aboz56 Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 I didn't think I was going to have to do this so early in the season, but I have seen enough. Never have I been so pissed off after a Sox victory, but this just about does it for me. Why, Ozwaldo, are you using Meatball throwing Mike Jackson in the 9th inning of ANY GAME? His 8th inning performance was enough for most of us. Are you trying to give the other team momentum heading into the next game? Sure seems like it to me. I could care less what the score of the game is, quit using these guys in the 9th inning. I don't get the idea of only using certain pitchers in certain situations. Is it unreasonable to ask Marte or Shingo to pitch in the 9th inning if the game isn't close? What are you saving these guys for? A rainy day? I suggest you remove your head from wherever it's stuck now and wake up. Learn how to use the bullpen, it may do you some good as the season goes on. (End of rant.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 wow did you overreact and blow this way up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted June 9, 2004 Author Share Posted June 9, 2004 wow did you overreact and blow this way up. Not at all, there is absolutely no reason to make the game close when we are blowing a team out. It happens far too often and I, frankly, am tired of seeing it. This game right here made me think back to the Paniagua game and after that I just got even angrier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Umm.... I'll take the win. Period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomsonmi Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Technically speaking, your closer can't pitch 162 games. I know that's a stretch but it's just a fact. You have to be able to count on the Mike Jackson's to wrap up six run leads. If you have to use your closer to wrap up a game that you lead by six runs then you've got some major problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 At least Politte got the last 3 outs for us. If he can get back to his spring training form, we've got another otpion for this closer by committee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted June 9, 2004 Author Share Posted June 9, 2004 Technically speaking, your closer can't pitch 162 games. I know that's a stretch but it's just a fact. You have to be able to count on the Mike Jackson's to wrap up six run leads. If you have to use your closer to wrap up a game that you lead by six runs then you've got some major problems. Based on tonight's showing, I don't see us counting on Mike Jackson for much except BP fastballs. And you are right, but unless you are winning all 162 games, you wouldn't need a closer to pitch 162 games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striker Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 It was just a matter of time before Jackson got rocked. He's an innings eater. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxin' Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Get the bad stuff out of your system while you can. It's better Jackson giving up 5 runs in a win rather than in a close game where he could cause a loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac9001 Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Ozzie's managing this past week has been rather crappy. But at least he gave up on Koch, so i'll overlook today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Oz is a rook. He'll learn. But then even the great and experienced ones sometimes stumble. I was not a fan of Oz's hiring but so far I am pleased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 I like how with 2 on and no out, he didnt have Marte or Takatsu warming up yet, only Politte. Your closer needs to start tossing in that situation. Bad, bad planning on Ozzie's part. Terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Most of the mistakes, IMHO, are cancelled out by his job of getting this team up for every game and having them play a lot better than last year. But I agree with you in principle - Jackson has been hit-or-miss this year, but after he gave up the homer in the 8th, he clearly didn't have it. But like DBAHO said, if Politte keeps mixing it up with his slider/change/heater, he's going to be as solid as he was for us early on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelasDaddy0427 Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Hey look guys I realize I may be in the minority but the Phillies are a great offensive team. I'm just glad we were able to keep up. Was it stupid to leave Jackson on in the 9th? Yes Would it of made a damn bit of difference? Who knows. Thome is an awsome player and he had an awsome day. We won just be happy and take it. I could see if this was some last place s*** team but be reasonable. Our pitching wasn't Cy Young caliber but at least we won. GO SOX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Ozzie can't use Shingo and Damaso every game. If he does, these guys will be toast by Sept 1, when we really need them for the stretch run. I have no problem with him letting Jackson take some knocks for the team with a big lead. If Politte would have gotten into trouble with the 3 run lead, shingo and Damaso were still both available. cwsox, I was glad to read you are pleased with Ozzie so far. I have wondered what your thinking was on him now that you've seen him in action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevHead0881 Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 When you are up by 6 runs in the ninth, you shouldn't need the closer. Save him for the next game when we are up by 1. Puting and keeping Koch in the other night was a mistake. Trust me, if this game was closer, Ozzie would not have left Jackson out there in the ninth. As you could see, Takatsu was warming up while Politte was out there. It's a bit disturbing that Jackson got pounded and we were unable to keep the huge lead, but I can't blame Ozzie for keeping Jackson out there with a 6 run lead. I mean, if we are afraid to use him with a good lead, then what is the point on having him on the team. Finally, our bullpen has been steady almost all year. I'm don't think a couple bad nights is worth going nuts over. Koch's failure the other night drove me as nuts as the next person. But the good news is, not every team has other closer options. I'm pretty happy with Marte and Mr. Zero as our fallback guys. But, that's just my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomsonmi Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Abe Vigota, Your two cents are right on the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Ozzie can't use Shingo and Damaso every game. If he does, these guys will be toast by Sept 1, when we really need them for the stretch run. I have no problem with him letting Jackson take some knocks for the team with a big lead. If Politte would have gotten into trouble with the 3 run lead, shingo and Damaso were still both available. cwsox, I was glad to read you are pleased with Ozzie so far. I have wondered what your thinking was on him now that you've seen him in action. When it becomes a 3 run lead in the 9th with no outs, that's a SAVE situation. It's time for Shingo or Marte, we had an off day yesterday so i don't know where this pitch them every day stuff comes from. He didn't plan that very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 When it becomes a 3 run lead in the 9th with no outs, that's a SAVE situation. It's time for Shingo or Marte, we had an off day yesterday so i don't know where this pitch them every day stuff comes from. He didn't plan that very well. Politte got the job done. Shingo and Marte were available. What's the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 If they were available, why didn't they enter instead of Politte? Because Ozzie didn't think that far ahead, and they weren't warming up. Takatsu warmed up after Politte got in the game. By the time he got in there, the tying run could have been at the plate. A closer should have been throwing with 2 on, no out, 6 run lead because a dong (which happened) makes it a 3 run lead. Unless Politte is Ozzie's closer, i don't think he thought far enough ahead. If Politte comes in and gives up some damage like he has all year, this place would be going nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 If they were available, why didn't they enter instead of Politte? Because Ozzie didn't think that far ahead, and they weren't warming up. Takatsu warmed up after Politte got in the game. By the time he got in there, the tying run could have been at the plate. A closer should have been throwing with 2 on, no out, 6 run lead because a dong (which happened) makes it a 3 run lead. Unless Politte is Ozzie's closer, i don't think he thought far enough ahead. If Politte comes in and gives up some damage like he has all year, this place would be going nuts. I guess we'll just have to disagree on this one. I try to look at the big picture. How things have to play out over the course of a season, not just today's game. I have witnessed a baseball season or two in my time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 I guess we'll just have to disagree on this one. I try to look at the big picture. How things have to play out over the course of a season, not just today's game. I have witnessed a baseball season or two in my time. Oh, and i haven't? What are you trying to prove. Neither threw yesterday, there was a SAVE situation today, and Politte enters? Come on already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Oh, and i haven't? What are you trying to prove. Neither threw yesterday, there was a SAVE situation today, and Politte enters? Come on already. Chill out, man. I'm not trying to prove anything. We disagree. Let it go. No hard feelings. Cool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 Oh, and i haven't? What are you trying to prove. Neither threw yesterday, there was a SAVE situation today, and Politte enters? Come on already. Pitchers have to properly warm up to some in and be effective. Niether marte nor Shingo were before the game became a save situation. There's your answer. There's no reason the game should have ever gotten to that point. But you don't need to burn your best relievers to get 3 outs while up six runs. If politte had let a couple reach base, Marte or Shingo would have been called on as soon as they were ready. I suspect that Ozzie would have made a mound visit to stall for time if one batter was able to reach. This is a total non-issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted June 9, 2004 Share Posted June 9, 2004 I didn't think I was going to have to do this so early in the season, but I have seen enough. Never have I been so pissed off after a Sox victory, but this just about does it for me. Why, Ozwaldo, are you using Meatball throwing Mike Jackson in the 9th inning of ANY GAME? His 8th inning performance was enough for most of us. Are you trying to give the other team momentum heading into the next game? Sure seems like it to me. I could care less what the score of the game is, quit using these guys in the 9th inning. I don't get the idea of only using certain pitchers in certain situations. Is it unreasonable to ask Marte or Shingo to pitch in the 9th inning if the game isn't close? What are you saving these guys for? A rainy day? I suggest you remove your head from wherever it's stuck now and wake up. Learn how to use the bullpen, it may do you some good as the season goes on. (End of rant.) My big beef with Oz was sticking with Botch for as long as he did. He learned from his mistake though & now Botch is down in the basement washing jock straps where he belongs. If a pitcher goes out there and has 1 bad outing you can chalk it up to having a bad day. He has 2 bad outings in a row he has a problem 3 Bad outings in a row and something needs to be done with the guy. After 3 bad outings in a row its all on the manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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