong & Owens]

But another part of me is scared s***less (to say nothing of blood-curdling sadness that it was all for naught) that God is indeed vengeaful, shallow, vain, stupid, unpunctual, ruthless, impatient, apathetic and all the other patently human epithets that could be inferred from many Bible teachings/events, the Church rhetoric and of course the human experience itself.

Yeah, the "Earth is God's Ant Farm" theory.

 

Well, I guess that if I have any faith at all, it is that the creator, supreme, non-gender-specific being, whatever wouldn't have any of those traits. Those attributes are mainly human-only, some found in other animals as well, and whatever stuck us here is beyond human, IMO.

[1549]

My only problem with predestination is that many who push it as a theology exclude free will.  God gives us free will to choose what we will do, including whether or not we will accept him.  I think of predestination less like God picking and choosing people and more like God just knowing ahead of time what we are going to choose.  It is a small distinction but an important one IMHO.

My only question is: If God knows everything we are going to do, than why are we here?

[BrandoFan]

OK, I finally decided to put in the time and read this thread and found a few things interesting.

 

1. The movie and Gibson are being bashed for being anti-Semitic, but at the same time I haven't read anything that says anything is made up or veers from the Bible story. If the movie follows the Bible, maybe the problem isn't that the movie is anti-Semitic but that the Bible is. While that may indeed be the case, many Christians believe every word of the Bible is true. That may seem insane to some and faith to others. I realize that some poetic license was taken in the writing of the Gospels to demonstrate that Jesus was the Messiah, but many many people read it literally. 

 

2. There was talk about how surprising it is that many people believe the Bible is true. Again, it's a thing called faith. I don't believe Noah lived to be 890 years old, but people believe it because the Bible tells them so. People have faith in an invisible being that has no beginning and no end, is everywhere and knows everything, so why is believing that Moses parted the Red Sea so outlandish?

 

3. I believe I read a book by Crassan entitled "Is the Bible True?". I think it was him. It was a good book but I had one problem with it. It went into detail trying to explain events described and stories and tried to debunk some of them. But one major factor was dismissed...THIS WAS THE SON OF GOD!!!! You can't tell me that Jesus did not cure the man of blindness because of this or that because being the Son of God the rules didn't apply to him. I kept saying this to myself as I read the book, "But this was Jesus!".

 

4. Has Judas gotten a bum rap? The idea of seeing the future also makes me wonder about this. Judas was told by Jesus that he would betray him...did Judas have a choice then? The idea that people can see the future, does that mean there is an element of predestination? Kind of like "Minority Report".

1. Didn't CW already go over this, many, many times? Mel Gibson's denomination is the definition of gospelic and historical selectivity, of hypocrisy and bigotry. It's not the Bible....although its ahistorical nature certainly "helps".

 

Did I also not tell you in the abortion thread that using your noggin' in just the right way, you can JUSTIFY/EXPLAIN/DEBUNK almost anything and everything.

 

For instance, I can make a connection between a single birth of an unwanted child into the already over-populated disbalanced world, to a person(s) grossely unqualified to rear it.....invariably leads to "extra" poverty, misery, sickness, destruction and early death of 10,000 people 150 years from now. By making a conscious decision to have that "extra" child, you basically, in some way, commit oppression/genocide. And so forth.

 

So it's extremely EASY for a hateful-but-smart-as-a-whip individual to make a case for not only Jews killing Christ, but also for God wanting Jews to suffer/die for this reason or that. Complete with examples, textual evidence, sound arguementation, etc. Hitler was one of the more prominent examples. Mel Gibson is just a putz, but don't put anything past him or his daddy-o Hutton. Cinema can be a destructive tool in the wrong hands. I hope I am wrong about Passions.

 

2. Hey, don't look at me. Moses might have parted the Red Sea, or it might have been caused by a cataclysmic event, or else was totally hallucinated or made-up. Maybe it shouldn't be taken literally. Who knows. Not me.

 

3. I am a big fan of everything metaphorical, mystical, miraculous, etc....But come-f***ing-on -- this is even worse than #1 because at least there you had to come up with hard evidence, make logical connections and a good deal of waxing abtract....Whereas here you could simply defer to your "faith" and to God's great Everything-ness -- and it ends the debate......."But this was Jesus!" exactly.

 

Another reason why government, military, medicine, economy, science, education, etc must all remain as secularized as possible. Hell, if I were in a Mark Twanian mood, I'd probably call for the secularization of the Church....

 

4. Yep.....comparing Jesus/Pre-destination to a mediocre vision of a Phillip Dick fiction.... :headshake

[FlaSoxxJim]

3.  I am a big fan of everything metaphorical, mystical, miraculous, etc....But come-f***ing-on --  this is even worse than #1 because at least there you had to come  up with hard evidence, make logical connections and a good deal of waxing abtract....Whereas here you could simply defer to your "faith" and to God's great Everything-ness -- and it ends the debate......."But this was Jesus!" exactly.

Y'know, as critical as I am about most other instances where Biblical events are presented as fact (literal or abstracted), I usually give the Jesus miracle stories. For any sort of Christian (I disqualify myself), the "this is JESUS" argument has to hold water. We have heard all the Jesus miracles rationalized away, from water to wine, to walking on water and calming the sea, to feeding the masses with a half-order of fish & chips, curing the blind, raising the dead, etc.

 

If you don't believe the Jesus miracle stories, then even if you believe there is a higher power your are not a Christian. Jews and Muslims both accept Jesus as an important prophet, but fall short of ascribing him divinity. Recovering Catholics like me may still think Jesus was most excellent and most loving but still human. For Christians, though, Jesus is at the heart of it all, and for me to have any kind of meaningful dialogue on matters of Christianity, I have to take those stories as read to approach any of it the right way. And even the Christians who's conception of Jesus is as a half man/half God haven't got where they're supposed to be. A central Mystery of the faith is that Jesus was ALL HUMAN and ALL DIVINE. You either never could wrap your brain around that one (like me), or you accepted it as an article of your faith belief even though it's not for man to ever fully understand.

 

Christians who accept the collected Miracles of the Nazz are merely professing their faith. Love and compassion for your fellow man is the upthrust of Jesus' life anyway (unlike much of the bible). It's not that far away from my own more secular guide to muddling through it all: Love and do what you will.

 

Now, anyone who wants to date the Earth, explain animal distributions, put any race over any other, or rationalize hate-mongering, intolerance, WAR, etc., with the rest of the stories between the covers of the Good Book -- those are the folks I tend to take to task.

[IlliniBob72]

1. Didn't CW already go over this, many, many times? Mel Gibson's denomination is the definition of gospelic and historical selectivity, of hypocrisy and bigotry. It's not the Bible....although its ahistorical nature certainly "helps".

 

Did I also not tell you in the abortion thread that using your noggin'  in just the right way, you can JUSTIFY/EXPLAIN/DEBUNK almost anything and everything.

 

For instance, I can make a connection between a single birth of an unwanted child into the already over-populated disbalanced world, to a person(s) grossely unqualified to rear it.....invariably leads to "extra" poverty, misery, sickness, destruction and early death of 10,000 people 150 years from now. By making a conscious decision to have that "extra" child, you basically, in some way, commit oppression/genocide. And so forth.

 

So it's extremely EASY for a hateful-but-smart-as-a-whip individual to make a case for not only Jews killing Christ, but also for God wanting Jews to suffer/die for this reason or that. Complete with examples, textual evidence, sound arguementation, etc.  Hitler was one of the more prominent examples. Mel Gibson is just a putz, but don't put anything past him or his daddy-o Hutton.  Cinema can be a destructive tool in the wrong hands. I hope I am wrong about Passions.

 

2.  Hey, don't look at me. Moses might have parted the Red Sea, or it might have been caused by a cataclysmic event,  or else was totally hallucinated or made-up. Maybe it shouldn't be taken literally.  Who knows.  Not me.

 

3.  I am a big fan of everything metaphorical, mystical, miraculous, etc....But come-f***ing-on --  this is even worse than #1 because at least there you had to come  up with hard evidence, make logical connections and a good deal of waxing abtract....Whereas here you could simply defer to your "faith" and to God's great Everything-ness -- and it ends the debate......."But this was Jesus!" exactly.   

 

Another reason why government, military, medicine, economy, science,  education, etc must all remain as secularized as possible. Hell, if I were in a Mark Twanian mood, I'd probably call for the secularization of the Church....  

 

4.  Yep.....comparing Jesus/Pre-destination to a mediocre vision of a Phillip Dick fiction.... :headshake

1. I'm not talking about Gibson's faith or denomination. All I said and you pooh-poohed was that it sounds like this movie is an interpretation of the Bible. Exactly what Cubkilla and Fan14 said before. That wasn't disproved by cw, you, or anyone else. I didn't comment on MG's motives. I haven't seen the movie so I can't comment on anymore than I've read about it.

 

3. "Come-f***ing-on" about what? Saying that it isn't possible to analyze something miraculous with science? How can you? Isn't that the very essence of a miracle?

 

4. Have you made it your goal to fill the void left by BMR? I didn't mean to compare Jesus to a fiction novel. I was just pointing out that that movie illustrated my question...if your future is already known, does it mean it is pre-ordained and cannot be changed? It was a reference that popped into my head, but since I can expect you to chime in with a smartass comment, I'll be sure to put more thought into my posts. I wouldn't want to get a :headshake from the new Dan Bernstein of the board.

[FlaSoxxJim]

1. I'm not talking about Gibson's faith or denomination. All I said and you pooh-poohed was that it sounds like this movie is an interpretation of the Bible. Exactly what Cubkilla and Fan14 said before. That wasn't disproved by cw, you, or anyone else. I didn't comment on MG's motives. I haven't seen the movie so I can't comment on anymore than I've read about it.

Only as a point of clarification, Bob, as cw and a lot of news articles have pointed out, the primary source for a lot of Gibson's version that ended up on screen was NOT from the Gospels but from the visions of Anne Catherine Emmerich. These have been described as very unsettling, gruesome, and very anti-semitic.

 

I don't kow if that was noted in this thread, as I have lost track of the multiple threads on the topic on this board and the Sox mlb board (Is it distressing that the underwhelming Sox off-season has led us all to armchair theology as a diversion?!)

[IlliniBob72]

It was mentioned that she had visions of stigmata and the crucifixion and anti-semitism. That really doesn't tell me anything. I just saw an interview he gave and he claims it's based on the gospels. I'll take that with a grain of salt. But he also said something else I found interesting. He said exactly what some other poster here said...that mankind is responsible for the death of Jesus, himself included. I don't know Mel Gibson nor what he believes, but if he believes what he said, that mankind, Jews included, are responsible for the death of Jesus, it stands to reason that he wouldn't agree with exempting them.

 

I am not particularly a fan of Gibson's. I'm just reading this as someone on a jury, and if I were on a jury trying Gibson for being an anti-Semetic crazy, I'd say the case is bulls***. Who gives a f*** what Daddy Gibson has to say? My dad thinks the Bears are worth $5000 a year in season tickets. If that's not the definition of loony tunes, I don't know what is. Before some early twentysomething kid wants to try to show off his education again, I am not comparing being a Bears fan with being an anti-Semite. I am saying that little Mel shouldn't have his dad's nutjob beliefs held up as evidence against him.

 

If Gibson is guilty of anything in my mind, it's of having a strict belief in the Bible. He believes non-Catholics are condemned to hell. Unfortunate, but OK. My mother believes that my unbaptized baby will go to hell if, God forbid, he were to die. I don't believe that, but that's her belief. My ex-wife thought that all non-Christians are condemned to hell. I asked what about Amazon tribesmen whose only sin is not being introduced to Christ...they too are going to hell, according to her. My ex-father-in-law believed the Bible literally. Adam lived to be 967 years old in the Bible, well, then he did. I didn't think they were nutjobs, just had different beliefs than I did.

 

Also, I consider myself a Republican, but I don't believe in it's entire platform. You could say that since I'm a Republican that I am against gay marriage and homosexuality in general. You'd be wrong. His belonging to a sect of Catholicism that won't disavow the Jews culpability in the death of Christ is proof of s***.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Nearly everything you are saying is reasonable, and I certainly believe the general rule that the son should not be punished for the sins of the father.

 

But, Mel Gibson completely sidestepped the issues at hand during the Prime Time interview. When asked if he shared his fathers views he refused to answer either way, saying only 'I will not speak out against my father.' Is saying "Actually I'm not a carbon copy of my dad and although I love him we do disagree on certain things" speaking out against him? By NOT answering the question at all, I think he spoke volumes on the subject. By feigning shock and surprise/indignation when it was pointed out to him that the Emmerich visions are chock-full of anti-semitism, it demonstrates either that he has not studied the source material closely enough before making the film or that he is as blind to his prejudices as his father is to his.

 

From all accounts, this is a very powerful film. But, the way Jewish community members (even film critics) have been systematically and intentionally excluded from pre-screenings only invites scrutiny. And making pre-viewers sign a release swearing they will not say anything negative about the film before the release - while at the same time encouraging positive commentary - is more than a little paranoid.

 

There's so many wierd things about the film. Mel is still ascribing the "It is as it was" quote to the Pope, even though the Vatican has apparently now thought better of associating itself with a secular, commercial product. There was direct communication from Vatican officials to the film's promoters telling them to run with that quote, true, but they then backed away from it without much explanation. It was odd that the Papal seal of approval was so urgently sought and so rashly dispensed, given that Mel considers the Papacy a sham since V2.

[BrandoFan]

I just saw an interview he gave and he claims it's based on the gospels

 

There was your first mistake.

 

Believing what that ignorant bigoted tool actually says in a heavily edited interview that could have made or broken the movie's BO/his career and for which he had the better part of 4 years to prepare for. FSJ pointed out a few of the more telling moments.

 

His comparing Jews to Nazis even though the Romans were the ones playing the role of Nazis was hysterical. I literally laughed outloud. You see, he doesn't hate the Germans for what.....

 

If you do not buy into what CW or others say, do some research. The anti-Semitism charge transcends the "literalist interpretation" of the vaguely anti-semitic and ahistorical new testament and gospels.

[baggio202]

Nearly everything you are saying is reasonable, and I certainly believe the general rule that the son should not be punished for the sins of the father.

 

But, Mel Gibson completely sidestepped the issues at hand during the Prime Time interview.  When asked if he shared his fathers views he refused to answer either way, saying only 'I will not speak out against my father.'  Is saying "Actually I'm not a carbon copy of my dad and although I love him we do disagree on certain things" speaking out against him?  By NOT answering the question at all, I think he spoke volumes on the subject.  By feigning shock and surprise/indignation when it was pointed out to him that the Emmerich visions are chock-full of anti-semitism, it demonstrates either that he has not studied the source material closely enough before making the film or that he is as blind to his prejudices as his father is to his.

 

From all accounts, this is a very powerful film.  But, the way Jewish community members (even film critics) have been systematically and intentionally excluded from pre-screenings only invites scrutiny.  And making pre-viewers sign a release swearing they will not say anything negative about the film before the release - while at the same time encouraging positive commentary - is more than a little paranoid.

 

There's so many wierd things about the film.  Mel is still ascribing the "It is as it was" quote to the Pope, even though the Vatican has apparently now thought better of associating itself with a secular, commercial product.  There was direct communication from Vatican officials to the film's promoters telling them to run with that quote, true, but they then backed away from it without much explanation.  It was odd that the Papal seal of approval was so urgently sought and so rashly dispensed, given that Mel considers the Papacy a sham since V2.

mel gibson did not side step the interview....they have the transcript of what he said on NBC channel 5 news tonight..."he said do i believe the holocust happened??yes , of course i do..and it was a terrible thing"..he went into a more detailed answer but thats all i remember...even the commentator on nbc5 news said gibson said he disagrees with his father on this issue..

 

so how is that sidestepping the issue???

 

refusing to talk bad about his father is not agreeing with his dad...it is what it is (haha - sorry -couldnt resist )...its refusing to talk bad about his father...and the new york times reporter or whoever it was that went after gibson's father should be fired for what he did...because he has an issue with mel gibson he goes and manipulates his father...what does mel gibson's father have to do with this anyways???...

 

can you give me an example of emmerich's visions being anti-semetic???...honestly i have no clue what her visions were other than they were suppose to be so much more violent than what was written in the scriptures...i never even heard of her prior to this movie..but everytime a reporter or tv show brings up her visions being anti-semetic , they never expound on that..

[BrandoFan]

mel gibson did not side step the interview....they have the transcript of what he said on NBC channel 5 news tonight..."he said do i believe the holocust happened??yes , of course i do..and it was a terrible thing"..he went into a more detailed answer but thats all i remember...even the commentator on nbc5 news said gibson said he disagrees with his father on this issue..

 

You know...technically, thinking that only 200,000 Jews died in the concentration camps and the rest of the "damage" has been fabricated by the sinister Zionist Cabal IS admitting that the Holocaust happened. I am just saying.

 

Same as Bob, you admit that you're not particularly familiar with this whole issue, with Mel, his family, his church, with gospels, with Ann Catherine Krazyb****facestein, history and cause of pogroms and persecution, with Hitler's love for Passion plays, etc.

 

So how can you be so sure that you're NOT being duped, taken for a ride, hoodwinked, bamboozled?

 

That would be akin to a hockey fan with a limited exposure to baseball commenting on the ongoing steroid crisis in the MLB and using Barry Bonds's "no, I would never be on the juice....Of course not, that would go against every tenet of my faith and against the very spirit of integrity of this beautiful game!!" as some kind of proof. People say what they feel others need to hear, what's expedient and potentially profitable. Diane Sawyer has no truth wand last time I checked.

 

I have yet to see the full version of the movie myself. Mel Gibson, the manic bigoted scumbag liar that he is (and partially admits to being, btw), does not deserve any benefit of the doubt, but I will graciously accord it to him anyway.

 

Who knows, maybe he edited out all of the silly propaganda s*** and we end up being treated to the Braveheart of Nazareth, kickass Aramaic-style.

[IlliniBob72]

There was your first mistake. 

Nice use of selective quoting there. You left out the fact that my next sentence was "I'll take that with a grain of salt". Translation: I don't put much stock in that.

[baggio202]

You know...technically, thinking that only 200,000 Jews died in the concentration camps and the rest of the "damage" has been fabricated by the sinister Zionist Cabal....IS admitting that the Holocaust happened. I am just saying.

 

Same as Bob, you admit that you're not particularly familiar with this whole issue, with Mel, his family, his church, with gospels, with Ann Catherine Krazyb****facestein, history and cause of pogroms and persecution, with Hitler's love for Passions plays, etc. 

 

So how can you be so sure that you're NOT being duped, taken for a ride, hoodwinked, bamboozled?

 

 

 

I have yet to see the full version of the movie myself. Mel Gibson, the manic bigoted scumbag liar that he is (and partially admits to being, btw),  does not deserve any benefit of the doubt, but I will graciously accord it to him anyway.

i only quoted what i remember word from word from what gibson said...he did say that he believes 6 million jews died in the holocust..maybe more...i just didnt remember his exact words..

 

youre right, i dont know mel gibson..but neither do you and yet youre calling him all kinds of vile crap...kinda ruins youre credibility , dont you think???..id rather be hoodwinked by somebody because i thought they were a good person and was proven wrong then to smeer a good man's name...

 

and i am familiar with the church he is part of..i was baptized into that church..what it is is the roman catholic church prior to 1966...anyone baptized in the catholic church prior to 66 was part of it too...i went to church here in itasca that was in latin until i was about 8 years old...he is not part of some crazy cult..its just the roman catholic church teachings prior to '66...its no different then the conservative baptists breaking away from the americam baptist church because they thought the teaching were adapting too much to modern times...im sure every denomination has faced these same questions and have had groups that didnt go along with the changes and formed their own offshoot...because they have decided not to change with the times doesnt make them cults...some people need a sense of tradition in their lives...

 

again..give me an example of , as you call her " Krazyb****facestein" being anti -semetic....i still havent seen anyone give me an example and jewish leaders that have seen the movie have said that the movie itself is not anti -semetic nor do they believe gibson is....what they are concered about is christians taking the wrong message and twisting to promote hatred of jews...

 

 

its funny , jewish leaders arnt condemning gibson...but everyone else with an agenda seems to be

[baggio202]

brando...here is part of a letter to the editor of the trib from a respected rabbi...his take on mel gibson

 

...as I have watched him, I have come to the conclusion that he is not an anti-Semite at all. He is simply a believer in the fundamentals of the Gospels as he understands them. He is a man with a mission to spread what he believes to be the truth about the events of that day but, perhaps even more important, to spread the truth about belief in a power higher than ourselves. He places no blame on the Jewish people of today and said that such an attitude would be completely un-Christian.

I perceive that he is a man of complete faith who wants to transmit those beliefs to his fellow man. What I have heard is a man of faith talk about theological issues of a God-centered world, a God who really controls the world, and about the ultimate value of spirituality versus materialism.

 

Here is a man who acknowledged that he has been handed on a platter all the material goods that any man could ever want. And he imbibed with complete gusto and abandon. Yet having all of that, he realized that he was incomplete and that the ultimate goal of man is the spiritualism that seeks unity with God. It is this that motivated him to spend $25 million of his own money on producing this movie.

 

To be sure, Gibson's theology is not Jewish theology. The two are incompatible, at least from a Jewish perspective. But his belief about man's importance relative to God is almost identical with Judaism's. So instead of condemning his acts, I now applaud his motivations as having far more relevance.

 

All people of faith would do well to take a lesson for our own lives as to what is really important and what is not.

[israel4ever]

just because you are jewish doesnt mean you practice that religion it is a race.

Uh uh!!!

 

Judaism IS a religion, not a race!

 

My father (who was Jewish) was born in Poland (and was a Holocaust survivor!); that makes me Polish by nationality. (My mother (who was also Jewish) was born in the US, but, becuase she was Jewish, I am Jewish.)

[FlaSoxxJim]

mel gibson did not side step the interview....they have the transcript of what he said on NBC channel 5 news tonight..."he said do i believe the holocust happened??yes , of course i do..and it was a terrible thing"..he went into a more detailed answer but thats all i remember...even the commentator on nbc5 news said gibson said he disagrees with his father on this issue..

 

so how is that sidestepping the issue???

It was the ABC Prime Time interview from last Monday that I refer to when I say ha came off as sidestepping the issues. I don't know if the NBC material you are refering to was taped later but it sound like it may have been in which case he'd have been ready to come up with some better answers to the questions at hand.

 

Again I did not see anything on NBC (and haven't seen any interview material since Prime Time), but I don't think he or his father was unfairly treated in that. He was given a chance to distance himself from radical views of his father which he may or may not share. He refused to do so on Prime Time bacause he did not want to speak poorly of his father, but if on NBC he conceded a Holocost in whicj 6+ million Jews were killed, he did exactly what he refused to do on Monday. Now how hard was that?