Soxtalk Soundoff: Joe Crede

[DBAHO]

I don't know, guys.  Call it hunch, but I think Crede is jsu having one of the "bad years" like Konerko had last year.  I can't argue the point, nor do I have anything to back it up.  At least with PK, he had shown over the course of a few seasons that he could do the job.  Crede has only shown flashes.  I'd like to give him one more shot at it before we give up on him.

I think most ppl gave Konerko the benefit of the doubt however because he had a proven track record, a really good season the year before. Crede really hasn't done that, and that's why I think a lot of ppl want sum1 else in at third.

[dasox24]

I really think we're fine with Crede at 3B. Unless a trade comes along with him in it that would "blow our socks off," I think Joe should stay at the hot corner. We have enough offense to suffice with him hitting the way he is. Plus, he has shown flashes of briliance on offense, so we all know he has it in him. So, he's had a down year offensely. Who cares? He's is not the reason we're playing bad. If we hadn't lost Frank and Maggs, we'd probably would be doing a lot better as a team (probably in 1st place), and I have a feeling that there'd be a lot less people upset with Crede than there are now. He's been very good defensively, and this team needs as many good defensive players as we can. Joe is one of the few very good defensive players on this team. Money spent of Koskie or Beltran or whoever at 3B would be better spent elsewhere, so a free agent isn't a good solution, imo. Anyway, I think we are and we will be fine with Crede at 3B, and we should be focusing on upgrading positions like relief pitching and finding a leadoff hitter, and guys that play baseball like it should be played.

[SoxAce]

I really think we're fine with Crede at 3B.

Your just saying this cause he's in your sig..

[dasox24]

Your just saying this cause he's in your sig..

So, maybe I'm a little biased. lol

[Palehosefan]

Here are Crede's numbers stacked up to the rest of the AL's 3B getting the most pt this season.

 

Crede/Us .227 16br's 52rbi's .967 fielding percentage

Blaylock/Raners .278 29hr's 91rbi's .959 fielding percentage

A-Rod/Yanks .283 31hr's 76rbi's .965 fielding percentage

Hinske/Blue Jays .254 13hr's 61rbi's .983 fielding percentage

C.Blake/Indians .271 21hr's 65 rbi's .937 fielding percentage

M.Mora/Baltimore .345 22hr's 80rbi's .943 fielding percentage

C. Koskie/Twins .249 22hr's 59rbi's .959 fielding percentage

E. Chavez/A's .282 27hr's 60rbi's .975 fielding percentage

J. Randa/Royals .278 5hr's 40rbi's?? .962 fielding percentage

E. Munson/Tig's .222 17hr's 44rbi's .937 fielding percentage

A. Huff/D'Rays .290 22hr's 82rbi's .938 fielding percentage

B.Mueller/RedSox .289 9hr's 45 rbi's .939 fielding percentage

S.Spiezio/M's .209 10hr's 35 rbi's .964 fielding percentage

C.Figgins/Angels .294 4hr's 46 rbi's .932 fielding percentage

 

Basically from this group Crede is 3rd out of 14 in fielding, and arguably 7th-10th of 14 in hitting.

 

As bad as Crede has been, there is a few guys that have been worse. What conclusion does this give me? Look for a replacement in the offseason, but it will be tough to find a good 3B both defensively and offensively that is available.

[jeremyb]

What conclusion does this give me? Look for a replacement in the offseason, but it will be tough to find a good 3B both defensively and offensively that is available.

Adrian Belte. Star in the making. Get him.

[SoxAce]

Adrian Belte. Star in the making. Get him.

:headshake :sleep

[HighHeat45]

:headshake  :sleep

25 Years old

.342 Average

42 Home Runs (playing home games in Dodger Stadium)

97 RBI's

 

Id say he is a star in the making

[SoxAce]

25 Years old

.342 Average

42 Home Runs (playing home games in Dodger Stadium)

97 RBI's

 

Id say he is a star in the making

2 words: Contract year.

 

Javy Lopez played out of his mind last year in his contract year an got Mega bucks during the offseason. Like qwerty said in a thread before Joe Crede is probably going to be like Beltre. In his contract year, he'll break out mad crazy.

 

I can guarantee you Beltre might have the same homerun power but I doubt you'll ever see too much .300 batting averages in his later career.

[jeremyb]

25 Years old

.342 Average

42 Home Runs (playing home games in Dodger Stadium)

97 RBI's

 

Id say he is a star in the making

Can field a bit too. Or so I hear.

[CSF]

I'd hang on to Crede for another year. Maybe he's the Konerko of 2004, and he has a breakout year in '05. If not, there could always be Josh Fields.

[DBAHO]

Adrian Belte. Star in the making. Get him.

Seattle will make a big bid for him or Troy Glaus this off-season.

[bulokis]

Beltre's stat last couple of years:

G AB H HR RBI TB BB SO OBP SLG AVG

2001 LA 126 475 126 13 60 195 28 82 .310 .411 .265

2002 LA 159 587 151 21 75 250 37 96 .303 .426 .257

2003 LA 158 559 134 23 80 237 37 103 .290 .424 .240

 

Crede's stat last 2 years:

G AB H HR RBI TB BB SO OBP SLG AVG

2001 CWS 17 50 11 0 7 14 3 11 .273 .280 .220

2002 CWS 53 200 57 12 35 103 8 40 .311 .515 .285

2003 CWS 151 536 140 19 75 232 32 75 .308 .433 .261

 

I am not giving up on Crede yet. Yeah he seems to pop out everytime he bats but I still think he can turn it around. Konerko was awful last year so maybe Crede is having the same funk but for the whole year. He plays good defense on the hot corner and all he needs is to improve on his hitting. I hope we keep him next year and hopefully he improves his batting average and OBP.

 

By comparing Beltre's stat to Crede's, it looks the same to me. I remember Beltre was a big under achiever until this year. TBeltre has shown a little bit more HR's but OBP, SLG and AVG seems to be the same. Maybe Crede has a break out season like Beltre is having this year.

[Palehosefan]

Put Crede with whatever trainer Beltre was with this offseason and you could have a good season. Either that or alot of suspicion of steroids. I can guarantee you Crede would hit thos pop flies atleast 10 feet further, atleast.

[qwerty]

If beltre hits better than .280 next year i think i will fall over. Imo there is no doubt that this is a career year for him. Once he gets paid an insane amount of money he will go back to being not all that great.

[Pastime]

When a player's hitting coach openly states that a player doesn't get it, or chooses not to get it, (which Greg Walker has stated about Crede this season more than once), I'm going to put a lot of stock in that opinion, since Walker sees him every day and works with him one-on-one.

 

If I had my way, the 2005 Sox infield would consist of Koskie/3B, Uribe/SS, Harris/2B, and Konerko/1B. I like Bill Mueller a lot too, but he's pretty bad defensively, and his range is not all that good.

 

Uribe has always had great range and great hands, and I believe he learned a lot from this season's month-long slump, and he will make the necessary adjustments to his swing when he needs to in the future.

[beck72]

I think Crede will have a Joe Randa like career. One thing is he'll probably always have a low OBP, in the range of .290-.310. Whether the Sox could live with his streakiness, what he may make up with his power, I don't know. Yet the sox have too many all or nothing hitters which Joe is not likely to change in the next few years if at all.

 

So I would trade Crede for a younger guy who has a decent upside, who also may seem "underachieving" in another teams' eyes, who offers the Sox something different. Nick Johnson comes to mind. He'd offer the Sox high OBP, a LH bat and a great glove.

 

I also would trade Joe if the Sox could get very good talent in return. Having Uribe as an everyday 3B isn't ideal, and I would want a FA like Koskie or Mueller signed to replace Crede.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

For me, you let him finish out the season, there is no real point not to,then when the season is over, you take it from there. Either trade, mabye minors?? Something needs to be done with the situation. The one thing saving Joe right now is the glove, and he isnt GREAT, but a really good  3b.

I think he was hurt by being hyped up like he was the next Robin Ventura or something. He's not too bad defensively but when it comes to hitting he couldn't hold Ventura's jock.

[YASNY]

I think most ppl gave Konerko the benefit of the doubt however because he had a proven track record, a really good season the year before. Crede really hasn't done that, and that's why I think a lot of ppl want sum1 else in at third.

I agree with everything you say here with this exception .... Most people didn't give Konerko the benefit of the doubt. They wanted give him away last off season.

[DBAHO]

I agree with everything you say here with this exception .... Most people didn't give Konerko the benefit of the doubt.  They wanted give him away last off season.

Some people wanted to giv up Paulie simply because of the amount of money he was making, and his 2003 stats certainly didn't warrant that kind of salary. The smart people however, looked at Paulie's hip problem and how that affected him, and saw his 2nd half comeback. Crede doesn't have those type of problems, they're not physical but mental ones. According to Greg Walker he's "uncoachable" and "too stubborn".

[TLAK]

Those are some kick ass statistics, man.  Ya gotta love Frank Thomas.  The man is obviously past his prime, but he still puts up some mind-boggling type stats when healthy.  I'd like to see Frank's career donut %.

Here it is, based on RetroSheet. Frank is an amazing player.

[CubsSuck1]

Crede was always a very highly touteted prospect, and still think he can be a greeta player one day. Maybe this offseason something will get to him and he will come out next year swingin. His defense is very solid, and we need defensive help wherever we can get. He just needs to raise the average 30-40 points and hed be a damn good player.

[POPPY_HIDALGO]

Robin Ventura - Talent = Joe Crede

[Chisoxfn]

Trade Crede and a prospect to Marlins (3-way deal?) for Mota and then go after Beltre as Magglio's replacement. In our park, with Lee and Konerko protecting him, Beltre would put up sick #, with a very good D to boot.

 

That allows you to get rid of Everett and Valentin and not lament over loss of power.

Unfortunately, adding another right handed offensive threat shouldn't be a priority, especially when considering pitching.

 

Having that said, I am an absolutely huge Adrian Beltre fan. He's better defensively then Crede. Adrian has a much strong arm and better range as well as the whole offensive thing. However, Boras is his agent and he's going to get roughly 12 mill a year long term (thats my guess, take it for what its worth).

 

I'd rather see the Sox go cheaper in this department, find a good left handed bat for RF, then insert a good obp guy at ss (speed as well) and maybe even do that at 3b or go with Uribe and find a new platoon guy.

[Chisoxfn]

I think Crede will have a Joe Randa like career. One thing is he'll probably always have a low OBP, in the range of .290-.310. Whether the Sox could live with his streakiness, what he may make up with his power, I don't know. Yet the sox have too many all or nothing hitters which Joe is not likely to change in the next few years if at all.

 

So I would trade Crede for a younger guy who has a decent upside, who also may seem "underachieving" in another teams' eyes, who offers the Sox something different. Nick Johnson comes to mind. He'd offer the Sox high OBP, a LH bat and a great glove.

 

I also would trade Joe if the Sox could get very good talent in return. Having Uribe as an everyday 3B isn't ideal, and I would want a FA like Koskie or Mueller signed to replace Crede.

Now thats a deal I would definately consider, especially if the Sox could find some high value for Konerko. Maybe swap Konerko for a good hitting left handed bat.

 

But in general, what I would do with Crede is swap him for another youngster that could fill a different need for the Sox. I guarantee this much, he'll have value on the market.