Palehosefan Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Anyone else think he's getting a bit nervous? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 He shouldn't be, but there's always gotta be a scapegoat for cheap ass organizations that won't pay to compete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 He shouldn't be, but there's always gotta be a scapegoat for cheap ass organizations that won't pay to compete. I agree he can only do so much with a limited amount of talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 dont start knocking this guy. I think Coop is one helluva pitching coach. No matter what E-Lo and Shoney and anyone else does right now, i dont think it's Coops fault, he's helped them a hell of a lot. Without Coop we were in third last season and would be now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 dont start knocking this guy. I think Coop is one helluva pitching coach. No matter what E-Lo and Shoney and anyone else does right now, i dont think it's Coops fault, he's helped them a hell of a lot. Without Coop we were in third last season and would be now. I am just saying there is not much he can do with that bullpen. :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wedge Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 at some level the accountability has to be on the players on the field... I think Coop's done a great job. Hopefully the pitchers stop slumping soon! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 yeah qwert, i wasnt directing that at you, just more of an overall statement... sorry bout the confusion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palehosefan Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 Something has to change with our starters though, I don't think we have a single starter with an era under 4 now that Loiaza got shelled tonight. Most of Loiaza's pitches are up, and just get smashed, he's given up almost as many homeruns this year as he did all of last year. He still has the same dominant stuff, its just left up way too much. Someone has to be accountable for this teams bad pitching, not saying he's a bad coach, just sometimes players stop listening to the same voice after awhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 buerhle's is under 4 isnt it? Maybe the players just need a freaking wakeup call and better start listening Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palehosefan Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 According to these stats from before tonight, Mark is at 4.07 http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/stats_hi...meSubFrame=2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 The staff has been pretty much brilliant up until the past two weeks. Coop is as safe as any pitching coach in the majors next to Mazilli or whatever his name is in Atlanta. He's done a fabulous job with Elo, Scho, and figured out Garland to a point. Buehrle has been good (once again minus like two starts) and Elo had been pitching great as of late. With what he has, he has done a tremendous job. On a random sidenote, Colon actually pitched fantastic today. His velocity was back up in the 96 MPH range and he dominated the A's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 how long's that gonna last tho? He's still just a Tub O' Goo for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palehosefan Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 I'm alot less optimistic about him than you are Jason, Garland's era is at 4.64 and I don't see much of a difference then of his past 4 years of 1 or 2 good starts and then a horrible start. These guys don't have to be aces to get wins with this offense, but, if we are going to have any chance in the postseason we have to pitch much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 i'll agree with that. But it is still early, lets see where we stand by the ASB before we pass judgements, especially towards coaches. If players arent performing, the first people to blame should be the players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palehosefan Posted June 23, 2004 Author Share Posted June 23, 2004 I agree its too early to make any decisions, but Loiaza has been leaving pitches up all season long, thats gonna have to change. We need him back to last years form. I'm definitely willing to give it more time, just commenting that pitching hasn't been very good yet. But, then again we haven't been on a big hot streak yet either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 I'm alot less optimistic about him than you are Jason, Garland's era is at 4.64 and I don't see much of a difference then of his past 4 years of 1 or 2 good starts and then a horrible start. These guys don't have to be aces to get wins with this offense, but, if we are going to have any chance in the postseason we have to pitch much better. Kenny (read: Jerry) is really trying to f*** all this up. Those cheaporoos don't realize how much better this club would have been if only they had spent just a few Mill more 3 weeks ago - and gotten rid of Koch, that goes without saying. Sox need an ace pitcher -- at the very minimum a #2. It would do wonders as far as improving the rest of the rotation as explained in another thread. And I am not so sure Coop is such a great pitching coach, either. If recent history is any indication (Bevington, Manuel, Ward, Nardi, Kimm, Wavin' Wally, etc), he is just another cheap hire that willl end up hurting this team in the long run. The jury is still out deliberating. Buerhle, Garland, Cotts, Wright and a ton of rookies that have come and gone - what has he done for them that was great? IIRC, Loaiza was a vet who pitched great out of 2003 ST as soon as he arrived, so I am not sure how much credit Coop gets and how much of is the rejuvenated Loaiza actually using his head and giving a damn about the game. Shoenweiss is the only one who's really benefited from his presence from what I've seen, but let's see how Coop is going to get him back on track in the next few weeks. Starting from the Cubs series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Coop's doing the best he can with what he has. Takatsu is the only member of the bullpen who has been "automatic." Let's face facts: Pollite is a journeyman with no control, Marte is still trying to find his old self, Cotts and Adkins are basically rookies, and Koch was the Devil Incarnate. Plus, Scott Schoeneweis is now starting to show why he ended up in Anaheim's bullpen and should be in ours, Garland is as up and down as a playgroud see-saw, and our 5th starter du jour keeps getting their ass handed to them. If Coop had some better pitchers, we would be seeing better results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 And I agree with Brando, we need a real good starting pitcher added to the staff, not some piece of crap "lower tier" guy who just happens to come on the cheap. Attendance is up, and that obviously means profits are up. It's time for Reinsdorf to s*** or get off the pot. It's going to be hard enough to keep the Twins at bay with our 3-5 starters as it is - if we make the playoffs with the starting staff as it is now, we'll be one and done AGAIN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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