Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Flight 93 hijacker: 'Shall we finish it off?' Who actually put United Flight 93 into a death dive, causing it to slam into the Pennsylvania countryside on September 11, 2001, is revealed in the 9/11 commission report released Thursday. The passenger revolt began at 9:57 a.m., nearly 30 minutes after the four terrorists aboard launched their takeover of the Boeing 757 loaded with more than 11,000 gallons of jet fuel. As passengers charged the cockpit door, terrorist hijacker Ziad Jarrah began rolling the plane to the left and right, "attempting to knock the passengers off balance," the 9/11 commission report said. Jarrah told another hijacker in the cockpit to block the door. By 9:59 a.m., Jarrah changed tactics and "pitched the nose of the airplane up and down to disrupt the assault." "The [flight] recorder captured the sounds of loud thumps, crashes, shouts and breaking glass and plates. At 10:00:03 a.m., Jarrah stabilized the airplane," the report says. "Five seconds later, Jarrah asked, 'Is that it? Shall we finish it off?' A hijacker responded, 'No. Not yet. When they all come, we finish it off.' " Jarrah resumed pitching the plane up and down. "In the cockpit. If we don't, we'll die," a passenger is heard saying. "Sixteen seconds later, a passenger yelled, 'Roll it!' " the report says. By 10:01 a.m., Jarrah stopped his violent maneuvers and said, "Allah is the greatest! Allah is the greatest!" According to the report, he then asked another hijacker in the cockpit, "Is that it? I mean, shall we put it down?" "Yes, put it in it, and pull it down," the other responded. The passengers continued with their assault, trying to break through the cockpit door. At 10:02 a.m. and 23 seconds, a hijacker said, "Pull it down! Pull it down!" "The hijackers remained at the controls but must have judged that the passengers were only seconds from overcoming them," the report concludes. "The airplane headed down; the control wheel was turned hard to the right. The airplane rolled onto its back, and one of the hijackers began shouting, 'Allah is the greatest. Allah is the greatest.' "With the sounds of the passenger counter-attack continuing, the aircraft plowed into an empty field in Shanksville, Pennsylvania, at 580 miles per hour, about 20 minutes' flying time from Washington, D.C." More at link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 I believe about 90% that the millitary shot that plane down. After seeing what had happened and still thinking in a pre9-11 mentality that would try to protect the innocent at all costs, I really think they shot down flight 93, and then covered it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreye Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 I believe about 90% that the millitary shot that plane down. After seeing what had happened and still thinking in a pre9-11 mentality that would try to protect the innocent at all costs, I really think they shot down flight 93, and then covered it up. Come on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 I believe about 90% that the millitary shot that plane down. After seeing what had happened and still thinking in a pre9-11 mentality that would try to protect the innocent at all costs, I really think they shot down flight 93, and then covered it up. I'm with you there. It's a great cover story. When I heard how we scrambled fighter planes when that Governor's plane wasn't communicating, I was convinced even more. Even the location was either very lucky or . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Come on! I know, I know. Call me silly-but play along at home. You have just had possibly 10's of thousands of people killed by hijacked planes from an unknown source. You know you have another plane out there (at least) headed to an unknown target. The military has had plenty of time to track down this jet, and there are plenty of reports of military aircraft in the area around the time of the downing of this airliner. Do you let the plane crash somewhere and kill possibly thousands more people? Or do you sacrifice the people on board, for the greater good. In hindsight you definately shoot it down. But you have to think pre9-11 America. I am sure they thought that the idea of shooting innocent Americans out of the sky was so impalatable to the President and company that they could never admit to it-not knowing that it would suddenly become much more acceptible than the alternative. There are just so many wierd happenings surrounding that flight, and this makes total sense. Already the story about how the airliner got downed has completely changed from what they told us. And it isn't like historically this kind of thing hasn't happened before... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 I know, I know. Call me silly-but play along at home. You have just had possibly 10's of thousands of people killed by hijacked planes from an unknown source. You know you have another plane out there (at least) headed to an unknown target. The military has had plenty of time to track down this jet, and there are plenty of reports of military aircraft in the area around the time of the downing of this airliner. Do you let the plane crash somewhere and kill possibly thousands more people? Or do you sacrifice the people on board, for the greater good. In hindsight you definately shoot it down. But you have to think pre9-11 America. I am sure they thought that the idea of shooting innocent Americans out of the sky was so impalatable to the President and company that they could never admit to it-not knowing that it would suddenly become much more acceptible than the alternative. There are just so many wierd happenings surrounding that flight, and this makes total sense. Already the story about how the airliner got downed has completely changed from what they told us. And it isn't like historically this kind of thing hasn't happened before... I'm not a conspiracy buff by any stretch of the imagination. I just look at the map, realize, like everyone else, that this plane was not landing with wheels down at an airport, and believe our government made the decision to shoot it down. They needed a story better than Bush ordered American's killed. They had a ready made hero. If in fact we did shoot down Flight 93, fiction may have done more to help us heal than reality. Imagine if we believed the afternoon of 9/11 that Bush had to order the deaths of innocent Americans. Post 9/11 would have been even bleaker than it already was. It would only have taken one solo pilot in a fighter to bring it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 If this plane was shot down I want that woman.. the "let's roll" guys wife.. to return every single dime she made whoring that man's (supposed) last words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 If this plane was shot down I want that woman.. the "let's roll" guys wife.. to return every single dime she made whoring that man's (supposed) last words. But that's what made the story so great for the US public. We had a hero in all this. We could believe that we could fight back and even win. Without his story, and who knows, both stories may be true. While passengers were attacking the cockpit (sure that's a fun word) a missle was heading their way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 But that's what made the story so great for the US public. We had a hero in all this. We could believe that we could fight back and even win. Without his story, and who knows, both stories may be true. While passengers were attacking the cockpit (sure that's a fun word) a missle was heading their way. Pretty sick, IMO. Nothing "great" about it. BTW.. I don't believe it was shot down. Beamer.. that's her name.. Beamer. :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Pretty sick, IMO. Nothing "great" about it. BTW.. I don't believe it was shot down. Beamer.. that's her name.. Beamer. :puke Proabably has a few Beamers now too... :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Proabably has a few Beamers now too... :puke I'm sure. She is one sick lady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 What's more sick is Bowden used that as FSU's slogan that year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 I have to beleive the "Lets Roll" thing because that guy is like our home town hero in Wheaton. But seriously, I dont think you can rule out the plane being shot down, but I dont know if thats why I beleive. Whether he said it is besides the point.. Her running all over the country claiming he had something to do with saving the plane from crashing into Washington.. which if it was shot down, he didn't, but she (and the operator) definitely would have to be in on the cover-up (if she was still on the phone like she said she was). That's what I have a problem with. I don't doubt the guy, and likely some of the others, wanted badly to do something.. I don't blame him for his wife's whoring ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnB Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 When it first happened, I have to say, I believed the story about the passengers fighting back. But now, when looking back on it, I kinda think it was shot down too. The whole 'lets roll' thing seemed a bit too perfect for the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Whether he said it is besides the point.. Her running all over the country claiming he had something to do with saving the plane from crashing into Washington.. which if it was shot down, he didn't, but she (and the operator) definitely would have to be in on the cover-up (if she was still on the phone like she said she was). That's what I have a problem with. I don't doubt the guy, and likely some of the others, wanted badly to do something.. I don't blame him for his wife's whoring ways. I don't think that is true. Remember who told the widow that her husband was a hero... the same people who would have ordered the plane shot down. I can't see them taking a civilian in on this type of conspiracy. I think she got the info and ran with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 Whose to say both didn't happen? He could have started an attack at the cockpit, but we (through Bush, Military) couldn't wait and see if it was successful and went ahead and shot it down. What I said was great was the effect the story had on the American public. It was large, big, substantial, great in that it gave us hope we could fight back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Whose to say both didn't happen? He could have started an attack at the cockpit, but we (through Bush, Military) couldn't wait and see if it was successful and went ahead and shot it down. What I said was great was the effect the story had on the American public. It was large, big, substantial, great in that it gave us hope we could fight back. If the military shot the plane down then Todd and the others actions didn't save anything. Whether he said it or not is moot. My problem is her saying he (and the others, of which none of those family members whored a book about it) saved whatever the target of that plane was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 For what it's worth, I think the story is true. Totally true. What would you do if you were on the plane, seeing dead crew, knowing of the other three planes - you are dead anyway, why not have your death have meaning. I hope that I would have done the same thing, to give one's death meaning rather than go like a lamb to be slaughtered. In the chaos of that morning there is no way some sort of elaborate make believe story could have happened, nor the elaborate planning of how to shoot down a plane at the exact right place in a vacant field as some of suggested - it just happened, it was just one of those things. And as for "let's roll" - that was the usual phrase of one of the four guys who led the charge - wonder what I would have said. Let's do it, let's go, alright now, something -I might have even said, "here we go White ox" which is a phrase I have been known to utter when confronting a challenge. this story rings very true to me in every way. And on that morning I think America would have welcomed a decisive action, there would be no reason cover up the intentional sooitng down of a 4th plane given what the other 3 had already done. Prior information was that Cheney did not give the shoot down order for aircraft in general until 93 had already crashed. I think a point of what we have learned so far is how unprepared we were for something like this. I think the crew and passengers on 93 were heroes, they wanted meaning to their deaths, and they gave it. I think it went down just as we have head. That is just my opinion, my gut instinct. What would you have done if you were on that plane knowing what they did? I like to think that I, and all of us, would have decided to go down fighting - they were the only passengers on any of the 4 flights that morning who knew what their fate was otherwise, and they gave meaning to their deaths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 If the military shot the plane down then Todd and the others actions didn't save anything. Whether he said it or not is moot. My problem is her saying he (and the others, of which none of those family members whored a book about it) saved whatever the target of that plane was. But what I am saying is that I don't think the government would have told her it was shot down. They told her that Todd was a hero. That's why she believes that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 But what I am saying is that I don't think the government would have told her it was shot down. They told her that Todd was a hero. That's why she believes that. Mike.. she claims to have been on the phone with him. Heard struggles, etc.. If the plane was shot down.. what was she (and the operator who claims to have heard the same things..) hearing..? And I want to state again.. I have no fault in her other then her whoring this terrible tragedy. I'm sure she's a nice lady and a good mom.. but the way she "toured" accross the country was pretty damn sick, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighHeat45 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Here is a pic that im sure everyone has seen but the way it looks it is just a pile of ash. I dont know much about plane crashes but wouldnt you think that if people crashed it into the ground there would be some pieces of the plane laying around, theve never even showed anything like that on tv maybe im wrong i dont know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Here is a pic that im sure everyone has seen but the way it looks it is just a pile of ash. I dont know much about plane crashes but wouldnt you think that if people crashed it into the ground there would be some pieces of the plane laying around maybe im wrong i dont know 580 mph nose dive into the earth... I think it's acceptable that it blew up and burned to ashes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Mike.. she claims to have been on the phone with him. Heard struggles, etc.. If the plane was shot down.. what was she (and the operator who claims to have heard the same things..) hearing..? And I want to state again.. I have no fault in her other then her whoring this terrible tragedy. I'm sure she's a nice lady and a good mom.. but the way she "toured" accross the country was pretty damn sick, IMO. And I don't doubt that happened. I am more talking about the climax part of it. The actual crash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 Mike.. she claims to have been on the phone with him. Heard struggles, etc.. If the plane was shot down.. what was she (and the operator who claims to have heard the same things..) hearing..? And I want to state again.. I have no fault in her other then her whoring this terrible tragedy. I'm sure she's a nice lady and a good mom.. but the way she "toured" accross the country was pretty damn sick, IMO. Steff, I believe there was a struggle, that what they heard was real, they did attack the hijackers and tried to take over the plane. Beemer yelled Let's Roll, and whatever. Before of during that, Bush made a decision that when the plane reached the last uninhabited area on their path it was going to be shot down if it clearly wasn't in "friendly hands". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Steff, I believe there was a struggle, that what they heard was real, they did attack the hijackers and tried to take over the plane. Beemer yelled Let's Roll, and whatever. Before of during that, Bush made a decision that when the plane reached the last uninhabited area on their path it was going to be shot down if it clearly wasn't in "friendly hands". The black box recordings appear to state something different. And with that.. I think I'm done with this conversation. To me the correct answer is "we'll never know the truth". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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