Gene Honda Civic Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Excerpt from the Daily Herald: They gone: In example No. 437 of saying the unexpected, Sox manager Ozzie Guillen raised some eyebrows when he was asked about dealing with players who quit on him. The Sox skipper admitted he had had problems with four players this season and that those four are no longer with the team. "They didn't play the way we thought they were going to play or act the way we thought they were going to act," he said. "I come here to build a good organization. A good organization starts with players' attitude. How they carry themselves. To do that, you have to cut people, figure out who's best for here, who's best for where." New guy: The Sox purchased the contract of right-handed relief pitcher Jeff Bajenaru from Class AAA Charlotte. "He's a closer, but we can use him for two innings," manager Ozzie Guillen said. "We just need another body. We used (Jon) Atkins, (Neal) Cotts too many times, especially with (Cliff) Politte not here." Bajenaru, whom Guillen said he would call "Benji" until he learned how to pronounce his name correctly, combined to go 3-2 with a 1.51 ERA and 22 saves in 48 games between Charlotte and Class AA Birmingham. Guys who were "problems"; Loaiza, Olivo, Koch, Rauch? -- Am I reading that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Excerpt from the Daily Herald: Guys who were "problems"; Loaiza, Olivo, Koch, Rauch? -- Am I reading that right? That's definitely an eyebrow raiser. However, I think you got the 4 guys right. Loaiza was said to be lazy. Olivo's play calling wasn't liked by pitchers in the organization. Rauch was Rauch. Koch just didn't get the job done here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Three of them sound right, but can't be Olivo, can it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Three of them sound right, but can't be Olivo, can it? are all those player are the only ones that the sox got rid of? mile jackson, cliff what his name, would you consider wunch in that group? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Estey has to be one of them. Oz wasnt here last season, and mabye Estey was kinda walking around like he was hot s*** with 21 wins under his belt, and Oz didnt like it. Koch, look at the numbers, Im sure he was just fed up. Jackson im not sure about. It would seem like that, but was it Oz or KW that kept him in the pen for so long? I know they said that they wanted that Vet leadership in the clubhouse, but who was saying that? Oz or KW?? And I saw Rauch because of the whole driving off and Oz saying "they have to have good attitudies. I say Koch, Estey, Rauch and the other im not sure about.... Jackson, or Olivo. good reasoning, is there anyone else we are missing, could those be players who is injured as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 are all those player are the only ones that the sox got rid of? mile jackson, cliff what his name, would you consider wunch in that group? My guess would be Elo, Jackson, Rauch and Olivo. Don't forget Thriller was the guy who publically refused to go after Torii Hunter. The other 3's problems are well documented. I haven't heard any peeps about Koch ever being or having any problems in the clubhouse. Yeah he pitched badly, but he always was a great teammate, and knew who to blame for his problems. Also this doesn't bode well at all for Garland and Crede coming back to the southside next year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 I remember someone posting saying they knew somebody who just played golf with Politte and he said Loaiza was an asshole. What about Kelly Wunsch? Did we have any other options when he was sent down back in May? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 My guess would be Elo, Jackson, Rauch and Olivo. Don't forget Thriller was the guy who publically refused to go after Torii Hunter. The other 3's problems are well documented. I haven't heard any peeps about Koch ever being or having any problems in the clubhouse. Yeah he pitched badly, but he always was a great teammate, and knew who to blame for his problems. Also this doesn't bode well at all for Garland and Crede coming back to the southside next year yeah i forgot about jackson. thiller.................. man it took me a while to figure what the hell you were talking about................ man that is way too funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 As I listened to Ozzie's postgame comments last night, he did actually refer to Baj as Benji. It was pretty funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Isn't Baj pronounced "Bow-n-arrow"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 (edited) Isn't Baj pronounced "Bow-n-arrow"? Badge-in-arrow according to Baj himself. I'm thinking the 4 are Wunsch (remember he did pitch with the Sox, and well), Jackson, Loaiza, and Rauch. I don't think Koch ever quit on the team. Edited September 4, 2004 by danman31 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nokona Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 I dont think Kelly has anything to do with this. His velocity just dropped off over ST. Not his fault. Plus, he always seemed like a really great guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 I dont think Kelly has anything to do with this. His velocity just dropped off over ST. Not his fault. Plus, he always seemed like a really great guy. Yeah, but he pitched well in a few innings with the Sox this year. It seems fishy that he pitched well with the Sox yet was not given more of a chance. If I were Kelly, I'd be pissed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted September 4, 2004 Author Share Posted September 4, 2004 Yeah, but he pitched well in a few innings with the Sox this year. It seems fishy that he pitched well with the Sox yet was not given more of a chance. If I were Kelly, I'd be pissed. Kelly maxed out at 82 on the gun when he was here this season... I can't speak for what he was throwing when he was at Charlotte, but he even confessed that he was throwing junk. Plus when he was here, despite his 0.00 ERA, he let 2 of his 3 inheritted runners score, and failed to retire the 1st batter faced in every opportunity. His role on the team was as a LOOGY, and those second two stats are your main job as a LOOGY. He just plain didn't get the job done, I think KW recongnized this and did shop him around, but he was damaged goods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamTell Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Yes well this is a mystery, I think Loaiza is a shoe in for 1 of the 4. It's hard for me to see either Olivo or Koch being in the 4 because all I've heard about Koch was that he was a good teammate and KW said it was one of the hardest things to do in trade Olivo. Jackson might have had some problems with Ozzie, so I guess I'd count him in. We all know about Rauch so I'd bet he's in the 4. Wunch is a possiblilty but only a possiblity. I don't see how there'd be a problem with him but they might have expected him to do a lot better. But maybe he did quit on them earlier this year. And could they possibly mean Ordonez even though he's with the team, he doesn't play anymore and it looks like he won't be playing with the Sox again. I think the 4 are Loaiza, Rauch, Jackson, and Wunsch. I don't think Koch or Olivo could be in it and Maggs is just too far fetched for me. Haha, what about Dan Wright, can't forget about him either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 ok i am going to suggest 2 names, frank and mags. both are not playing with the sox so that qualifies with what was written. big frank and ozzie don't get along, remember when ozzie was first hire and the article that kw mention that he went and talk to frank about ozzie being hired how bout mags and ozzie mentioning in the newspaper about mags and not knowing where he is, on his first injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamTell Posted September 4, 2004 Share Posted September 4, 2004 Yeah I was suspecting Maggs, but I also suspected a lot of other players too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 ok i am going to suggest 2 names, frank and mags. both are not playing with the sox so that qualifies with what was written. big frank and ozzie don't get along, remember when ozzie was first hire and the article that kw mention that he went and talk to frank about ozzie being hired how bout mags and ozzie mentioning in the newspaper about mags and not knowing where he is, on his first injury. You still think there's Frank and Ozzie drama? Did you not see or read anything during spring training? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 You still think there's Frank and Ozzie drama? Did you not see or read anything during spring training? and did you believe in the sox pr spin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 my guesses: Loaiza -- came back out of shape this year and threw meatballs. Olivo -- stupid baserunner and not a great game-caller. Maggs -- Ozzie ripped him after the first injury for not being around the team and disappearing after the coaches showed up early to work with him, remember. Rauch -- for leaving the game early. If he didn't like Mike Jackson, it sure took a helluva long time for him to show it. And he kept giving Koch chances and pumping him up publicly. He was traded because he just didn't perform. Those are my four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 Whoever Ozzie is talking about, he probably has a good read on what a winning team needs. But the guys who the Sox got rid of were by no means the only reason the Sox tanked this year. We've seen the same things from the Sox for years now, and most of the problems rest with guys who have been around a while now. I doubt that the "purging" is done by a long shot. This offseason should be interesting, and clear up suspicions and arguments fans have had about long time players over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 Whoever Ozzie is talking about, he probably has a good read on what a winning team needs. But the guys who the Sox got rid of were by no means the only reason the Sox tanked this year. We've seen the same things from the Sox for years now, and most of the problems rest with guys who have been around a while now. I doubt that the "purging" is done by a long shot. This offseason should be interesting, and clear up suspicions and arguments fans have had about long time players over the years. and for all the praises that was spewed at kw way for knowing talent and all that, he was responsible for acquiring the talent that ozzie was speaking of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 and did you believe in the sox pr spin? Didn't Frank and Ozzie even hug after the first Sox win in 2004? Frank seemed to be having a good year off the field and on it before he got injured. I see no reason Frank would be considered a problem this year. Look at the statistics....we won a lot of games while Frank was here, and not so many with him out of the lineup. I'm sure Ozzie knows this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 and for all the praises that was spewed at kw way for knowing talent and all that, he was responsible for acquiring the talent that ozzie was speaking of. Kw inherited the "core", which has shown is responsible for the Sox not making the playoffs since 2000. KW tried adding to this core, with limited success. Few people would have said to disband the core, but now it's clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 5, 2004 Share Posted September 5, 2004 Didn't Frank and Ozzie even hug after the first Sox win in 2004? Frank seemed to be having a good year off the field and on it before he got injured. I see no reason Frank would be considered a problem this year. Look at the statistics....we won a lot of games while Frank was here, and not so many with him out of the lineup. I'm sure Ozzie knows this. i am not saying that frank is the problem, without knowing who the players are, i would like to keep an open mind. now back to our conversation. do you remember the time when frank refuse to do some drills in spring training several yrs ago??? ozzie took that time to lit into frank and i mean it was a nasty attack. i believe he was in fla at the time. so with all that, are you going to tell me that all is forgiven and all forgotten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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