calling out Magglio Ordonez

[YASNY]

Yeah - we need a lefty bat.  I like JD Drew a lot.  If Kenny could pull of a deal that would get us JD Drew (probably would have to give up Maggs).  But that's probably a pipe dream...

Yep. It's been that for three years, now. And counting.

[CWSGuy406]

OK, I'm glad I'm providing some comic relief.  We'll see who's right in the end. 

 

It's not losing 4 in a row by itself that bothers me.  It's the Sox track record over the last few years and the continuation of that medocrity this year.  They can't break away from the Twins no matter what they do and the front office is so f***ed up that I can't envision any way they make the right moves to fix it. 

 

Anybody take a look at the way Aaron Miles is playing?  I'm starting to think we should add that to the Ritchie, Foulke and Magglio debacles.

Some of you people and your knee-jerk reactions f***ing piss the hell out of me - seriously. Anahiem is 4+ in the win column, playing without a lot of their better players, and the Cubs were 11+ when we played them. THESE ARE GOOD TEAMS! I'm not saying it's ok to lose to these teams, but it happens; it's a 162 game season, streaks like these happen.

 

I'll get concerned when we lose six or seven in a row, not four. Our offense is struggling, anyone can see that.

 

But s*** man- one wrong pitch is why we lost this game.

 

But go ahead - have that attitude, 'the season is over', blah blah blah. And don't come jumpin back on the wagon once September rolls along...

[CWSGuy406]

Yep.  It's been that for three years, now. And counting. 

Hmm - I just thought of this. Would our organization have the balls to go out and get potential FA after this year, Carlos Delgado? He'd be real nice to sandwich right between Thomas and Maggs. We'd probably have to give up a lot though, which could be a problem...

[Ozzietheairedale]

Some of you people and your knee-jerk reactions f***ing piss the hell out of me - seriously.  Anahiem is 4+ in the win column, playing without a lot of their better players, and the Cubs were 11+ when we played them.  THESE ARE GOOD TEAMS!  I'm not saying it's ok to lose to these teams, but it happens; it's a 162 game season, streaks like these happen.

 

I'll get concerned when we lose six or seven in a row, not four.  Our offense is struggling, anyone can see that. 

 

But s*** man- one wrong pitch is why we lost this game.

 

But go ahead - have that attitude, 'the season is over', blah blah blah.  And don't come jumpin back on the wagon once September rolls along... 

6-4=2.

 

So....2 more games and you're concerned, but it's laughable that I'm concerned at 4. By your logic, how does 2 games in a 162 game season make the difference between laughable and concerned?

 

Huh?

[baggio202]

Some of you people and your knee-jerk reactions f***ing piss the hell out of me - seriously.  Anahiem is 4+ in the win column, playing without a lot of their better players, and the Cubs were 11+ when we played them.  THESE ARE GOOD TEAMS!  I'm not saying it's ok to lose to these teams, but it happens; it's a 162 game season, streaks like these happen.

 

I'll get concerned when we lose six or seven in a row, not four.  Our offense is struggling, anyone can see that. 

 

But s*** man- one wrong pitch is why we lost this game.

 

But go ahead - have that attitude, 'the season is over', blah blah blah.  And don't come jumpin back on the wagon once September rolls along... 

knee jerk reactions???

 

 

this team has underachieved since the end of the '00 season...how is that knee jerk???..and anyone who thinks that everything was manuel's fault and now that ozzie is here everything will be okay is living in a fantasy world..

 

there is a phenominon where when you replace the boss in any work place enviorment , not just sports , there is a short period of time where production improves...all the problems that were there with the old manager/boss are gone and there is no baggage with new guy...but after the honeymoon period all the old bad habits will start to come back if they havent been properly addressed and sometimes even new stuff starts to happen with the new guy in charge..

 

i believe we are at that point with ozzie right now...lately all the bad crap that has plague this team for 3 years now is creeping back into our play...watching "homers" bounce off the wall and getting thrown out at second...unable to to score runners from 2nd with no one out...less and less ozzie ball...stolen bases are down..failed executions...everything that has frustrated us in the past is starting to surface..

 

so now we get to see if ozzieball is for real and if he is a better manager than manuel...how is he gonna handle these little things that are hurting us???...hows he gonna handle all the "posing" on home runs???..i think we are a very key stretch with this team

 

we could bounce back and win 15 of the next 20...but there is an equal chance we could drop 15 of the next 20...the rest of july is so huge for this team ....cause if its the latter KW will dump this team bigtime

[ZoomSlowik]

The Twins had a much easier schedule in the second half last year. We played them early in October, got swept at the dome, and were pretty much done. They played Detroit like 9 times in the last two weeks and won at least 7 of them. They don't get that kind of easy finish this year. Plus, we didn't have Freddy last year, we had that fat toad Colon, who was very inconsistent. We are not dead in the playoffs. Vasquez, Hudson, Mulder, and Schilling will be problems, but we wouldn't face all of them in one series. We might face Schilling twice in a 5 game series, but we also only get Pedro once probably, and he would likely be gone by the 6th no matter how well he is pitching. Then the other two games would likely be against 2 of their other 3 starters, who are god awful. The Yankees have Vasquez who we would also face twice, but Brown is hurting. He was pitching about as well as Buehrle and Loaiza before that. We faced Mussina twice, and he allowed 6 runs in those two starts. Good but not great. Moose's ERA is actually higher than Garland's right now. The rest of the Yankees rotation is junk. As for the A's, Zito and Redman might be able to come up with decent starts, but the A's offense and bullpen are pretty weak. Besides, we have hit some decent pitchers this year. Radke got nailed last time, and he had one of the better ERA's in the AL. Mulder did well, but we would have won if not for Koch. We beat Zambrano with Diaz on the mound. Anything can happen in a short series, so don't claim we are dead before anyone even clinches the playoffs.

[greg775]

Wow, this thread is all over the map.

I'll end it by just saying ... I love Maggs.

We've been treading water without Maggs.

We need Maggs or our lineup is s***.

[baggio202]

The Twins had a much easier schedule in the second half last year. We played them early in October, got swept at the dome, and were pretty much done. They played Detroit like 9 times in the last two weeks and won at least 7 of them. They don't get that kind of easy finish this year. Plus, we didn't have Freddy last year, we had that fat toad Colon, who was very inconsistent. We are not dead in the playoffs. Vasquez, Hudson, Mulder, and Schilling will be problems, but we wouldn't face all of them in one series. We might face Schilling twice in a 5 game series, but we also only get Pedro once probably, and he would likely be gone by the 6th no matter how well he is pitching. Then the other two games would likely be against 2 of their other 3 starters, who are god awful. The Yankees have Vasquez who we would also face twice, but Brown is hurting. He was pitching about as well as Buehrle and Loaiza before that. We faced Mussina twice, and he allowed 6 runs in those two starts. Good but not great. Moose's ERA is actually higher than Garland's right now. The rest of the Yankees rotation is junk. As for the A's, Zito and Redman might be able to come up with decent starts, but the A's offense and bullpen are pretty weak. Besides, we have hit some decent pitchers this year. Radke got nailed last time, and he had one of the better ERA's in the AL. Mulder did well, but we would have won if not for Koch. We beat Zambrano with Diaz on the mound. Anything can happen in a short series, so don't claim we are dead before anyone even clinches the playoffs.

offensively this team is not much different than the '00 team...and pinella showed the world how to beat a power hitting right handed dominated team...all right handed pitching started the three games..after the 6th he turned valentin durham around with a lefty pitcher and then thomas on down faced right handed pitching..i dont believe 3 through 9 faced anything but right handed pitching in that series..

 

basically what pinella said was your top two , valentin and durham will have to beat us before the 6th inning..after that every match up will be in my team's favor..

 

unless we pick up a lefty handed power hitter that could hit 30 homers any playoff team will throw every right handed pitcher they have against us and say valentin better beat us by the 6th inning cause every other pitching match up will favor us

[ZoomSlowik]

Many of these guys weren't even here in 2000. This is a totally different team. History means very little to what is happening this year. We didn't have Garcia the last few years, who is our #1 starter now. We didn't have Shingo, who is our closer, and we did have Koch. Our pitching is a lot better than it was in 2000, it was basically Sirotka having a decent year and a collection of crap, so if we didn't score 4 or 5 runs every game we were in trouble. We've been playing around .500 with during a brutal scheduling stretch without our best hitter. That lefty right switch stuff is a bunch of crap. A lot of right handed guys hit righties better, and a lot of lefty guys hit lefties better. And just because it is righty on righty doesn't mean they have the advantage. I'm amazed at how you are making gross generalizations based on a 3 game stretch 4 years ago. By that same logic you are using, one can argue that the Yankees will forget how to hit in the playoffs and lose to an inferior team. That Yankees team might have even been better than this team. Yes, getting Gordon in the bullpen helped a lot, and Rodriguez and Sheffield have helped the lineup. But Giambi isn't the same without the juice, and their rotation is a lot weaker. Clemens and Pettite were there best starters once the playoffs started, and they are gone. Now you got Vasquez, a guy who has never been close to a playoff game, and Brown, who can never stay healthy. Boston and the Yankees also depend heavily on righthanded powerhitters so I guess by that same logic they are going to suck. If that's the case, the Cubs are screwed.

[SuperSteve]

Many of these guys weren't even here in 2000. This is a totally different team. History means very little to what is happening this year. We didn't have Garcia the last few years, who is our #1 starter now. We didn't have Shingo, who is our closer, and we did have Koch. Our pitching is a lot better than it was in 2000, it was basically Sirotka having a decent year and a collection of crap, so if we didn't score 4 or 5 runs every game we were in trouble. We've been playing around .500 with during a brutal scheduling stretch without our best hitter. By that same logic you are using, one can argue that the Yankees will forget how to hit in the playoffs and lose to an inferior team. That Yankees team might have even been better than this team. Yes, getting Gordon in the bullpen helped a lot, and Rodriguez and Sheffield have helped the lineup. But Giambi isn't the same without the juice, and their rotation is a lot weaker. Clemens and Pettite were there best starters once the playoffs started, and they are gone. Now you got Vasquez, a guy who has never been close to a playoff game, and Brown, who can never stay healthy. Boston and the Yankees also depend heavily on righthanded powerhitters so I guess by that same logic they are going to suck. If that's the case, the Cubs are screwed.

Koch was here in 2000? I think not. Baldwin started out 8-0 too. We started hot, then played .500 the rest of the season.

[ZoomSlowik]

I mentioned Koch for the last few years. If you really think Baldwin is a good pitcher, you need to put the crack pipe down. Parque and Eldred were also key guys, which should show you why we lost. Our pitching was terrible in 2000, that's why we sucked late. This year we've already won a bunch of pitcher's duels, which almost never happened in 2000. Garcia and Buehrle can go out and duel with a lot of guys. Even Garland makes a good start every once in a while. I repeat, with Maggs back, our O will be fine. Replacing someone like Gload or Perez that is basically a .260 hitter with very little chance of getting an extra base hit with a .300 hitter that hits a ton of doubles and 30 homers makes a huge impact. When Maggs was healthy, the other guys weren't really hitting that well. Now that those guys have been doing better, we'll see what happens when you put a guy that can carry a lineup in there.

[YASNY]

Many of these guys weren't even here in 2000. This is a totally different team. History means very little to what is happening this year. We didn't have Garcia the last few years, who is our #1 starter now. We didn't have Shingo, who is our closer, and we did have Koch. Our pitching is a lot better than it was in 2000, it was basically Sirotka having a decent year and a collection of crap, so if we didn't score 4 or 5 runs every game we were in trouble. We've been playing around .500 with during a brutal scheduling stretch without our best hitter. That lefty right switch stuff is a bunch of crap. A lot of right handed guys hit righties better, and a lot of lefty guys hit lefties better. And just because it is righty on righty doesn't mean they have the advantage. I'm amazed at how you are making gross generalizations based on a 3 game stretch 4 years ago. By that same logic you are using, one can argue that the Yankees will forget how to hit in the playoffs and lose to an inferior team. That Yankees team might have even been better than this team. Yes, getting Gordon in the bullpen helped a lot, and Rodriguez and Sheffield have helped the lineup. But Giambi isn't the same without the juice, and their rotation is a lot weaker. Clemens and Pettite were there best starters once the playoffs started, and they are gone. Now you got Vasquez, a guy who has never been close to a playoff game, and Brown, who can never stay healthy. Boston and the Yankees also depend heavily on righthanded powerhitters so I guess by that same logic they are going to suck. If that's the case, the Cubs are screwed.

I don't know about him, but I'm making my "gross generalization" based on 3 games 4 years ago and 2.5 seasons of watching this team since. The team that still has Ordonez, Thomas, Konerko, Lee and Valentin as the heart of the lineup. Things haven't changed all that much.

[Steff]

You think Maggs would be greatful after we MADE him, but I guess he's just another sellout that would prefer to have a few more rooms in his house rather than play for us.

More like hampered him. On the Yankees or Boston Maggs is an All Star every year. Maggs sees the playoffs. Maggs gets endorcements. Maggs is treated like the superstar he will become. He has helped the Sox ten times over.

[greg775]

Steff said:

 

(The Sox) More like hampered him. On the Yankees or Boston Maggs is an All Star every year. Maggs sees the playoffs. Maggs gets endorcements. Maggs is treated like the superstar he will become. He has helped the Sox ten times over.

 

--Way to go, Steff. True love for Maggs. I like it.

[Soxbadger]

Or he goes to Boston or NY and cant handle the pressure, chokes and becomes just another over paid player.

 

When Frank was at his peak, he had no problem getting into All-Star games, winning MVP's and getting endorsements.

 

Sosa seems to have no problem either and he plays in the same city as Maggs.

 

Endorsements are about the players, not the team. If you are good enough, theyll endorse you on the Expos. Maggs has never been a 1 man show, he doesnt bring people to the stadium, he isnt iconic, there is nothing that you can really identify with him and say thats his trademark.

 

SB

[ZoomSlowik]

Maggs doesn't get that many endorsements because he doesn't have a flamboyant personality and his English is kind of weak. And no, baseball won't promote you if you play for the Expos. Vlad has been living in obscurity for a while, rising once a year to appear in the All-Star game as the Expos' lone representive. This year is the first year he has been voted in, so obviously a lot more goes into accolades and recognition than just skill.