IlliniKrush Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 I know we've known this for a while, but if anyone had their hopes up, this should shatter them. Friday, June 11, 2004 ESPN.com news services TORONTO -- With the Stanley Cup Finals now securely in the rear-view mirror, the question still remains: will there be NHL hockey next season? Players association head Bob Goodenow says the answer very easily could be no. Goodenow, in Toronto for the NHLPA meetings, said the players remain firmly against a salary cap. The two sides have been at odds for the past 18 months over the issue of a cap. NHL commissioner Gary Bettman and his negotiating team want a hard cap, while the union wants no part of it. Neither side is backing down as of yet. Is a high-stakes game of "chicken" on the horizon? "A salary cap is not going to be part of the plan going forward," Goodenow told Toronto newspapers on Thursday. "That means there won't be a start of the season and there may not be a season [at all] next year. We are not going to do a cap and we are not going to do a percentage of revenues. The owners set the scale of salaries for the players and that is the marketplace. It has always been that way for the past 75 years or so and that is the way we are going to go forward with it." There are no meetings planned between the NHL and players. "I'm optimistic we'll be able to get something done ... I'm an optimistic person," NHLPA president Trevor Linden told reporters. "I can't speak for the owners, but we're going to work hard as a union to try to avoid a lockout. We're going to try to get something done." Avalanche star Joe Sakic doesn't expect to have to attend an Avs training camp at the end of the World Cup of Hockey in September. "To me it just looks like Bettman doesn't want to start unless he gets everything he wants," Sakic told reporters. "So I don't expect hockey. We all hope [a new collective bargaining agreement] gets done, but to be realistic, I don't see it happening right now." If the season does not start on time, players certainly have other options. They can go to Europe. Or they can play in the newly formed World Hockey Association. The WHA announced Wednesday that it will begin play on Oct. 29 in at least eight cities. The Lightning's Martin St. Louis, who was awarded the Hart Trophy as the league's MVP on Thursday night, said it would be silly for him not to at least consider the WHA. "Sitting at home or making $5 million, it would be very tempting," St. Louis told The Globe and Mail of Toronto. "Obviously, I have to know where we were at as far as the NHL situation. But to be honest, I really haven't thought about that." WHA teams will have a $15 million salary cap, but a player such as St. Louis could make as much as $5 million as a team's top player. Initially, the WHA said that if a player signs a contract, he would have to play the entire season with his WHA club. But on Wednesday, a WHA official said the league will likely change the bylaw to stipulate two players per team would have the option of returning to the NHL if labor problems are resolved during the season. The new WHA will have franchises in Quebec City, Hamilton, Toronto, Halifax, Detroit, Dallas, Jacksonville and Orlando. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Damn it. Eh, I kinda knew it was going to be this way, but I was really hoping both sides would pull their heads out of their asses in time for next season... How does this affect minor league hockey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 tough talk thats all it is. maybe i read or am understanding it wrong, but i think it's funny that NHL players would consider going to play for the WHA (or whatever it's called) which has a cap but are considering sitting out the NHL season because the owners want a cap... WTF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 This sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 tough talk thats all it is. maybe i read or am understanding it wrong, but i think it's funny that NHL players would consider going to play for the WHA (or whatever it's called) which has a cap but are considering sitting out the NHL season because the owners want a cap... WTF? very true. damn players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 It's not talk. Bank on no season next year Some will play WHA to simply play hockey They aren't going to come back to the NHL if it has a cap of 15 mil, WHA style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 It's not talk. Bank on no season next year Some will play WHA to simply play hockey They aren't going to come back to the NHL if it has a cap of 15 mil, WHA style. WHA is basically a minor league which is why there is a cap - they feel the majors (for lack of a better term) should not have a cap. And as Krush stated, many are thinking about playing there just to get time on the ice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 "To me it just looks like Bettman doesn't want to start unless he gets everything he wants," Sakic told reporters. "So I don't expect hockey. We all hope [a new collective bargaining agreement] gets done, but to be realistic, I don't see it happening right now." Gary Buttman has done more to destroy the game of hockey then any single person in its history. :fyou Buttman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Gary Buttman has done more to destroy the game of hockey then any single person in its history. :fyou Buttman Agreed. Bettman blows. Well - Ruutu - keep your game sharp buddy! At least the World Cup will be on in, I think late August. I'll be cheering for the US and Finland. ESPN and ESPN 2 will have the games... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Goodenow said: "The owners set the scale of salaries for the players and that is the marketplace. It has always been that way for the past 75 years or so and that is the way we are going to go forward with it." Yet, if the owners tried to RE-SET the scale and set the marketplace, THAT would be called collusion. I stick by my basic premise that the NHL AND its players have to stop thinking that they are one of the "four major sports". If there are four major sports these days, they would be: Football COLLEGE football Basketball Baseball Hockey is a niche sport, and a regional one at that. It draws numbers similar to the World Series of Poker, and gets beaten by Cosby re-runs during the playoffs. I absolutely HATE to say it, but if the players union can't come to a compromise based on the premise above, their only North American professional option may be the WHA2 for a LONG time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 How does this affect minor league hockey? It doesnt. The Minor League PA agreed to a labor extension through 2007. The only way the AHL gets affected is by potentially seeing some people who were in the NHL this year who have two way contracts. For example, Ottawa could send Vermette, Volchenckov, Langfeld and Spezza to Binghamton and Florida could send Beaudoin, Weiss, Bouwmeester (i think), Kolnik, and Nedorost to San Antonio b/c they have two way contracts. I dont know who is on two ways throughout the league but most young players on their first contract are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 could we potentially see players like Joe Thornton and Andrew Raycroft playing for Providence, or would that be going against the players union? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 It doesnt. The Minor League PA agreed to a labor extension through 2007. The only way the AHL gets affected is by potentially seeing some people who were in the NHL this year who have two way contracts. For example, Ottawa could send Vermette, Volchenckov, Langfeld and Spezza to Binghamton and Florida could send Beaudoin, Weiss, Bouwmeester (i think), Kolnik, and Nedorost to San Antonio b/c they have two way contracts. I dont know who is on two ways throughout the league but most young players on their first contract are. Good - Brain got that one right. He said it wouldn't, but I didn't know for sure... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confederate_48 Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 No hockey , whats not good about that ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 I have no doubt we have seen the last of hockey for a long time. Being a Blackhawks fan, my biggest regret in that the Wolves play all of the way up in Rosemont, and the Komets are 3 hours away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 could we potentially see players like Joe Thornton and Andrew Raycroft playing for Providence, or would that be going against the players union? Raycroft would probably be in Providence but Toivenen (sp?) is already there so that would be one hell of a combo. I highly doubt Thornton is on a 2-way contract. I bet Bergeron is though. Two way contracts are sigend by young players (usually rookies) who are expected to go through the AHL before the NHL. So players who bypass the AHL probably are under a two way contract however cuz most ofthe time the NHL club assumes they'll start in the 'A'. Being on a two way contract means that the NHL parent club can send them down to their AHL (or lower) team without having them to clear waivers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Raycroft would probably be in Providence but Toivenen (sp?) is already there so that would be one hell of a combo. I highly doubt Thornton is on a 2-way contract. I bet Bergeron is though. Two way contracts are sigend by young players (usually rookies) who are expected to go through the AHL before the NHL. So players who bypass the AHL probably are under a two way contract however cuz most ofthe time the NHL club assumes they'll start in the 'A'. Being on a two way contract means that the NHL parent club can send them down to their AHL (or lower) team without having them to clear waivers. but where would Joe be playing? Im just thinking, maybe these professional guys won't go overseas and they could just play in the "minor now major" league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 they'll play in Europe, WHL or nothing. The ones on two way contracts will play in the AHL (with the exception of a lot of Euros and some extremely good young players) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimpy2121 Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 even the ahl is gonna be f***ed, from what i hear now, any player with contracts with the pro teams cant play on the ahl teams if there is no nhl season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 No hockey , whats not good about that ?? ..... :fyou :headshake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 yea honestly CWS, what a f***in asshole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 The only thing that everyone here who is a hockey fan needs to remember one thing. This is politics. Owners are Dems, Players are Republicans, or vice versa. Now, remember, when it comes to politics, they are going to use the media to spew forth information that they want to get across. The bottom line: don't believe everything you read in the press over the next two months. I know a few NHLPA people. They know what's at stake. I think there will be a lockout, but not as bad as some people think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 No hockey , whats not good about that ?? Hey, thanks for chiming in with all that nothing you just added to the conversation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted June 13, 2004 Share Posted June 13, 2004 even the ahl is gonna be f***ed, from what i hear now, any player with contracts with the pro teams cant play on the ahl teams if there is no nhl season they can if they are on two way contracts. The AHL could only be affected for the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 13, 2004 Share Posted June 13, 2004 The players will play for the highest bidders, whether it's the NHL, WHL, IHL, wherever. I don't think the owners can really withstand a work stoppage. I also do not think they can survive each other. In a choice between two evils, most people choose the evil they know. I'm guessing they drop the puck a week late. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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