doubleM23 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Nothing twisted about it....It is reality . You're good buddies the Kurds would slit your throat in about 30 seconds. They do not give a dam about you............ Whether you like it or you do not like it , learn to love it because it is the best thing going. Holy f***ing s*** you're a god damn moron, boy. Apparently you'd slit their throat in 30 seconds, too, so you're just as miserable a waste of human life as you think they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubleM23 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 cw... having been one of the few (if there are any others) of the boards who lived through this the last go around with these people i figured i would toss my two cents in......been there, lived it, done it.....wish it ended with us........but..........since it didnt i have a few points to comment on here..... when these kids-children you are defending are taught from birth to be hostile and hate i have a problem with them....when they tape hand gernades to their bodies to blow up american vehicles containing american soldiers i have a problem with them....when they wave ak-47's in your face at the ripe old age of 10 years old i have a problem with them......i can live with the spitting in your face and the pushing and shoving you get from them when walking down the street... thats easily delt with and non life threatening in my mind..... but when they are taught by their adults to hate and act out in a violent way against americans and all we stand for because we dont believe as they do, i have a problem with that.........i know what your son is going through.. i lived it ..... i wish him a speedy and safe return... the only thing im sorry for..... our president at the time didnt have the balls to get the job done right when we were there the first time around.......i would have to agree with soxfest on his comment........ f*** THEM ALL in that sand box over there..............this could have been over with back in the late 80's and early 90's............ Guns and violence are just as prevelant in America as anywhere else. Maybe we should go kill all the American babies, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zach23 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 The problem is with who is raising them, not the kids themselves. In certain areas of the US things are not all that different here, we just choose to hate and shoot at each other (I lived in one of those neighborhoods until the age of 16). I think that is an excellent point. Why are we so worried about cleaning up someone else's backyard when ours stinks too? There is a lot of talk about stopping terrorism, but what are we doing to stop the terrorism of gangs in our very own country? Before we send more young people to die overseas, why not stop the killing of the innocent young people here on our own soil first? Talk about terrorism, there are young children here in our very own country that can't walk down the street for fear of being killed. Shouldn't we fix this first? Of course, nobody will accept blame or responsibility for any of it. That sadly is the American way now. No matter what happens it is always someone else's fault, movies, t.v., video games, etc. It also makes me laugh how people now flee to the suburbs to "get away from it". So the soultion is just "ignore it and it doesn't exist". In the meantime, beneath the nice quiet suburban blanket, those people's kids are the ones going into the urban areas to buy drugs and actually bringing gangs out to the suburbs with them. Just ignoring it doesn't make it go away. I just don't understand why we have to go and clean up Iraq? To stop more killing here? We already kill enough of our own each year to dwarf the number killed in 9/11. Or is it because we need to save the Iraqi people? Why not save our own from ourselves first? I just pray that everyone over there comes back safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 cwsox i understand you are passionate about this b/c your son is over there and i hope he comes back without a scratch but your argument of "you can't support the war unless you are going to go fight on the front lines" is ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 f*** ALL IRAQ ...they would love nothing more than to see you're as dead. Think before you post, read a newspaper, listen to them talk about USA...........f*** them ALL.................... :fyou Fantastic attitude!! Why don't you think before you speak. You're ignorance is hillarious though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 cwsox i understand you are passionate about this b/c your son is over there and i hope he comes back without a scratch but your argument of "you can't support the war unless you are going to go fight on the front lines" is ridiculous. No it is not. If you believe in something to be ready to risk other people's lives, you must be willing to risk your own. Would Batman sit on the sidelines and yell "go get them" and not act in accordance with what he expected others to do? It is immoral to expect others to die for a cause that you believe in when you risk nothing and expect others to fight for you while you continue your life of safety and leisure and pursuit of fun and your own life. Enlist in the guard. Support doubling all taxes to pay for all of this. Do something that costs you before you expect others to pay the price. And HSC: given we have have American children on these boards who hate and say :fyou them all, maybe people from other countries should come here and kill us because we raise our own to hate? The solution is to show how good and great we can be - that is the surest way to national security. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 That is like me saying, "You can't be against the war unless you are prepared to inconvenience your own life, go down to Washington and burn flags outside the White House. Put your money where your mouth is, if you are so against the war, go get arrested to prove your point." You can have an opinion on something without being gung-ho. I like cereal, I'm not about to go buy a cereal factory and make it myself. People choose to fight in the army, that is their own decision. I commend them for doing so, it's just not something I'm going to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 The analalogy you make does not holld up. To ask someone else to fight and die for you, you best be prepared to share the cost. If you and your buddies get jumped, are you going to run for safety and then stand on the sidelines and tell the others to fight and take all the risks? How much are you prepared to pay for the war that you support? The current federal budget deficit without war costs is $300 billion. To keep this nation from a trillion dollar annual deficit, how much more in taxes will you be happy to pay? How can you say you believe in something and expect to pay no cost? If America is truly threatened in your opinion and you are a patriot, how can you sit and home and worry about where your next beer is coming from and when the next party is? What are you prepared to sacrifice while others in your name make sacrifices? Have you ever gone to a veterans home and thanked the disabled veterans for what they have done? Has any of this cost you anything? Put something out there when you expect others to fight and die on your behalf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 CWSox before you rant about people behind the message board, I am 33 and Served in Gulf WAR I saw 1st hand myself not someone else's account and I am a VETERAN. I was stationed in Kuwait 9 years 91-99, it is great your son is fighting for us but I have already been on the front lines. The women and children were not friendly, just the opposite and as far as commenting, I served , I fought, I can comment because I lived it. You're son is not the first and he will not be the last soldier ever to fight Iraq, before you rant about someone on a message know who you are talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 While I understand what cwsox is saying, it is also ridiculous to say that the only way you can serve your country or be pro-war is to enlist in the Armed Forces. How many soldiers died in the World Trade Center? How many soldiers died trying to save the lives of those trapped in the World Trade Center? Of course, some soldiers died in the attack on the Pentagon but the Pentagon was a military target. The WTC was strictly civilian and was attacked, for the most part, because of what it symbolized. Fact of the matter is, you don't have to be in the US Armed Forces to serve your country or to be pro-war. Are you ready to tell the families of the WTC victims "to put their money where their mouth is" and enlist in the military if they are pro-war? What about the police officers, firefighters, EMS personnel, doctors, and nurses who..... if we are victims of another terrrorist attack today..... will be the first on scene to help the dying and injured at the risk of themselves being the victim of a terrorist's secondary device? Fact of the matter is, during the War on Terrorism, you don't have to enlist in the military to proudly serve your country or to be pro-war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 ok........ now in reply to everyone who had something to say about our own kids.... the big difference here is we put our kids in jail or reform them in some way or another.... those kids over there run rampid on the streets everwhere spewing their hatred......the "good kids" are locked away in their homes with the "good parents" because even they are afraid.....granted our own kids are no angles but we do do something about them.....boot camp, jail, rehab programs ect. ect. ect........those kids over there have no other options nor are they punished but rather praised for spewing their hatred ...................untill you have lived it, its very hard to comment on it...... experience is part of the battle of understanding..........yes their parents are assholes but when these kids grow up the cycle continues.... untill we can nip it in the bud then it will continue and each generation will produce a saddam and a bin laden and God knows what else..............maybe if we educated them? i dont know what the right answer is right now.. but there has to be something done to show these future terriorists that the rest of the world isnt gonna bow down and kiss their asses each time they threaten us......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 The analalogy you make does not holld up. To ask someone else to fight and die for you, you best be prepared to share the cost. If you and your buddies get jumped, are you going to run for safety and then stand on the sidelines and tell the others to fight and take all the risks? How much are you prepared to pay for the war that you support? The current federal budget deficit without war costs is $300 billion. To keep this nation from a trillion dollar annual deficit, how much more in taxes will you be happy to pay? How can you say you believe in something and expect to pay no cost? If America is truly threatened in your opinion and you are a patriot, how can you sit and home and worry about where your next beer is coming from and when the next party is? What are you prepared to sacrifice while others in your name make sacrifices? Have you ever gone to a veterans home and thanked the disabled veterans for what they have done? Has any of this cost you anything? Put something out there when you expect others to fight and die on your behalf. Oh but it does hold up. How much are you prepared to do to try and prevent this war? How much have you done to protest it? Unless you are out there organizing protests and holding signs and marching you are asking other people to fight your battles for you. Other people are fighting your cause, are you sharing the cost? But I do love how you generalize me, because I don't remember saying I was a "patriot", I never said I was worrying about where my next beer was coming from, or when the next party is. Or that I've never talked to veterans. Well f*** you buddy, because you don't know everything. You think I am a war-hawk or something. I don't like war, but I understand why this one is happening, and if it comes to us vs. iraq I'm going with the home team. If that makes me a patriot then so be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 CWSox before you rant about people behind the message board, I am 33 and Served in Gulf WAR I saw 1st hand myself not someone else's account and I am a VETERAN. I was stationed in Kuwait 9 years 91-99, it is great your son is fighting for us but I have already been on the front lines. The women and children were not friendly, just the opposite and as far as commenting, I served , I fought, I can comment because I lived it. You're son is not the first and he will not be the last soldier ever to fight Iraq, before you rant about someone on a message know who you are talking about. Well.. here's my $0.02.. My aunt and uncle are Career Air Force. They were both there for the Gulf War and my uncle (who is now in intelligence) has been over there several dozen times over the past 6 years. He has told us many, many stories about the people there and how a LOT of them hate Saddam more than we do. They are deathly afraid. They want him out. My uncle was told stories, right out of the mouths of the people it happened to, about rapes, beatings, etc.. They are just normal people who are simply afraid for their lives. Yes.. there were people who DO hate the US as well (because it's what they've been "trained" to feel) but they are the minority. You want to lump them all together, and that's your opinion, but to spew your ignorance because of that opinion is pretty disgusting. But hey.. you're entitled to your opinion. Afterall.. they're just like assholes.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 You think I am a war-hawk or something. I don't like war, but I understand why this one is happening, and if it comes to us vs. iraq I'm going with the home team. If that makes me a patriot then so be it. Everybody that supports the President, the troops, and the War on Terrorism has been compared to a drooling, mongoloid warmongerer by the left. Where is it written that those that support the President, the troops, and dealing with those that hijacked and crashed 4 planes on September 11th, carry out suicide bombings, use human beings as bargaining chips in hostage-taking scenarios, etc. love the idea of US, British, Australian, etc. men and women going to war? While Saddam and his regime need to be dealt with, I hate the fact that war is the only way Saddam will allow the WORLD to deal with him. Saddam, afterall, has been so receptive to diplomatic means to disarm peacefully the last 12 years. While I am pro-war, to think that I don't worry about every intangible as a result of war is assinine. Tough times demand tough decisions. Clinton sat around and did nothing after terrorist attacks during his 8 years. After Sept. 11th, the terrorists expected the same song-and-dance that they got from Clinton. "We will bring those parties responsible to justice," Clinton would say. Terrorists and those that harbor them never saw George Bush going after every single last one of them post 09/11. And if the countries that permit terrorist Organizations to train and flourish within their borders don't turn them over to authorities to be dealt with diplomatically, how do the anti-war people suggest we deal with them? Anti-war demonstrators need to realize that there is a specific subset of the World population that only respond to force. Saddam Hussein and his regimes are an example of such subset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 CWSox before you rant about people behind the message board, I am 33 and Served in Gulf WAR I saw 1st hand myself not someone else's account and I am a VETERAN. I was stationed in Kuwait 9 years 91-99, it is great your son is fighting for us but I have already been on the front lines. The women and children were not friendly, just the opposite and as far as commenting, I served , I fought, I can comment because I lived it. You're son is not the first and he will not be the last soldier ever to fight Iraq, before you rant about someone on a message know who you are talking about. Well.. here's my $0.02.. My aunt and uncle are Career Air Force. They were both there for the Gulf War and my uncle (who is now in intelligence) has been over there several dozen times over the past 6 years. He has told us many, many stories about the people there and how a LOT of them hate Saddam more than we do. They are deathly afraid. They want him out. My uncle was told stories, right out of the mouths of the people it happened to, about rapes, beatings, etc.. They are just normal people who are simply afraid for their lives. Yes.. there were people who DO hate the US as well (because it's what they've been "trained" to feel) but they are the minority. You want to lump them all together, and that's your opinion, but to spew your ignorance because of that opinion is pretty disgusting. But hey.. you're entitled to your opinion. Afterall.. they're just like assholes.... steff first off congrats to your aunt and uncle.... i wish them well and a safe and speedy return...... ask your aunt or uncle how many trips to the front lines they took..... ask them how many times they walked downtown on the streets and were kicked, spit upon, had an ak-47 shoved into their face or back..... how many times they were called names, how many american flags they witnessed being burned, how many times garbage was thrown at them...... ask them about the non glamour things that happened to them.....im sure they will out weight the sad stories.....i myself can attest to millions of gallons of spit on my body each and everyday during my tour there as i walked from the base to the barracks....i can attest to having the living s*** scared out of me by a 14 year old kid who stuck a gun in my back on my way back to the base .... and i was walking in a group......and ask anyone who knows me on a personal level here i do not scare easily......ask your aunt and uncle how many friends and peers they lost when their barracks got bombed..... most of those who died in the bombing in saudi had just gotten home from a 12 hour watch and were sleeping......i can attest to it cause i lost a few friends and i would have been one of those lost had i not changed with a partner duty assignments for that particular day......... while im sure your aunt and uncle had some very good experiences there, why not ask one of those who didnt have it so well off.....qute frankly and i mean no disrespect here...but intell. is a desk job with a 9-5 duty day and a cushy apartment building waiting on you when you get home...... its not the front lines and dealing with the bull s*** on a day to day basis............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Steff , i wish you could of been with us when an 11 year old shot and killed a soldier not more than 30 feet from us, I saw it first hand not talked to someone else about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Steff , i wish you could of been with us when an 11 year old shot and killed a soldier not more than 30 feet from us, I saw it first hand not talked to someone else about it. well i dont wish she could have been with me.. i quite frankly dont wish that on anyone..........i will however wish that she could also make room for our experiences in her "mind set" as well as those of her aunts and uncles....... as for your comments killa.. i do agree with you and you put it much better than i ever could.........thanks........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Well f*** you buddy, I just love intelligent discourse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 I fought, I can comment because I lived it. You're son is not the first and he will not be the last soldier ever to fight Iraq, before you rant about someone on a message know who you are talking about. Marine, not soldier. The distinction is important to him! When you use a word like "rant" you lose me. That is a pejorative word. I have not called your posting "ranting." It is when words like that get tossed the ability to dialogue cannot happen. Actually I am pretty much rant free. I am a pacifist. My son is the Marines and that is very fine by me. He does what his conscience tells him is right as I do for myself, and that is all i ever asked of him, to think for himself and make his own decisions as he saw it. Never tried to impsoe my will nor my thoughts on his right to make decisions for his own self. Rant? I think my son would tell you very different. Free exchange of opinions and mutual respect is the way he was raised and we live. The kid is also a Tiger fan. Now that disappoints me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Rant to me is acting like you are talking 17 year old kid in his bedroom, who never been away from home and afraid to fight for my country, you may need to reread you're post again, that is basically 95% of your post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Marine, not soldier. The distinction is important to him! yeah jar heads tend to be particular that way.......my dad was the same... and he couldnt stand the fact i went Air Force instead of Marines.....he calls it being a rebel and taking the easy way out...lol...i call it thinking for myself and getting an education while i see the world at Uncle Sams expense........ both of us are right in our own minds....lol...and when all is said and done we both served in a war... he in vietnam and me in desert storm......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 f*** ALL IRAQ ...they would love nothing more than to see you're as dead. Think before you post, read a newspaper, listen to them talk about USA...........f*** them ALL.................... :fyou now see that is what I would call ranting if I were of such mind to judge other people's posts and whatever I said in response to that I will stand by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Marine, not soldier. The distinction is important to him! yeah jar heads tend to be particular that way.......my dad was the same... and he couldnt stand the fact i went Air Force instead of Marines.....he calls it being a rebel and taking the easy way out...lol...i call it thinking for myself and getting an education while i see the world at Uncle Sams expense........ both of us are right in our own minds....lol...and when all is said and done we both served in a war... he in vietnam and me in desert storm......... I had to keep reminding my grandson that daddy was a MARINE - not to call daddy a soldier - finally sunk in what the difference is, but was very hard to explain to a kid other than Marines play in water more than soldiers do but less that the navy does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Steff , i wish you could of been with us when an 11 year old shot and killed a soldier not more than 30 feet from us, I saw it first hand not talked to someone else about it. I heard those stories as well and no thank you I would not want to be there. I wouldn't last 5 minutes before I'd likely kill myself. I was not trying to claim that the things you said did not happen (and said that in my post) but that there ARE good people there and not ALL of them deserve to die. I was not discounting your experience one bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Steff , i wish you could of been with us when an 11 year old shot and killed a soldier not more than 30 feet from us, I saw it first hand not talked to someone else about it. well i dont wish she could have been with me.. i quite frankly dont wish that on anyone..........i will however wish that she could also make room for our experiences in her "mind set" as well as those of her aunts and uncles....... as for your comments killa.. i do agree with you and you put it much better than i ever could.........thanks........ HSC.. I do know of the bad stuff. I heard about it as well. I was not saying the horrible things did not happen. But when I see a "f the entire country they all deserve to die" comment.. that is BS, and that is what I said. By the way.. my uncles intelligence job is not "9-5 deskwork". He was in Iraq 27 times over the past 6 years. In the desert, on the line many times. He's been "under cover" dealing with many officials of the Iraq g'ment. His life has been in danger many times. In 2000 he was held for 31 days by the Iraq g'ment and came face to face with one of Saddam's sons who kicked him in the face and broke 5 of his teeth out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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