israel4ever Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Yes...Daniel Pipes speaks the truth You know, the truth if you're a right wing Zionist. His comments are thinly veiled racism. And way to deflect dealing with any of the actual claims made by calling me a "liberal pussy". I guess you learned a lot about the structure of debates. Pipes is world reknown for his knowledge of radical Islam and of the Arab-Israeli conflict; he has forgotten more than you will EVER know on these topics. You, on the other hand have never quoted anyone with any shred of credibility on these topics. This is because there in no one with any credibility who takes the positions that you take. I was wrong to call you that name that I did; I apologize therefor. But you know the old saying, "If it waddles like a duck, and quacks like a duck....". BTW, your comments are racist as well, not even thinly veiled!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Pipes is world reknown for his knowledge of radical Islam and of the Arab-Israeli conflict; he has forgotten more than you will EVER know on these topics. You, on the other hand have never quoted anyone with any shred of credibility on these topics. This is because there in no one with any credibility who takes the positions that you take. I was wrong to call you that name that I did; I apologize therefor. But you know the old saying, "If it waddles like a duck, and quacks like a duck....". BTW, your comments are racist as well, not even thinly veiled!!! DUDE! I think Apu is so full of s***, and stinks and all that, but seriously, can you please quit calling everyone who even has an ounce of opposition to your views a racist? It's just not becoming. In fact, your credibility gets f'ed up every time you do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Pipes is world reknown for his knowledge of radical Islam and of the Arab-Israeli conflict; he has forgotten more than you will EVER know on these topics. You, on the other hand have never quoted anyone with any shred of credibility on these topics. This is because there in no one with any credibility who takes the positions that you take. I was wrong to call you that name that I did; I apologize therefor. But you know the old saying, "If it waddles like a duck, and quacks like a duck....". BTW, your comments are racist as well, not even thinly veiled!!! Now, I know this is pretty antithetical to your modus operandi but show me some proof of where I am a racist. Simply because I am a critic of Israeli state policy that is nothing more than glorifying thugs like Ariel Sharon does not make me a racist. One can be a critic without being a racist. I'm a critic of Bush's policy, does that make me racist against all white people? Your knee jerk reactionism is funny yet scary that you actually believe it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Now, I know this is pretty antithetical to your modus operandi but show me some proof of where I am a racist. Simply because I am a critic of Israeli state policy that is nothing more than glorifying thugs like Ariel Sharon does not make me a racist. One can be a critic without being a racist. I'm a critic of Bush's policy, does that make me racist against all white people? Your knee jerk reactionism is funny yet scary that you actually believe it. The fact that you call palestinian stone throwers (terrorists) "heroes" is racist. Glorifying people (Palestinian terrorists) who are trying to eliminate a race (religion) of people solely based on their race/religion is racist. By your way of thinking, you could hate Hitler, but admire what the Nazis did (thought) and not be a racist. That "thinking" makes no sense to me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Apu...also remember that the great Civil Rights leader Martin Luther King Jr. said that to be anti-Zionist is to be anti-Semetic!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Apu...also remember that the great Civil Rights leader Martin Luther King Jr. said that to be anti-Zionist is to be anti-Semetic!!! He also said that violence in ANY situation was wrong repeatedly. He advocated nonviolence, even when you were threatened with violence. That comparision loses all credence at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 That "thinking" makes no sense to me! Probably because you're f***ing dense. The fact that you call palestinian stone throwers (terrorists) "heroes" is racist. Glorifying people (Palestinian terrorists) who are trying to eliminate a race (religion) of people solely based on their race/religion is racist. Calling terrorists "heroes" in and of itself isn't racist. Many Palestinian terrorists are so because they believe Israel is the aggressor/is taking their land/etc, not just because Israel has a lot of Jews. More racist: Calling an entire group of people, regardless of their actions, terrorists. Apu...also remember that the great Civil Rights leader Martin Luther King Jr. said that to be anti-Zionist is to be anti-Semetic!!! Who gives a rat's ass? MLKJr opinions aren't facts just because he's a prominent figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Probably because you're f***ing dense. Calling terrorists "heroes" in and of itself isn't racist. Many Palestinian terrorists are so because they believe Israel is the aggressor/is taking their land/etc, not just because Israel has a lot of Jews. More racist: Calling an entire group of people, regardless of their actions, terrorists. Who gives a rat's ass? MLKJr opinions aren't facts just because he's a prominent figure. As opposed to your opinions, which have validity because you're such a "rocket scientist"! Shut the hell up until you can formulate an intelligent thought! :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 He also said that violence in ANY situation was wrong repeatedly. He advocated nonviolence, even when you were threatened with violence. That comparision loses all credence at that point. Since King's untimely death, it has become obvious that there are definitely times where violence is necessary, i.e.SELF DEFENSE. If you or your family, friends, loved ones or even people that you don't know are threatened with physical harm and/or death and the only way you can prevent it is by killing the aggressor(s), I feel that you are morally obligated to do so! This being said, I don't think it takes away from King's statements about Zionism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 I4E, way to not attack the point he made. Ad hominem suits you. And speaking of "defense", how is shooting kids for sport as noted by Jewish human rights organizations and how the majority of wounds suffered by Palestinians are to their backs and have been deemed clearly "offensive" not defensive wounds inflicted by the Israeli "Defense" Force. You sit there and demean the entire Palestinian people as sub-human yet call anybody who critiques rabid Zionism as an anti-Semite and a racist. Projection much? And I doubt King would know that Zionism would be used to create ethnic ghettos, erect Orwellian "security fences" and be used to justify illegal settlements and creating offensive wounds to murder and maim innocent civilians because the IDF has become a group of thugs. I think he would have saluted the 13 members of the Sayaret Metkal who have refused to serve in the occupied territories because they've seen that their usage is nothing more than being used as offensive thugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Shut the hell up until you can formulate an intelligent thought! :'( Since King's untimely death, it has become obvious that there are definitely times where violence is necessary, i.e.SELF DEFENSE. What are you talking about? King is infallible and any comment he makes is 100% correct. Just because the idea of self-defense didn't exist back in the 60s isn't an excuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 :'( What are you talking about? King is infallible and any comment he makes is 100% correct. Just because the idea of self-defense didn't exist back in the 60s isn't an excuse. You're an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Hey Crimson...you and I finally agree on something!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonWeltall Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 your inability to avoid ad hominem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 No. 1) I have no idea what ad hominem means. 2) That you are an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Since King's untimely death, it has become obvious that there are definitely times where violence is necessary, i.e.SELF DEFENSE. If you or your family, friends, loved ones or even people that you don't know are threatened with physical harm and/or death and the only way you can prevent it is by killing the aggressor(s), I feel that you are morally obligated to do so! This being said, I don't think it takes away from King's statements about Zionism. Actually if anything it strengthens the arguements for MLK. He lived his religion and beliefs until he died. He NEVER compromised his religious beliefs for nonviolence, and he wouldn't let his followers. The Zionist movement by and large has compromised the Jewish religion, which is supposed to be the basis for all Israeli claims in the first place. The point is, you can't pick and choose what is convenient to what you believe. If you want to quote the great Doctor King, don't stop when his views oppose yours. Just as the Jews shouldn't use the Torah as justifation for Israeli existance, but smash all 10 of God's commandments when it comes to their fellow man. There was no escape clause for violence against people. None. Only God can hold a man in judgement. No one else. It is hypocracy to suggest otherwise as a Jew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Actually if anything it strengthens the arguements for MLK. He lived his religion and beliefs until he died. He NEVER compromised his religious beliefs for nonviolence, and he wouldn't let his followers. The Zionist movement by and large has compromised the Jewish religion, which is supposed to be the basis for all Israeli claims in the first place. The point is, you can't pick and choose what is convenient to what you believe. If you want to quote the great Doctor King, don't stop when his views oppose yours. Just as the Jews shouldn't use the Torah as justifation for Israeli existance, but smash all 10 of God's commandments when it comes to their fellow man. There was no escape clause for violence against people. None. Only God can hold a man in judgement. No one else. It is hypocracy to suggest otherwise as a Jew. How has the Zionist movement compromised Judaism? By defending the right of the Jewish State to exist? If anything, Zionism would have strengthened the Jewish State and it's right AND ability to exist. Tell me...with re. the Israel-Palestinian situation, which of the 10 Commandments has Israel broken and how. I am very interested in your explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 How has the Zionist movement compromised Judaism? By defending the right of the Jewish State to exist? If anything, Zionism would have strengthened the Jewish State and it's right AND ability to exist. Tell me...with re. the Israel-Palestinian situation, which of the 10 Commandments has Israel broken and how. I am very interested in your explanation. How about we start with Thou Shalt not Kill???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 How about we start with Thou Shalt not Kill???? Once again...I suppose you'd rather the Israelis "turn the other chhek" and get annihilated!? Would that be a better alternative for you? Israel has been in a constant state of SELF DEFENSE since it's creation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Once again...I suppose you'd rather the Israelis "turn the other chhek" and get annihilated!? Would that be a better alternative for you? Israel has been in a constant state of SELF DEFENSE since it's creation! One more time, just to be clear. It is not what I suppose. It is what God told the Jews! God, you remember him right? You know the guy who inspired your religion? He told Moses Thou Shalt not Kill. I don't remember seeing in Exodus, an asterick. There is no justification of killing in the Torah. None. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 One more time, just to be clear. It is not what I suppose. It is what God told the Jews! God, you remember him right? You know the guy who inspired your religion? He told Moses Thou Shalt not Kill. I don't remember seeing in Exodus, an asterick. There is no justification of killing in the Torah. None. In Fantasyland, one could exist like that, living their lives 100% by the Word of G-d. Maybe there's a vacany at Walden Pond. In the real world, it is not a viable option. There are "kill or be killed" situations. You cannot "turn the other cheek" anymore, unless you like getting your ass kicked all the time! Normal people don't! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 You should read about the documentation of how leading Zionist Jews collaborated with the Nazis. It's all in the historical record during WW II. Your refusal to separate an everyday Palestinian from the fringe minority that engages in the PA shows your blatant racism. Israel has only been in a constant state of self defense because it was created where a nation already was and didn't take into consideration the people that were being displaced. This is continuing with walls that will create ghettos, banning them from their government and doing everything they can to exert their military might over the Palestinians with rocket attacks, shooting innocents (read the human rights reports documentation done by even Jewish human rights groups) and bulldozing homes. They do all this in the name of fighting terrorism but there were no rocket attacks at the home of Baruch Goldstein and others who were Israeli terrorists who opened fire with automatic weapons in a mosque shooting indiscriminately. These men have been lauded by the Israeli government, had their names honorarily given to parks and best selling books about their "heroics" have been written. Their houses were not bulldozed. That is the actions of the Likud-niks who make up a fringe group in Israel. There are a lot of Israelis who see that their government's insane actions are playing an integral role in the continual violence and condemn both Palestinian and Israeli violence because they are rapt together in the continual chain of violence. ad hominem: Appealing to personal considerations rather than to logic or reason...i.e. calling people idiots and racists instead of dealing with the argument they made. Perhaps you've heard of the book that has contributions by various Jewish authors called "The End of Zionism and the Liberation of the Jewish People"? It entails how only by ending Zionist doctrine will there be peace in the Mid-East and it details exactly how. Now, I suggest reading the book before you go off with your reactionism, I4E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Your comparison of Zionist to Nazis is blatant racism, Apu! You are without doubt a racist!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 It's not a comparison. It actually happened. Read the historical record: Leading Zionists collaborated actively with the Nazis. It's not made up, it's right in the historical record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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