aboz56 Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 He's been hitting well since he's been back from the back problems, if he can put together a nice little streak, he could get the call to play center at some point this year if our current options don't pick up the pace...I am going to go out on a limb here and say that Joe is on the verge of getting hot and battling for a promotion. A lot of you have written him off, but let's remember he is still 25 and has all of the tools to become a stud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MnSoxFan Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 Not a centerfielder, and I would not get your hopes up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 18, 2004 Author Share Posted May 18, 2004 Not a centerfielder, and I would not get your hopes up. I know his make-up, he's not a quitter and he's not going to go out without one last stand... Borch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 Alex, i admire your optimism. I'm still seeing that low batting average and low OBP, after three years in AAA. He is so intense, he's got the same "condition" that Konerko has. There is such a thing as being too intense on the baseball field. When you did your interview with him, one thing that stuck in my mind is how he really seems tired of people telling him he needs to relax. He agreed with you that he's an intense and competitive guy - and he's got all these people in his ear about chilling out. Thing is, all that intensity hasn't brought him results. He's regressed and while it's possible the light bulb may suddenly go on, and I hope it does, I'm not counting on it. I hope he proves me wrong. But when I look at the Sox' problems, I see a lot of swing and miss guys. Guys who aren't good situational hitters or get on base more. Everyone seems to agree that Joe does not have the range to be a major league CF, and that he's better suited to LF or RF. I don't see how he'd be an improvement over Carlos Lee, even as poorly as Lee has hit in '04. Even if Maggs leaves, I do not see the Sox penciling Joe B. in to RF. My guess is, the Sox are hoping he forces them into a decision one way or the other. I would imagine his trade value is minimal - unless there is some other team scouting him who feels they can change a little thing or two to make him productive. Part of his intensity problem is this - he is so anxious (intense?) to produce, he swings at stuff out of the strike zone. Major league pitchers will eat him up. He needs to string two really good months in a row down at Charlotte, get his confidence going in the right direction, and hopefully force the Sox to make room for him. I wish I could say differently, but I just don't see it happening for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 18, 2004 Author Share Posted May 18, 2004 Thanks for your insight Jim, as always very appreciated and respected...You're one of the people I love talking baseball with here because you offer a great opinion and always have something intelligent to say.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 I gave Borchard another chance this season, but he has failed so far. I thought he would do it. As they say, 'fool me once, shame on you. Fool my twice, shame on me.' I really think that even if he makes it he will be like the rest of the guys on the Sox that are inconsistent power hitters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 I don't see how he'd be an improvement over Carlos Lee, even as poorly as Lee has hit in Improvement #1: Lee's 2004-2005 salary: 15 Mill SlowBattin' Joe: 650 K Improvement #2: Lee: girlie arm SlowBattin' Joe: cannon Having said that, I have nothing but a homer's hope Joe becomes Adam Dunn 2.0. He just doesn't have the eye, hand-eye coordination, batspeed OR confidence in himself to be a star in the majors. Or so it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 I've heard Borchard's arm is overrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 19, 2004 Author Share Posted May 19, 2004 Having said that, I have nothing but a homer's hope Joe becomes Adam Dunn 2.0. He just doesn't have the eye, hand-eye coordination, batspeed OR confidence in himself to be a star in the majors. Or so it seems. After a 15 minute face to face conversation with Borchard's current hitting coach Gregg Ritchie, I can tell you that there is nothing wrong with his hand-eye coordination or bat speed. I am not at liberty to say exactly what he said due to the fact that it was off the record, but those are not issues with Borchard. Once Borchard gets the mental approach, which believe or not is much of what separates many of the AAA guys from the guys who actually make it to the big leagues, he should be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MnSoxFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Borchard does not have a great arm, it is ok, nothing spectacular, I think people think since he was a QB that he has a great arm. Not from what I saw in person last ST, and from what I have read it is not as good as originally touted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 After a 15 minute face to face conversation with Borchard's current hitting coach Gregg Ritchie, I can tell you that there is nothing wrong with his hand-eye coordination or bat speed. I am not at liberty to say exactly what he said due to the fact that it was off the record, but those are not issues with Borchard. Once Borchard gets the mental approach, which believe or not is much of what separates many of the AAA guys from the guys who actually make it to the big leagues, he should be fine. I know what I saw: -Pitch recognition that leaves MUCH to be desired -A slow loopy swing that manages to foul off the ball even when it's on the T Note I said "....to be a superstar" - watch McGwire or Thome hit sometimes and then compare their eye, HEC and batspeed to JoBo's.... And of course psychological aspect is often what separates the ML stars from the mortals. Most people can't even watch the game on TV at crucial moments without choking up, so it takes a special kind of mentality to actually STAND right there in the batter's box with a game on the line... Unfortunately, mental problems are extremely difficult to fix. Just ask Knoblauch and Ankiel, formerly dominant ML'gers who just lost it. Borchard is 26. The odds are very much against him -- and I am one of the few folks who doesn't want him traded, mind you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Borchard does not have a great arm, it is ok, nothing spectacular, I think people think since he was a QB that he has a great arm. Not from what I saw in person last ST, and from what I have read it is not as good as originally touted. When I saw him in the bigs, he was fundamentally flawed -- reads, set-ups on were lousy, didn't put his entire body into the throws, etc But you could also see that his arm was stronger than Rowand's. I figured he'd get a better throwing technique to better utilize that sheer strenght....oh well. It's funny seeing Ichiro and Lew Ford gunning the ball all the way from the fence and Joe is much stronger than either of them, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 19, 2004 Author Share Posted May 19, 2004 Borchard is 26. He is 25, will be 26 in November. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 He is 25, will be 26 in November. Well then it changes everything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 19, 2004 Author Share Posted May 19, 2004 Well then it changes everything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Improvement #1: Lee's 2004-2005 salary: 15 Mill SlowBattin' Joe: 650 K Improvement #2: Lee: girlie arm SlowBattin' Joe: cannon Having said that, I have nothing but a homer's hope Joe becomes Adam Dunn 2.0. He just doesn't have the eye, hand-eye coordination, batspeed OR confidence in himself to be a star in the majors. Or so it seems. Sorry, Improvement #1 is irrelevant if you want to win a World Series - and that is what you've been preaching on these boards, and I happen to agree with your point of view on that. Personnel decisions can not consistently be based on $$. Either a guy can play, or he can't. Lee has proven in the past he can play at this level, Joe has not. Borchard has a better arm than Lee, no doubt. Factoring everything in, he is not a suitable replacement for Lee ... not at this point anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Borchard has a better arm than Lee, no doubt. I have a better arm then Lee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palehosefan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 lol Jason I'm just wondering how he ever played 3B, and Borchards arm isn't as good as originally thought during the draft talk. I watched him play a few games at Stanford and it was apparent to me then that some scouting went awry. I still think he's gonna be a player that everything will finally click when he's about 27 years old and he will be a solid player for some team, alot like Aaron Guiel did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Ya, Borchards arm is overhyped. Its another one of those things where after one or two persons say something about a guy it kind of just clicks. I'm not saying he has a bad arm, but their were some who would of told ya he had one of the best arms in the entire minors (not just the Sox). All I know is Thomas Brice probably has the best outfield arm in the Sox organization, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Sorry, Improvement #1 is irrelevant if you want to win a World Series - and that is what you've been preaching on these boards, and I happen to agree with your point of view on that. Personnel decisions can not consistently be based on $$. Either a guy can play, or he can't. Lee has proven in the past he can play at this level, Joe has not. Borchard has a better arm than Lee, no doubt. Factoring everything in, he is not a suitable replacement for Lee ... not at this point anyway. Improvement #1 is very relevant in a sense that IF Borchard can ever approach Lee's numbers (say, 820 OPS), then the HUGE disparity in salary comes into play. When you're the Yankees, you can afford to grossely overpay for 50 extra OPS points and a weaker throwing arm.....but if you're the Sox, no way. You overpay for guys like Bonds, Pujols, Shilling, Prior, Wood - the post-season difference makers, not talented underachievers like Lee. Obvisouly, the odds are admittedly very much against Slowbattin' Joe ever approaching 820 OPS barrier in the majors, but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 Ya, Borchards arm is overhyped. Its another one of those things where after one or two persons say something about a guy it kind of just clicks. I'm not saying he has a bad arm, but their were some who would of told ya he had one of the best arms in the entire minors (not just the Sox). All I know is Thomas Brice probably has the best outfield arm in the Sox organization, imo. Is it the case of Jobo not being endowed with natural strenght and arm speed or is it the lack of Ichiro-esque throwing fundamentals? If it's the former, then nothing you can do If it's the latter, maybe it can be fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 He has a good arm, just not a great arm in that Vlad sense of the definition. He was hyped as having that arm and all I'm saying is he doesn't have it. Kind of like some of the Sox pitchers were hyped as throwing harder then they ever did. Its not the players falt at all, its just what they are given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted May 20, 2004 Share Posted May 20, 2004 Obvisouly, the odds are admittedly very much against Slowbattin' Joe ever approaching 820 OPS barrier in the majors, but still. So ... it isn't relevant, if we're living in the real world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted May 23, 2004 Author Share Posted May 23, 2004 I remember when this thread was started and it was laughable... No more...Joe Bo is on fire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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