Chisoxfn Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 Awesome post Brando. I agree with you on all your points when it comes to Lee. I think so many people think of his bad plays and forget about all his good ones. He's one of those players people over-analyze. Yes, he's made his mistakes, but every player does. Its kind of like the Bears, so many over analyze Dez Whites drops yet they forget all about it when Booker drops touchdown passes, something he did at least 4 times last year, which is inexcuseable. Caballo is going to be really fun to watch this year. Look at the walk numbers he put up last year. Typically you don't draw that many walks by accident. To me there are the one thing when it comes to stats that is rarely a fluke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 "The fact of the matter is, Carlos at 25 is as good as Sammy Sosa and Maggs were at that age; Carlos has as good a pure batspeed as either and is physically even more gifted " okay..i understand people sometimes exaggerate to make a point..im guilty of that as much as anyone...BUT THIS...omg....cmon..this is way overboard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 "The fact of the matter is, Carlos at 25 is as good as Sammy Sosa and Maggs were at that age; Carlos has as good a pure batspeed as either and is physically even more gifted " okay..i understand people sometimes exaggerate to make a point..im guilty of that as much as anyone...BUT THIS...omg....cmon..this is way overboard I can buy into what he says, mainly because Sosa was very talented but so is Carlos offensively. Sosa had and always will have more talent defensively. When he came up he had an amazing arm and tremendous speed as well as a live bat. Carlos will never have the speed or arm Sosa once had. As far as Maggs goes, I dont' think he was ever this amazing tools player. He was a guy that could flat out rake the ball and he made the best of his shot at the major league level. I always think of him as a surprise player thats going to eventually be an MVP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 Typically you don't draw that many walks by accident Especially as a 6th place hitter (I mean, I could understand someone drawing a ton of "undeserved" walks in front of ARod, Palmeiro, Irod and Greer...) on a non-competing team (less reason to be afraid to pitch to as far as opposing pitchers' mentality is concerned). I mean, Clayton and MJ and Rowand aren't that scary, are they? Lemme guess, Baggio, the only sentence you read (and decided to grace with a reply) was the one where I compare Carlos to Sosa. Nice to know. BTW it was obvious I meant "as good a hitter...", which is true. Just open your eyes and watch Carlos take the ball of his shoe tips and hit it 400 feet to LF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 Especially as a 6th place hitter (I mean, I could understand someone drawing a ton of "undeserved" walks in front of ARod, Palmeiro, Irod and Greer...) on a non-competing team (less reason to be afraid to pitch to as far as opposing pitchers' mentality is concerned). I mean, Clayton and MJ and Rowand aren't that scary, are they? I don't know if you said that wrong, but if you are hitting in front of one of the better hitters, your not going to draw walks. No way would they walk you to face Alex Rodriguez with a runner on. The one player that gets undeserved walks would be someone hitting the 8 slot in the national league becuase they wouldn't want to give him much to hit with the pitcher hitting behind him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 I don't know if you said that wrong ROTFLMAO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 Typically you don't draw that many walks by accident Especially as a 6th place hitter (I mean, I could understand someone drawing a ton of "undeserved" walks in front of ARod, Palmeiro, Irod and Greer...) on a non-competing team (less reason to be afraid to pitch to as far as opposing pitchers' mentality is concerned). I mean, Clayton and MJ and Rowand aren't that scary, are they? Lemme guess, Baggio, the only sentence you read (and decided to grace with a reply) was the one where I compare Carlos to Sosa. Nice to know. BTW it was obvious I meant "as good a hitter...", which is true. Just open your eyes and watch Carlos take the ball of his shoe tips and hit it 400 feet to LF. wait a minute....you said carlos was more "physically giftyed" then maggs or sosa...i dont think anyone would take that to mean you were just talking about his hitting...physical tools mean ,strength , speed ,agility , quickness..atributes like that..no one here could say carlos has better skills in those catagories than maggs does but if your just talkign about hitting...to compare carlos to maggs and say carlos has more physical tools is rediculous..there is no comparison here....maggs raked at the big league level from day one...maggs has a very short compact swing that rifles through the strike zone...maggs is so strong that when he tries to check swing his bat is already going so fast that he tends to injure himself trying to stop the swing...thats why you see him grabbing his wrists..its a similiar problem to what durazo has with arizona..only he ends breaking bones in his wrists...hawk has commented more than once that maggs phyiscal tools are remarkable...that he is so gifted both physically and mentally and that you just dont see that combination too often... carlos has a long looping swing...which is why you see him chasing a lot of pitches in the dirt...he does not have good bat speed..its average at best...one thing carlos has going for him is that he big and strong...if carlos did have great bat speed with his size and strength he would hit a lot more than 26 homers and thats his career high...if carlos did have better physical tools that maggs possesses he would be a better hitter than maggs..he's not now and never will be... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bighurt52235 Posted February 12, 2003 Author Share Posted February 12, 2003 I agree with Chisoxfn on that. I think you said it wrong. Out of sheer curiosity, what the hell does ROTFLMAO mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 I agree with Chisoxfn on that. I think you said it wrong. Out of sheer curiosity, what the hell does ROTFLMAO mean? Rolling On The Floor Laughing My Ass Off...some people put an F in there for laughing my f'ing ass off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bighurt52235 Posted February 12, 2003 Author Share Posted February 12, 2003 Thank you. I figured the laughing my ass off part, but was confused about the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox247 Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 ROFLMTO..thats the real deal there..laughing my teeth off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 he does not have good bat speed He has old Sosa-ian swing: long and extremely quick. The reason he only hit 26 homers is that he has holes in it and because he doesn't see the pitch often until it's too late and because he has little discipline. Not because his batspeed is "average". Sandy Alomar and Frank Thomas have average batspeed. Carlos has excellent one. With maturity he showed last year and with a bettter eye/anticipation, he will put the batspeed to great use. While Maggs's batspeed is not slower than that of Carlos or Konerko, his total swing itself is shorter and more economic and, when combined with his eye, makes for a better contact. He is also not as strong as you give him credit for; the reason he has wrists problems is the same reason Paul Konerko and Garciappara will have them too: namely, their wrists are thin, almost girlishly so. (Constrast Delgado or Tejada or Sheffield and their "steel wrists" that geenrate tremendeous batspeed. ). There is (much) more to being a great hitter than batspeed and it took Carlos 3 years to learn that. Have you asdked yourself why Manny Ramirez, Edgar, Larry Walker (in his prime) and lately Lois Ganzalez are/were such great hitters? They have excellent vision and technique and don't get rattled under pressure and don't expand their strike-zone. Combine that with very good batspeed and you have HOF caliber hitter. Heck, Barry Bonds and Canseco had struggled for many years all the while Albert Belle and Frank Thomas with their pretty average batspeed excelled? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Without getting into the nitpicking of various points, which I understand is half the fun in here.... I think Brandofan's post about Carlos was well thought out and well written. Carlos has his flaws, but he is an asset to this club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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