chg027 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 This was in the Daily South Town http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/ds.../pro/121sd3.htm Wunsch isn't the only player who isn't drawing much interest on the trade market. According to Williams, teams just aren't looking to pull the trigger on a deal this early in the season. "There are not very many clubs that feel comfortable enough with their position to want to be aggressively pursuing deals at this point," Williams said. "Generally, it takes a couple of months into the season for people to feel comfortable enough to start playing with their roster." Not Williams, however. "We're always in that mode that if something makes sense for us, it doesn't matter if it's April, May, June or July, we're going to try to make it happen," he said. "I see a lot of potential in this club as it stands right now. I am thinking along the lines of being ultra-aggressive right now, more than anything. Then again, some things have to play out with other clubs — falling out of contention. It's May. It's not even mid-May yet. A lot of that stuff is going to have to play out before another club would have to be serious." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 That's good. We need another starter, another good LH hitter, a closer, and some more bullpen depth. He needs to be ultra-aggressive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 "I see a lot of potential in this club as it stands right now. I am thinking along the lines of being ultra-aggressive right now, more than anything. I'm not quite sure this is a good thing. KW has misplaced his "aggression" to win on Todd Ritchie and buffet tables in the past. Fact of the matter though is KW can be as aggressive as he wants. Question is will JR allow him to be "ultra-aggressive"? My answer is no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I'm not quite sure this is a good thing. KW has misplaced his "aggression" to win on Todd Ritchie and buffet tables in the past. Fact of the matter though is KW can be as aggressive as he wants. Question is will JR allow him to be "ultra-aggressive"? My answer is no. JR let him be ultra-aggressive last year. Then again, getting Everett, Alomar, Scho, and Sullivan cost us financially as close to the minimum amount we had to pay as possible. We had to pay Everett and Alomar the very minimum(with Texas and New York taking on the rest of their salaries respectively), though I am not sure about Scho or Sulli. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 JR let him be ultra-aggressive last year. Then again, getting Everett, Alomar, Scho, and Sullivan cost us financially as close to the minimum amount we had to pay as possible. We had to pay Everett and Alomar the very minimum(with Texas and New York taking on the rest of their salaries respectively), though I am not sure about Scho or Sulli. You're right. By aggressive though I meant JR actually taking over salary of players worth a damn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 You're right. By aggressive though I meant JR actually taking over salary of players worth a damn. In saying that, you are probably correct. I think the only time JR considers an "aggressive" move is if the Sox only take on say $1-2 mill tops, and KW does a hell of a good job of selling his reason why it will put the Sox over the top. A hell of a good job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I'm not quite sure this is a good thing. KW has misplaced his "aggression" to win on Todd Ritchie and buffet tables in the past. Fact of the matter though is KW can be as aggressive as he wants. Question is will JR allow him to be "ultra-aggressive"? My answer is no. Very good post, Killa. I think at this point Glavine could be an option -- I am not sure what the contract situation is though. Unit will cost too much. Leiter -- something about him that bugs me. Hudson will cost us the farm. Garcia turns his attitude on and off. Once we (hypothetically) get an ace starter, might want to look at a closer and maybe a Palmeiro-type rent-a-hitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I'm not quite sure this is a good thing. KW has misplaced his "aggression" to win on Todd Ritchie and buffet tables in the past. Fact of the matter though is KW can be as aggressive as he wants. Question is will JR allow him to be "ultra-aggressive"? My answer is no. I tend to agree. I don't think JR is going to free the purse strings which means KW is not only going to have to be agressive, but pretty sly and to make a deal he's going ot have to give up some contracts or some damn good playesr to the point the other team eats the contract. Personally I think KW will make a move, the question is can he find a taker for Konerko and can he get a player he wants in return. Imo, Konerko or Lee will be gone by June 1st. Hopefully Uribe, Willie, Joe, and Jose all cream the ball to the point that it will allow the Sox to lose one of those two batters (konerko or lee) cause then they can reup with Maggs and acquire a good player in return. I don't sense any big moves coming though, other then the promotion of Reed and well a few starts from Diaz to see whether he could be the answer at the 5th spot this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Alomar, Sullivan, Everett was "agressive" deal-making??!! Not only were the moves made a few weeks too late, but they cost NOTHING money-wise and the prospects -- let's just say we ain't exactly missing Ring and Webster.... No, it was very JR-ish -- pay lip service to great future, making self-aggrandizing statments, etc while getting it done at the cheapest possibly price. Now aggressive would have been getting Shilling or something along those lines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Bartolo Colon was agressive deal making. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Very good post, Killa. I think at this point Glavine could be an option -- I am not sure what the contract situation is though. Unit will cost too much. Leiter -- something about him that bugs me. Hudson will cost us the farm. Garcia turns his attitude on and off. Once we (hypothetically) get an ace starter, might want to look at a closer and maybe a Palmeiro-type rent-a-hitter. IIRC, Glavine signed a 3-year $36 mill deal with New York prior to last year. The Mets would have to take on a s***load of his salary. Hold on, I'll check his salary... EDIT: Here you go, Glavine's contract. 3-years, $35 mill. So I was one off. Sue me. Tom Glavine LHP NYM Signed Dec 2002 - 3 years/$35M 2003: $11.0M 2004: $10.5M 2005: $10.5M 2006: Mutual option $6.5M or $3.0M buyout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 IIRC, Glavine signed a 3-year $36 mill deal with New York prior to last year. The Mets would have to take on a s***load of his salary. Hold on, I'll check his salary... EDIT: Here you go, Glavine's contract. 3-years, $35 mill. So I was one off. Sue me. Tom Glavine LHP NYM Signed Dec 2002 - 3 years/$35M 2003: $11.0M 2004: $10.5M 2005: $10.5M 2006: Mutual option $6.5M or $3.0M buyout Glavine pitched 7 and 2/3rd's shutout innings against the D-Backs today, he's 5-2 now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I think if the Sox are going to acquire a pitcher, its going to be someone with a year left on a deal or an affordable contract. While that means the Sox may have to give up a little more, it also means they don't take on a horrible contract. At least a few of the players whose names are being mentioned have awful contracts, in particular Glavine, Johnson and Griffey. If the Sox are going to get a player, get a guy thats in his prime or near it and even if it means you have to give up an extra prospect or two, then at least you know your getting a guy that won't handcuff the franchise a year or two don the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Glavine has pitched good though, although if the Mets picked up his contract to the point that he would cost about 5 mill a year each year, then maybe that would be the type of guy JR would pony up a little extra dough on. Although I don't know whether Tom could still put fans in the seats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Bartolo Colon was agressive deal making. You're right. But at some point it was clear the move was not working -- Phatolo had a 4.30 ERA on July 20th despite pitching through an easy 1st half schedule, so the TRUE aggressive thing would have been to get another pitcher for maybe 5-6 mill (prorated) and prospects -- didn't have to be Shilling. That would have bumped Loaiza to #2, Colon - 3, Burhle 4, Judy- 5 and Porzio out of the rotation.....We could have won the Series with that. I think after 86 years, this franchise owes itself at least that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Still, I can't knock the move. The intent of that move as well as the David Wells move was to put the Sox over the top. To this day, I still don't know how the Sox failed to make the playoffs. That was the best team I've seen the Sox have since 1994. But I'm going to try and not talk about last years squad. Ritchie was also Kw's idea of agressive deal making, it was just an awful type of agressive, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 But I'm going to try and not talk about last years squad. See I always hear this and wonder...well, why not? History repeats itself (esp with this team) and it's important to understand past (wells, foulke, Konerko, etc) mistakes and disappoinments, I feel. How else is one supposed to evaluate KW as a GM? A homer shouldn't revisit the past, but serious baseball fan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Glavine has pitched good though, although if the Mets picked up his contract to the point that he would cost about 5 mill a year each year, then maybe that would be the type of guy JR would pony up a little extra dough on. Although I don't know whether Tom could still put fans in the seats. Trading off Koch and/or Konerko in a deal for Glavine should put him in a "net $5million" catagory, depending on specifics of the deal. Whether he puts butts in the seats is not the main concern here. Glavine would qualify as an ace that has had post season success and is not the usual washed up variety of big name players the Sox have historically acquired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Trading off Koch and/or Konerko in a deal for Glavine should put him in a "net $5million" catagory, depending on specifics of the deal. Whether he puts butts in the seats is not the main concern here. Glavine would qualify as an ace that has had post season success and is not the usual washed up variety of big name players the Sox have historically acquired. I'm not sure if the Mets would take Konerko, they've got Piazza to rotate b/w catcher and first base, although Konerko could get sum reps at 1st. Carlos Lee could definitely be an option IF he or Floyd could play right field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Found this lil tidbit on Glavine FWIW, I don't know how Tom Glavine is doing it. He's getting close to Jamie Moyer status, throwing 83-84 mph and topping out at 86. He's adding and subtracting off his two-seam (sinking) fastball, but he's throwing only fastballs and changeups, no breaking pitches. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Found this lil tidbit on Glavine FWIW, I don't know how Tom Glavine is doing it. He's getting close to Jamie Moyer status, throwing 83-84 mph and topping out at 86. He's adding and subtracting off his two-seam (sinking) fastball, but he's throwing only fastballs and changeups, no breaking pitches. ... Maybe he's closer to being washed up than I was aware. I haven't seen him pitch this year. I mean, who watches the Mets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilJester99 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I am hoping KW goes for Freddie Garcia...how many times do they have to sign an aging player and then find out he isn't the player he once was and now are stuck with him?? No more old and overpaid players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 Check out Ledewski's column in the Southtown today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilJester99 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 I would be totally excited if the Sox could find a way to get Mulder. Holy s*** that would be awesome. It also doesn't hurt he is a Chicago area guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilJester99 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 More columns by Paul Ladewski Lefty Mulder would be right fit for Sox Thursday, May 13, 2004 Here it is mid-May, and the White Sox are off to an 18-13 start. Began Wednesday tied for first place in the AL Central Division. Best record in town. Not bad for a team with a puny $60 million payroll, huh? Yeah, not bad. But not good enough, either. The Sox need to think bigger, try harder, do better. Pedal to the metal? No, they need to go pedal through the floorboard before the July 31 trade deadline. And nobody knows it more than Ken Williams, their general manager. Face it. If the Sox are to become a major player in the high-stakes game known as Major League Baseball, there has to be a sizable increase in season-ticket sales in the months ahead. Sure, the higher-ups were tickled green to see nearly 9,000 walk-ups on hand for Tuesday night's series opener against the Baltimore Orioles, but those people can't be counted on night after night, season after season. No, the Sox need a greater commitment from their fans, and the only way to get it is to give them a playoff team in return. "We have to go for it all, and anybody who knows me understands that we will," K-Will said on a rainy Wednesday at The Cell. "I hear people say that such and such move can't be made. My response to that is, 'Why can't it be made?' That doesn't mean it will get done, but you can try like heck to make it happen." Hello, operator? The Oakland Athletics please. If the Sox have an apparent need at this point, it's a horse to anchor the rotation. On a given day, Esteban Loaiza or Mark Buehrle each has shown he can be The Guy, but the fact remains they have all of two postseason appearances between them. Fast-forward to October. Would you feel comfortable with Loaiza vs. Pedro Martinez and Buehrle vs. Curt Schilling in the first two games against the Boston Red Sox? Or Loaiza vs. Kevin Brown and Buehrle vs. Mike Mussina against the New York Yankee$? If any team has quality starters to offer, it's the A's. General manager Billy Beane, ol' Mr. Moneyball himself, has been reluctant to part with Tim Hudson, Mark Mulder and Barry Zito in the past, but times are different now. The departure of shortstop Miguel Tejada left an XL-size hole in their lineup, and if the third-place A's don't fill it soon, then "Moneyball" will have a sequel. "Moneybull," they'll call it. Think the A's would maim to get Magglio Ordonez in their lineup? Think the Sox would be disappointed to have a playoff-hardened pitcher such as Mulder at the front end of their rotation? Forget Randy Johnson and the $33 million he will be paid this year and next. And never mind Freddy Garcia, who ain't what he used to be. A native of South Holland, where he starred at Thornwood High School, the 26-year-old Mulder would be a more effective, less costly fit here. He has a $4.45 million salary and is signed through next season. When I spoke with Mulder at the All-Star Game last summer, he sounded like a guy whose head was in the Bay Area but whose heart was still on the South Side, where he and his buddies spent many a night at The Cell. "I had a great time here whether I sat in the bleachers or got tickets behind the dugout from friends," Mulder said at the time. "Actually, my most enjoyable times where in left field. There are great seats out there. There really are." Mulder is no stranger to the playoffs, where he has a 2-2 record and 2.25 ERA to show for four games. Better yet, he is left-handed, which is no small consideration in the Central race. The Minnesota Twins are toast against southpaws. Add Mulder to Buehrle and Scott Schoeneweis, and the Sox could throw three of them in a given series. Modern-day Branch Rickey that he is, Beane dissed Williams in "Moneyball," but the words didn't prevent trade talks between the two after the fact. "We acquired Jon Adkins, Neal Cotts and Miguel Olivo from them," Williams reminded. "Why wouldn't I talk with them?" If the Sox agree to pay a chunk of the salary difference — Ordonez will be paid $14 million this season — the deal is a doable one. As good as Ordonez may be, it doesn't make dollars or sense for the Sox to make a five-year, $70 million commitment to him. Pure and simple, he doesn't attract enough fans to the ballpark to merit superstar money. Keep Ordonez and they probably lose him if — when? — another team blows him away with an offer like the Anaheim Angels did to Bartolo Colon last winter. Would the 30-year-old Ordonez be missed here? Of course. Ohh-eee-ohh Maaag-lio rates as one of the most consistent all-around hitters in the game. Still, I'm not so sure Ordonez is as irreplaceable as some people think. Even without him, the Sox still have five potential 20-home run hitters. Who's to say that Carlos Lee can't put up Ordonez-like numbers in the No. 3 hole — and steal 20-plus bases to boot? Oh, and after Williams acquires Mulder or a reasonable facsimile, then he can pry center fielder Carlos Beltran away from the Kansas City Royals. "I won't rule out anything," Williams said. "If our fans can dream it, then I can dream it." Bet Ken Williams dreams a lot these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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